Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017)

j00t said:

I keep seeing how pissed people are that VICE ADMIRAL holdo wasn't telling a newly demoted CAPTAIN poe the plan. She even reminds him that the last act of HER superior was to demote him. He wasn't even allowed on the bridge most of the time...

Do you guys really not understand how military works?

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She didn't say shit even after Poe and co went all mutiny and said "THIS IS WHAT WE ARE DOING TO SAVE EVERYONE WHILE YOU JUST SIT THERE WITH YOUR THUMB UP YOUR ASS!"

She just sat there and said nothing. And after she regained control, again nothing. This wasn't a case of "This is on a need to know basis and you don't need to know" and then Poe went quietly to his bunk. The entirety of those exchanges was done in a way that was only meant to keep the audience in the dark, because it was the only way Rian Johnson knew how to build any kind of suspense. It's terrible story telling. And her plan was fucking stupid too.

"OH my god it's brilliant! They'll definitely not be scanning for anything other than our main ship because reasons!"

Bit of a stretch to call the Resistance a military in the first place. They're about as organized as Antifa, and possibly even less competent.

kegkilla said:

Yes I do. Leadership formulates a strategy, then disseminates that plan to the forces. Do you understand how the military works? Are you under the impression that soldiers are not given an understanding of their objective? When the allies stormed Normandy, do you think one day they were told, "just get in these boats and see what happens." ??

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Okay, let's look at their situation... Holdo was doing... SOMETHING. People on the bridge clearly knew what was going on because no one was surprised when poe barged in on the bridge and figured it out. The bridge crew ALSO defended holdo when poe tried to remove her from command.

Poe is a pilot with no ship. Poe clearly has no tactical thinking skills or his super secret plan might have a better chance.

What would telling poe the plans have served OTHER than alleviating poe's worries? (and the audience's?)

Honestly I was bothered by what was happening because I was SUPPOSED to be bothered by it. Our point of view is poe's.

Soneone said it about 50 pages back, but poe needed to be distrustful in order to send Finn and rose to Canto bight. And we (and Finn, I'd guess) needed to see the casino and how NOBODY CARES about the resistance. They are making money regardless of who's in charge.

The new republic didn't really do anything to help the galaxy. That's why no one came to help at the end and that's why Luke had to make a legendary appearance. People follow legends.

Again it was a little manipulative from a story telling standpoint, but holdo wasn't acting out of character for a high ranking military officer to not tell their plans to the whole force. Remember, the only people who knew how they were being tracked were poe, Finn and rose. THEY were acting more selfishly than anyone else on the ship

Gavinmad said:

Bit of a stretch to call the Resistance a military in the first place. They're about as organized as Antifa, and possibly even less competent.

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And yet they all have military ranks. Hm.

j00t said:

I keep seeing how pissed people are that VICE ADMIRAL holdo wasn't telling a newly demoted CAPTAIN poe the plan. She even reminds him that the last act of HER superior was to demote him. He wasn't even allowed on the bridge most of the time...

Do you guys really not understand how military works?

Click to expand...

pretty sure there is no military chain of command or order in the rebels. i dont think a non military space thief would be trusted with the plans to destroy the death star or allowed to leave with that knowledge.

Chukzombi said:

pretty sure there is no military chain of command or order in the rebels. i dont think a non military space thief would be trusted with the plans to destroy the death star or allowed to leave with that knowledge.

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Yeah, there's clearly a bunch of inconsistencies with their ranking system. If there's no chain of command, why would ANYONE get demoted? On top of that, poe tries to relieve holdo of command. But if there's no chain of command...

It's goofy. Leia tells iden versio in the game that no one gives anyone any orders in the rebellion, but then she gets yelled by telling danger squad what to do. Shriv says, "last I checked I'm still in charge of danger squad" and iden apologizes.

So /shrug

j00t said:

Okay, let's look at their situation... Holdo was doing... SOMETHING. People on the bridge clearly knew what was going on because no one was surprised when poe barged in on the bridge and figured it out. The bridge crew ALSO defended holdo when poe tried to remove her from command.

Poe is a pilot with no ship. Poe clearly has no tactical thinking skills or his super secret plan might have a better chance.

What would telling poe the plans have served OTHER than alleviating poe's worries? (and the audience's?)

Honestly I was bothered by what was happening because I was SUPPOSED to be bothered by it. Our point of view is poe's.

Soneone said it about 50 pages back, but poe needed to be distrustful in order to send Finn and rose to Canto bight. And we (and Finn, I'd guess) needed to see the casino and how NOBODY CARES about the resistance. They are making money regardless of who's in charge.

The new republic didn't really do anything to help the galaxy. That's why no one came to help at the end and that's why Luke had to make a legendary appearance. People follow legends.

Again it was a little manipulative from a story telling standpoint, but holdo wasn't acting out of character for a high ranking military officer to not tell their plans to the whole force. Remember, the only people who knew how they were being tracked were poe, Finn and rose. THEY were acting more selfishly than anyone else on the ship

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considering that there are more people in a Lord Nagafen raid than in the rebellion. i think the pilots sway a little more clout than normal. even pilots are told their objectives. stop defending the indefensible. they have a hippie military structure. there is nothing orderly about it. if they had any structure it wouldnt be a fucking shock when the pink haired cunt was picked as second in command .

kegkilla said:

View attachment 158692

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Sure thing. Leave for what now?

kegkilla said:

Korriban seems like the only appropriate destination for people who defend this filth.

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who said i was defending it? it wasn't a good movie. it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't good either. it had all kinds of pacing issues and the director actively tried to alienate the audience.

that being said... i don't know man... rian johnson was given the middle of a trilogy where people were all up in arms for being formulaic. i think he tried to make a couple of really poignant statements about the universe of star wars at large that i think are interesting. but i also think that disney wouldn't have agreed to any of those statements if they were as blatant as they needed to be to justify the weird story.

last few posts brought back up the idiocy of "the resistance" from TFA. so I went to wookiepidea for a refresher on why the fuck "the resistance" is even a thing. aka, where the fuck is that actual Republic fleet?

Apparently, Mon Motha gets the credit for being the dumbest person in the universe. after the war, put forth "the military disarmament act" to eliminate all military presence in the galaxy, and rely only on legislation to govern. This removed all Rebel/Republic arms, but with no military, had no way to enforce Imperial worlds from rearming and forming the First order.
Leia thought it was stupid and privately funded the Resistance fleet.

Military Disarmament Act

Just a bafflingly stupid move. From a writing point of view, it obviously creates problems, thus more stories.. but god damn, how retarded does that make Mon Mothma?
Even outside the Imperial rearming, Starwars is a universe RIFE with slavery, pirates, privateers, gangs, etc. This universe absolutely needs a strong military to act as the British navy in Pirate waters vs pirate states, or the US naval protecting trade routes.

(ps. THAT is also a movie that could/should be made in the Starwars universe.. Just without han solo...star wars pirate movie.)

But also, should totally have some merchants in the next movie be like, "fuck the republic, and fuck the Resistance. where were you assholes when my ships were being torn apart by Hutt pirates, mandolorians, slavers? no where, with your peace bullshit. The Imperial naval stops slavery, it executes pirates, it protects my crews."

Caliane said:

last few posts brought back up the idiocy of "the resistance" from TFA. so I went to wookiepidea for a refresher on why the fuck "the resistance" is even a thing. aka, where the fuck is that actual Republic fleet?

Apparently, Mon Motha gets the credit for being the dumbest person in the universe. after the war, put forth "the military disarmament act" to eliminate all military presence in the galaxy, and rely only on legislation to govern. This removed all Rebel/Republic arms, but with no military, had no way to enforce Imperial worlds from rearming and forming the First order.
Leia thought it was stupid and privately funded the Resistance fleet.

Just a baffling stupid move. From a writing point of view, it obviously creates problems, thus more stories.. but god damn, how retarded does that make Mon Mothma?
Even outside the Imperial rearming, Starwars is a universe RIFE with slavery, pirates, privateers, gangs, etc. This universe absolutely needs a strong military to act as the British navy in Pirate waters vs pirate states, or the US naval protecting trade routes.

(ps. THAT is also a movie that could/should be made in the Starwars universe.. Just without han solo...star wars pirate movie.)

But also, should totally have some merchants in the next movie be like, "fuck the republic, and fuck the Resistance. where were you assholes when my ships were being torn apart by Hutt pirates, mandolorians, slavers? no where, with your peace bullshit. The Imperial naval stops slavery, it executes pirates, it protects my crews."

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ugh, is that for real? i just took it as no one believed the first order was real until they blew up the senate, at which point there was no one to direct the military and/or the powers left in charge were too afraid to stand up to the first order.

Maybe the new SW stuff is actually a slow burning red pill agenda based on showing how fucking incompetent women are as leaders.

Yes, you're wrong. They jumped to hyperspace in between.

Disney didn't learn a thing from Marvel, didn't pre-plan out the triology and beyond, and didn't have anyone take a basic literature class to point out all of the shitty writing and fix it before it ever got filmed.

They could have gone with the same exact story points but given it to a Marvel movie writer and we might have gotten an 8 without all of the plot holes.