Actually playing Starcraft 2

Zaphid

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The general thread is great for discussing events and general news, but I think one more thread for strategy and ladder stories wouldn't hurt.


Some thoughts on laddering in HotS:

1)Time to redo your hotkeys, any protoss who hotkeys Motherhip core with his army while using Hts or sentries is dumb. You will probably need an extra hotkey or 2, try rebinding control group 9 and 0 to something closer.

2)Ideally you want to tailor your build to the map, which means you need like 3 builds with some wiggle room for more greed.

3)Lategame you need 3-4 robos and stargates for all the tech switches thrown at you. Don't forget air attack upgrades vs mech and in PvZ when you are moving into lategame.

4)There's really no excuse to not have DT shrine in midgame and lategame anymore.

5)Want easy wins in PvP ? DT rush, just don't take ultrafast double gas, standard timing at 15/19 is more than enough. Some people didn't get the memo yet though, so just get forge or robo so you have detection in time when you scout double gas and collect free points.

6)Mine drop comes roughly at 7:30.

7)Hardened shields don't work vs mines, I really hope it's a bug, not a feature.

8)You don't have to FFE every PvZ, double zealot, MsC, and stalker push seems rather decent and you should be able to get a queen kill or force a spine crawler or 2. Be wary of losing the core and speedling counterattack, finish your wall and add a cannon before building the nexus if necessary.

9)Mothership core doesn't outdps building hatchery, but softening it up is sometimes enough if there are DTs coming.

10)If you feel like the zerg doesn't have enough stuff, it's mutas.

11)I don't care if he is pushing you with swarm hosts, it's just delayed mutas.

12)Double stargate phoenix is viable response to Mutas, just make sure you don't lose many probes with stalkers before you have at least 5 out.

13)7gate1/1+mothership core is stupidly strong in PvZ, unless it's one of the big maps ? WW, Akilon. FF off his third, kill it and recall back. Then go for round 2 ! Just don?t do it from FFE, at least not without successful pressure that delazs the zerg.

14)When you push out on Planet S, send a probe the other way around the center, it will save you many basetrades.

15)8gate +1 zealot/archon off 2 base works wonders against any idiot trying to mass VRs on 2 bases, because you can just laugh at them and kill his expansion, sometimes even main. If they wall off their expansion, you are fucked though. Just make sure to have HT or 2 to feedback oracles and sometimes you even get to snipe the MsC before it casts anything.

16)Tempest+HT+Immortal/Cannons/Zealots/Stalkers is viable lategame turtle composition for PvZ, get fancy with oracles for spotting the army and enjoy slowly crushing the zergs' soul. Karma is a bitch!

17)Mass Void Rays are really retarded in PvP, to save yourself from becoming dumb, do the build mentioned above, because colossi are dead and buried.
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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Mines damage is a spell so it doesn't trigger hardened shields. Seems kind of stupid to just walk an Immortal infront of your army and absorb 11 mine shots before death.
 

Zaphid

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No, Immortal, silly. Though sometimes even 6 range units herp derp into the range to get blown up.
 

Noodleface

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What's the Zerg metagame at the moment? I think when games start to get into T2+ I start to get a little lost on what I should be focusing on. I know Brood Lords/Infestors were big in WOL but I'm not sure for HotS.
 

Zaphid

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ZvZ ? Mutas all day every day with some lings to deny expansions when the mutas are out of position. Theoretically you can switch to infestors and kill the whole ball in a few fungals, but it's quite risky, normally it's better to just hope you have bigger ball/better upgrades.

PvZ is weird, it feels like almost anything is viable given you scout enough and take decent engagements, hydras really opened up a lot of space for the zerg. Broodlords are nice, but they get vaporized by tempests, the new ultras rape face on the ground. Swarm hosts are definitely doable, ran into this funky 2 base mass queen/swarm host nydus push, which looked pretty strong if you don't go straight for colo and counterattack. Definitely the most improved matchup, because the zerg needs to get more aggressive now, since it's the protoss who has harder counters.

TvZ no clue, seems like not much has changed, except that hydras are actually viable.
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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TvZ is basically speedling and get OV speed rather quickly so you can see what the Terran is doing. In general you want to take Lair around 7:30-8:00 and once it pops get up Bane speed and a Spire. Make some mutas to pin the Terran down while tossing down a Pit and getting a handful of Infestors. From there the most desirable t3 force is Ling/Infestor/Ultra but you need to be very careful to keep your Infestors alive unlike WoL where you could be a bit careless with them. You won't have enough gas to keep up your Ultra + Bane production if you start headbutting Terran bio.

Obviously that changes if you're going against Mech where you basically go Roach/Hydra/Viper and abuse the fuck out of blinding cloud making Siege Tanks very expensive paper weights.
 

Noodleface

A Mod Real Quick
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I really need to start forcing myself to use the Vipers and even the Swarm Host a bit more, definitely missing out. Maybe I'll use them in some 4v4 where literally nothing matters
 

Noodleface

A Mod Real Quick
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Any tips to raise your APM? I don't mean just spamming shit for the sake of raising APM, but to actually better myself.

Right now I usually average about 130 but if it's a very long game it will go down quite a bit.

I've actually been surprising myself in that mysteriously on one game I just went apeshit and crushed my opponent. Just fucking around in 4v4 I went from Bronze rank 2 to Gold rank 2 in one game as well.
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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Your APM will generally go up naturally once you know what to do in various situations. Unless your brain is lining up tasks faster than your hands can execute there isn't much to improve on outside of playing the game.
 

Zaphid

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Any tips to raise your APM? I don't mean just spamming shit for the sake of raising APM, but to actually better myself.

Right now I usually average about 130 but if it's a very long game it will go down quite a bit.

I've actually been surprising myself in that mysteriously on one game I just went apeshit and crushed my opponent. Just fucking around in 4v4 I went from Bronze rank 2 to Gold rank 2 in one game as well.
If you ever figure anything out, say what worked, because I've been trying to raise mine too. Things that could help:
1)Blizzard APM is bullshit, get SC2 gears for real numbers, I've been getting 200+ from Blizzard, while SC2Gears shows 120, which is what I usually had in WoL.
2)Hotkey everything, you never want to click on stuff
3)Avoid scrolling the screen as much as possible, moving your camera through minimap is generally faster
4)Hotkey your army over multiple hotkeys to avoid 1a syndrome
5)Try playing another race, I have 120 when playing toss, but it mysteriously jumps to 175 when playing zerg and due to all the spam you might carry something over to your original race.
6)Play with more planned out builds, thinking on the fly is good, but it usually comes at the price of speed.

Ultimately it's going to be battle with your own laziness, why bother with more clicking when you can win just fine the way you have been playing until now...
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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I actually saw Last at MLG used a ton of screen scrolling. I was kind of shocked.

Should also note APM and efficiency of motion go hand in hand. Something I'm trying to break myself of is I just hit my CC hotkey to try and return to base. But that breaks when when I have more than one CC. So I just start pecking at the minimap to return to base. Terrible. So now I just try and camera bind f2 to my main for when I need to jump there to add production/depots. It allows me get this task done much quicker to return to doing other things -- which leads to a higher APM.
 

Zaphid

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Hotkeying your first 4-5 bases should be a no-brainer, I threw away the F2 for selecting your army, so I bind those to F2-F5/6, F1 for workers stayed, but I rarely need it though.

The big thing I'm trying to get used to is have to rotate units in hotkeys, basically to adjust my hotkeys before big battle and so on, because having it that way when you are constantly adding units/tech is a pain in the butt. Also focusing more on 200/200 battles, like revelation iwth oracles, properly targetting shit with tempests and so on. I actually found out that I can keep up with stuff using my keyboard, which is possibly why my APM jumps up while playing zerg, but my mouse hand is really slow, might get a lighter mouse in the future.
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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Do you shift units into the hotkeys? Like I keep all my production on 5 so when I add stuff I just select my new stuff and shift+5 to add that production. Same deal with units. If my bio cycle finishes I just box those units and shift+2 them into that hotkey. I generally try to limit the number of things that require active abilities to one per hotkey. So my bio (stim) is on one hotkey then Ghosts are on a completely separate hotkey. My general setup (obv doesn't help Toss) is:

1 CC
2 Bio
3 Ghosts (tvp) Tanks/mines (tvz) -- Early game scout
4 Vikings/Ravens
5 Production
7 Upgrade facilities (ebay+armory sometimes tech lab)
8 Depot production (bound to space)
9 Drops (bound to ~)
0 Drops 2 (bound to mouse4)

I only use 3 camera binds.

F2 main
F3 nat (if I'm 2rax a TvZ this gets bound to their nat)
F4 3rd
 

Zaphid

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Yeah, you totally need to do that. Limiting yourself to single spell per group is pretty much impossible unless you are just doing like zealot/archon or something like that. To give an idea, when I had Colossus/gateway army in PvT, Stalkers got their own group to quickly focus vikings, however if there are HTs and tempests/harass units, there's simply no space. I need warpgates and other production separate though, because I need to quickly to warpgates for chronoboost when I'm doing a timing. That reminds me, I need to start hotkeying my reinforcing pylon...
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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606
I thought generally Toss will camera bind their pylon simply because there aren't enough control groups. Would also make it more efficient since you don't have to double tap to center.

Also it is hard to get your muscle memory down but I think if you hit ctrl then issue a command only the selected group of units follows that command. So like if you had your Zealot/Stalker/Archon on one hotkey and you a-moved with that then tabbed to the Stalkers to blink and did a ctrl+a queue on the vikings only the stalkers would follow that command. It is something I'm trying to get down mainly for TvZ where often times I want my marines to be the only ones kiting backwards against ling/bling and I want my marauders to stay put.
 

Zaphid

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Ithinkit only works due to the attack command following something only a part of your group can do. I might be wrong though and then I just learned something new.

There aren't enough control groups and camera keys by default, at least not without doing the awkward jump with my hand, so I should definitely tinker with my hotkeys a bit more, but I'm too used to what I have right now.