Camelot Unchained MMO

Very true.

Hm I haven't followed the crowfall thread super close but weren't campaigns going to last months at a time? Given my average lifespan for subbing/playing mmos these days is 2-3 months, I don't really consider that the same as an arena game

I was at dragoncon, but missed thecamelotthing due to inebriation and a messed up phone. (phone and calendar kept flipping between central and atlanta time seemingly at random)

I've backed both. In pre-alpha for both. I think they will end up being very different games. The main difference between the two is probably the building element in CU. I've seen some incredible structures built with the very basic tools that have been released in CU. I think this will be a factor when it comes to PvP. You (or your guild) are going to want to protect your house, fort, town ,castle, etc as the resources to rebuild will not be a quick fix.

Also, seems like CU will have a little more PvE elements than Crowfall. There is a dungeon called The Depths that is supposedly going to provide a Darkness Falls like dynamic. Since some of my best times in MMOs took place in DF, I'm ok with that.

Regarding Crowfall, I'm extremely impressed with the state of game this early in development. Anyone can see just by watching what has been officially released that Crowfall actually appears to be further along than CU, out the gates just a few months or so out of Kickstarter. So it remains to be seen if Mark and Company's decision to create their own game engine ends up being the right decision. Being in VA isn't helping Mark in his hunt for programmers. While Artcraft is sitting in the middle of coding mecca and obviously not having any issues putting their game together.

In the end, I think they will both be good PvP centric games. Will be interesting to see which game launches first.

I get the hate for Brad on this board, but not Jacobs. I've got to say he will shoot straight with you if you talk to him, either on forums or directly on the CU board. Personally I think he's a class act. How many Kickstarter devs will refund you in full, without question, if you ask? If you blame him for WAR you don't have the whole story. It's a good one.

If you believe him.

Maric_sl said:

If you blame him for WAR you don't have the whole story. It's a good one.

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For some of us, we have just what he told us. When you put together his stories (from the WAR dev letters and WAR forums) about how much he was in charge and the decisions he made, it sounds like he made a lot of bad ones. After he left the class balance in WAR got a lot better. I'm sure there are some back room stories but if he isn't publishing them then it's hard not to blame him for some of the retarded decisions they made.

I've heard his stories. They sound a lot like excuses and trying to blame other people.

I haven't heard any of the stories. But imo the game failed for the simple reason that it was a 2 faction rvr game. That never works.

People always gravitate to the winning side and without a 3rd faction to act as a check then one faction just hyper dominates by having most of the players. The losing side gets disgusted and either quits / switches factions. The winning side says L2P! while stomping the few players left with a massive zerg. Once that cycle starts, it's the end of any competitive RvR. EVERY 2 faction rvr game has gone down this route.

Other than that WAR was a huge success for me. Since then, no other rvr game has come close to the fun it provided. I played that game a lot longer than any of the current crop. So did my guild, which came over from DAoC. GW2, while fun, is very lame compared to WAR's best moments. WAR, had it's balance issues (bright wizard, etc), but those are true in every game. WAR (and AION) failed because of it's faction problem. There is a reason nobody makes 2 faction RvR games anymore.

I suspect they were also a bit tied up because of the IP. The owners wanted WoW2 and probably handcuffed Jacobs and crew. IP games usually have issues (SWTOR etc).

My biggest issue with the CU team was the amount of whining they did when the Crowfall's KS started up. I was really disappointed on how the CU leadership reacted to Crowfall's KS and success at getting started. It help flame the legion of fanboys that started beating their chests on both sides.

Here was a public reaction? I never noticed, can you go into more detail?

Just across the forums from what I recall

Big deal. Sounds like a salesman.

Can you access that thread for the lulz? Makes sense after a patrol of cu fanboys invaded my YouTube channel when we did a show comparing the two games.

Yeah it looks like there's a dedicated group of people going around negging every Crowfall alpha video they can find. Probably the same guys.

Barab_sl said:

My biggest issue with the CU team was the amount of whining they did when the Crowfall's KS started up. I was really disappointed on how the CU leadership reacted to Crowfall's KS and success at getting started. It help flame the legion of fanboys that started beating their chests on both sides.

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Not really sure what you are talking about, i just reread MJ's thread on the CU site in response to the questions he was geting about CF. I didn't see anything i would say was flaming on the CU boards. He made some allusions to a previous history of some bad blood between their previous studios due to previous games as well as his acknowledgement that they were competitors for similar markets. Fanboys will be fanboys. I guess telling players to do their research could be construed as a poor reaction.

Reht_sl said:

Not really sure what you are talking about

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I remember reading french forums (where DAoC is seen as the PvPMMO epitome) and during Crowfall KS there was quite a wave of negative opinions fromCamelotultra fans talking about how Jacobs is a genius and how he got backstabbed by EA for Warhammer Online, etc) and while it was clear they didn't have a clue about Crowfall features they were happily bandwagoning about how Crowfall devs were stealing both DAoC / Jacobs ideas and philosophy. They were quite angry about it.

Reht_sl said:

Not really sure what you are talking about, i just reread MJ's thread on the CU site in response to the questions he was geting about CF. I didn't see anything i would say was flaming on the CU boards. He made some allusions to a previous history of some bad blood between their previous studios due to previous games as well as his acknowledgement that they were competitors for similar markets. Fanboys will be fanboys. I guess telling players to do their research could be construed as a poor reaction.

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Ya maybe, I just do not remember any Wolfpack / Mythic issues back in the day. In my opinion it just came off as a passive aggressive defensive post.

Barab_sl said:

Ya maybe, I just do not remember any Wolfpack / Mythic issues back in the day. In my opinion it just came off as a passive aggressive defensive post.

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Yeah, i played a lot of Daoc back when it was new and don't remember any of the issues but i also didn't spend as much time trolling forums as i do now, being management has it's perks.