World of Warcraft: Current Year

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swayze22

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It's almost like it's such a fucked up company that the state of California is suing them, after a two year investigation (and one most companies would have agreed to settle w/DFEH to avoid this publicity), including claims from their investigators that:


All the incel mouthbreathing in this thread aside, any plaintiffs attorney worth their salt starts salivating at words like "not kept confidential" and "retaliation." Those are the bedrock of high dollar (successful) harassment suits and will usually result in big money settlements.
you are playing the attorney card? They exist to make money. The colorful verbiage was used for reactions. (you have the state of california and a huge company, easy target so scrape some dollars off)

I'm not saying some sideways inappropriate shit didn't happen but this isn't a secret syndicate of sexual harassment that everyone is conspiring together on. This is a few nerds who are running their mouths.
 
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mkopec

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you are playing the attorney card? They exist to make money. The colorful verbiage was used for reactions.

I'm not saying some sideways inappropriate shit didn't happen but this isn't a secret syndicate of sexual harassment that everyone is conspiring together on. This is a few nerds who are running their mouths.
Yeah I mean when you smell some shit there is usually some piles of shit somewhere, no doubt. But I find 1/2 these twitter stories laughable. Like I said before all they have right now in their 2 yr investigation is a bunch of stories, basically she said. And while hearsay is admitted in court, its not like they have some rock solid proof.
 
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Gavinmad

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It's weird how people are taking everything in that lawsuit as absolute gospel without stopping to remember that it was written by the plaintiffs to sound as bad as possible.
 
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Mist

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It's weird how people are taking everything in that lawsuit as absolute gospel without stopping to remember that it was written by the plaintiffs to sound as bad as possible.
The plaintiff is the State of California, not the women. The case basically accuses them of creating a workplace where harassment was common and went unpunished, and the response from Blizzard has basically been "yeah, but we've changed so much in the past 2 years, we promise!"
 

swayze22

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The plaintiff is the State of California, not the women.
An attorney. The plaintiffs job is to get your jimmies riled up in their suit, because that's THEIR side of the story. and they are representing the party who is seeking damages from the accused. the whole point is to get people like you super emotional.

This is why things are handled in court based on fact and due process, and not based on ignorant people speaking on matters which they have no 1st party information on twitter or a forum. The court of public opinion is typically wrong but no one comes back 6months or 3 years later and brings up the fact they didn't know shit about fuck because they are on to the next gimmick screaming loud about that.
 

Cybsled

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Doesn’t matter if it is the state or a person, plaintiff attorney is going to overstate as much as humanly possible to support their case, just like a defense attorney is going to call everything bullshit to support theirs.
 
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Chris

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It's weird how people are taking everything in that lawsuit as absolute gospel without stopping to remember that it was written by the plaintiffs to sound as bad as possible.
Why are you defending a soulless multinational corporation?

Yes there's some bandwagoning by attention whores here and lurid language in the lawsuit, there always is. Filter that out.

Not a single employee has come out to say that this characterisation of Blizzard is false, other than the Bush admin lawyer who has been there 4 months and was hired specifically for this.

The state of the company and the game shows that there was something deeper going wrong, we thought it was Bobby Kotick but they have been fucking up since before Activision.

It all makes sense.
 
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Gavinmad

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Why are you defending a soulless multinational corporation?

Yes there's some bandwagoning by attention whores here and lurid language in the lawsuit, there always is. Filter that out.

Not a single employee has come out to say that this characterisation of Blizzard is false, other than the Bush admin lawyer who has been there 4 months and was hired specifically for this.

The state of the company and the game shows that there was something deeper going wrong, we thought it was Bobby Kotick but they have been fucking up since before Activision.

It all makes sense.
I'm not defending Blizzard, I'm attacking women.

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mkopec

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The plaintiff is the State of California, not the women. The case basically accuses them of creating a workplace where harassment was common and went unpunished, and the response from Blizzard has basically been "yeah, but we've changed so much in the past 2 years, we promise!"
Also its a company thats trying to sell a goods, games. So yeah they will say shit like "Weve changed we promise" because anything else just makes them look bad. Still whatever they say, the outrage is a monster of its own now, they are already canceled they just dont know it yet. Or maybe they do.
 
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Sieger

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An attorney. The plaintiffs job is to get your jimmies riled up in their suit, because that's THEIR side of the story. and they are representing the party who is seeking damages from the accused. the whole point is to get people like you super emotional.

This is why things are handled in court based on fact and due process, and not based on ignorant people speaking on matters which they have no 1st party information on twitter or a forum. The court of public opinion is typically wrong but no one comes back 6months or 3 years later and brings up the fact they didn't know shit about fuck because they are on to the next gimmick screaming loud about that.
It’d be highly unusual for government attorneys to just make shit up in their filing documents, unlike plaintiffs attorneys they can face serious career consequences for wasting time/taxpayer money on frivolous cases. My experience is that often times government agencies like this will do everything possible to avoid taking suits like this to trial. The only real exceptions are some of the outfits in DoJ and the Southern District of New York, those are typically spearheaded by US Attorneys with big political aspirations.

California DFEH? That isn’t really a job that’s a stepping stone to much, these are bureaucrat lawyers who generally don’t like to litigate if they don’t have to do so.

The big thing to keep in mind is HR exists in companies entirely to protect the company from legal liability. The fact we are even aware of this case, regardless of veracity of any individual allegation, means serious mismanagement occurred in the HR org.
 
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swayze22

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It’d be highly unusual for government attorneys to just make shit up in their filing documents, unlike plaintiffs attorneys they can face serious career consequences for wasting time/taxpayer money on frivolous cases. My experience is that often times government agencies like this will do everything possible to avoid taking suits like this to trial. The only real exceptions are some of the outfits in DoJ and the Southern District of New York, those are typically spearheaded by US Attorneys with big political aspirations.

California DFEH? That isn’t really a job that’s a stepping stone to much, these are bureaucrat lawyers who generally don’t like to litigate if they don’t have to do so.

The big thing to keep in mind is HR exists in companies entirely to protect the company from legal liability. The fact we are even aware of this case, regardless of veracity of any individual allegation, means serious mismanagement occurred in the HR org.
Well I didn't say "make stuff up", I simply said use colorful verbiage to make their filing hit home in a certain way. While I don't have much experience with DFEH I do have experience in CA as a venue itself. Regardless we will see what happens when the parties go through the process, just feels like a lot of trial by twitter right now.

I agree with the other part regarding HR. Especially if it's as numerous/frequent as the outspoken would have us believe. Overall I think there is obviously a bit of both going on here, maybe a couple instances that are seriously actionable if true, but more numerous are the slap on the wrist/message from your boss type of deals. Sounds like more incompetence as opposed to maliciousness IMO
 
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Elidroth

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This feels like the same logic that was used to cover up priests raping kids for like 100 years.

This. A lot of people don't report things for fear of reprisals. It's not supposed to happen, but then neither is sexual assault.
That would have to be one fucked up company if every manager, every senior member, HR department (Im sure as hell Blizz has one) were in on this shit and this poor little snowflake had no one to go to complain about these issues when they were happening.

Its the same fucking story every time, Years later one woman comes forward, then all of a sudden 100 more and their orbiters come forward with some stupid stories that dont even make sense.

It doesn't take the entire company being on-board. It takes the average worker seeing leadership (IE, the people controlling YOUR paycheck) on-board, and people shut up for fear of being fired. The ability to eat, pay rent, pay bills, etc. often wins out over principles.
 
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mkopec

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This. A lot of people don't report things for fear of reprisals. It's not supposed to happen, but then neither is sexual assault.


It doesn't take the entire company being on-board. It takes the average worker seeing leadership (IE, the people controlling YOUR paycheck) on-board, and people shut up for fear of being fired. The ability to eat, pay rent, pay bills, etc. often wins out over principles.
Maybe I would agree with this in the 60s through the 80s? But in the 2000s I call this a bunch of bullshit, sorry.
 

Elidroth

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The man himself said so in chat.

The more I think about this, the more I see it's a pretty weird self-own if true. It's also ENTIRELY possible that once he was done with her, it was easy to shit all over her to make himself look better.
 

Elidroth

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Maybe I would agree with this in the 60s through the 80s? But in the 2000s I call this a bunch of bullshit, sorry.

You're free to your own opinion of course, but having personally seen the vindictive behavior from management when people don't play ball, I disagree.
 

Elidroth

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Where were these edgy assholes when the VG DB needed to be copied and leaked to preserve Brad's vision?

Selfish crooks. Just grabbing ass all day.

I still to this day don't understand the pining for Vanguard to be reborn, and I worked on it for a few years. The end result was a shit game IMO. Yeah, we shipped it, but it wasn't really much fun, and had a METRIC FUCK TON of issues that no hardware in its day could fix.
 

mkopec

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You're free to your own opinion of course, but having personally seen the vindictive behavior from management when people don't play ball, I disagree.
I have also seen vindictive women too. Goes both ways bro. Again, im not in the gaming industry, never been to cali, but thiese are just my opinions. Maybe I have worked in too many professional places in my life to believe such culture existed in one of the biggest gaming companies in the world. But I could be wrong who the fuck knows what was going on there.
 

Elidroth

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Unfortunately people who do this destroy their credibility.

Only to people who victim blame.. Women don't report rape sometimes because of shame. That doesn't ruin their credibility. The same way many women don't report domestic violence. Because they (correctly) believe people won't believe them, which ultimately puts them right back into the same dangerous situation they were trying to leave, except now their abuser has more fuel for the fire that causes the violence.

Look, I'm not saying people NEVER make shit up to further their own agenda, but trying to dismiss people NOT speaking up out of fear is just foolish.. It's WELL documented and happens daily.
 
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