Dark Souls 2

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
14,636
31,437
Ok, but you are (by your own words) just showing up and burst DPSing people down and mostly invading people engaged in PvE for the quick kills. How many people in the process of clearing the game are actually even slotting anything for PvP? I seriously doubt it is even possible to gear up to defend against geyser spam or soulblade spam (both ignore Looking Glass Shield) and even if there were, these are not the low hanging fruit that you are going after. There is absolutely nothing to be gained for you by trashing their gear, unless you are one of those basement dwelling choads who faps to other people's misery.
 

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
14,636
31,437
i don't see how people time their estus swigging so badly. most people have enough endurance for 6 swings. if someone swings and misses that many times or tries to break your shield or whatever, you can get one off even with 8 adp like i do, just time it better.
It is a combination of things. First, chomping a stamina herb or even slotting the Corinth ring make the number of swings uncertain, even if using the same weapon. So, picking the right window can be really difficult, unless you are constantly PvPing. Second, a lot of people just don't give a shit about PvP (I am in this category) and don't care about getting all of the timing down. And even if they did, there have always been builds in this series that make even attempting to heal a death sentence, like your setup or the fist weapon stunlock guys. People like me pretty much go "Ok here is some twinked out asshole looking to ruin my clear. May as well slot the life prot ring and grab my ankles." and any resistance we might put up is feeble in the first place. Lastly, what little lag there is tends to favor the aggressor in this series, mostly because the invaded person is the hosting machine and all of the phantoms get to benefit from ghost lag. This is why rolling backstab was broken in DS1 and its why flasking in an invasion is suicide in this game. The only practical way to heal in one on one PVP in this game are the life gems. Trying to flask is basically putting a tee under your chin.

Really all I ever do when invaded now is just hop on to some inaccessible platform and maybe burn an earth seed, if I have one. It is just stupid how much an advantage invaders have in this game, unless they are unlucky enough to invade someone in a cleared zone who has one or two allies. They get to come in with an optimized setup (made worse by the abundant respec items) and all of their spell slots dedicated to the task, with zero negative consequences for fucking it up. As the victim, you are using a PVE setup to cover bases and might even be in the middle of a major fight when they show up. When you get ganked, you have to reclear whatever it was you were working on and you might as an added bonus have someone blow up all your shit just to be a dick. In the rare case where you win (usually the invader has to suck a lot for this to happen), you get almost no souls and are out whatever resources were involved in avoiding the gank attempt. The Order of Blue shit is also not working at the moment and even if it were, you have to be in a useless covenant and blow a ring slot on a ring that does absolutely nothing else to benefit from it.

I won't even go into the megamule bullshit, but hopefully they finally cracked down on that with tonight's patch.
 

Angelwatch

Trakanon Raider
3,053
133
Phaz, as a wise butler once said: "Some people just want to watch the world burn." I'd give up trying to reason with or even understand Jin and move on. Not worth it really.
 

Phaenos_sl

shitlord
83
0
Yeah the NG+ Lost Sinner adds are basically the same pyro guys that are part of the Umbral convenant run. Their pyro spells do lots of stun and they have enough hit points to avoid getting single comboed down, like the adds on Flexile. Sinner himself is kind of a dick with his guard penetrating pierce attack and huge jump backs. One thing though is that those pyro guys do tend to go down fast to lightning bolts, which tend to out range them, but getting enough space from Sinner to pull one off is the trick. If you insist on soloing it, you can try gimping the fight with poison daggers. They are fast launch, use almost no stamina, and everything in that fight is susceptible to poison. I got past it on NG+ with my caster guy by vortex + immunity hex cheesing to clear the adds. I have heard that you can reflect most of the adds bullshit with the looking glass shield, too, but its supposed to be insanely hard to pull off. No fucking way am I trying that guy solo with my mele dude in NG+
So after about 30 attempts and a 42 min. dodge-fest capitalizing on every single possible opening I finally dropped NG+ Sinner last night with my melee only guy while solo. There is literally zero margin for error using this method. Palms were sweating the entire damn time. I love fights like that, but I'll be damned if I ever do it this way again. For my NG++ plat run, I'll be respeccing to a solid caster build without question.
 

sl4ck3r_sl

shitlord
132
2
Absolutely terrible at this game, but it's fun. Managed to down the gargoyle fight in tank mode style, ended up having all gargoyles active at once then whittled away at whatever came my way. I really don't know how I pulled it off to be honest. Was rocking an Ultra Greatsword+3 or 4 and a 100% block shield. 2h with that weapon is incredible on run of the mill enemies.

Obviously, I'm primarily strength, but what's a good stopping point on leveling up endurance? Or is it not really worth it and just dump into str/vgr?
 

Derkon

Blackwing Lair Raider
2,504
1,264
20 is the soft cap for endurance, after that it is only 1 point of stamina per 1 point of endurance instead of 2.
 

a_skeleton_00

<Banned>
1,027
616
i'll assume i destroyed you both and that's why you're both upset still and trashing me, it's ok i still harbor no ill will.

i still think it's just you guys being lazy and hiding it under OMG I HATE PVP, go play a different game, pvp has been THE core of this game since the beginning. summon stones, writing stones, thnk they are there for no reason?

also again since this still hasn't made sense, why am i douchey for destroying someones shield that blocks my magic spells?

so if i sit there, and swing away and he blocks nonstop, i have an item (takes multiple of them and are super hard to hit with) that destroys his shield so i can kill him, why am i fag for using it? apparently you think i walk into a room hit x and my character turns into jesus destroys all armor and instagibs everything. far fucking from it. i'm sorry that i'm GOOD and you aren't. you act like running around with pve/pvp gear is any different really. systematically attacking you from range, removing your defenses, throwing DoTs, and then killing you? i'm pretty sure i'm playing the game like a champion.

you guys need to play skyrim it sounds perfect for you.
 

a_skeleton_00

<Banned>
1,027
616
i get like 30 seconds before anyone comes near me once they invade my game, you act like they invade and boom you can't react. it's the exact opposite. you can stop clearing, turn around, and face the guy, or be an idiot (like you apparently must be) and fall off cliffs trying to get to inaccessible areas.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
12,650
877
Doesn't help that right now From has stated that item degradation effects are "more effective than intended" right now from the translations I've seen posted...
 

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
14,636
31,437
Of course you can react, under ideal circumstances. But looking at the regular invaded zones in this game the all have a couple things in common. They all have mobs with tons of HP, treacherous terrain (usually water levels), and tend to have the longest clears between bonfires. There are good reasons for this, if you are piling up the wins for token farms. Are you seriously suggesting that if you are playing peekaboo with the casters in the second half of Shrine while trudging through the water that you can just stop mid engagement to cope with an invader? Kinda doubt it and you are more prepared than the bulk of the people playing this game. And even if the victim is unengaged at the time of invasion, the invader can just go sit in the middle of a bunch of enemies and wait. The host can't quit, zone out, or do anything aside from maybe engaging the area boss or waiting for the invader's time limit to expire.

But lets say I get to face an invader on even footing, like say in a fully extinct Dragon Temple or something. The invader is still going to be much more optimized for PvP than you are, especially if you are on NG. They are still going to be slotting PvP spells while you are probably loaded with trash clearing ones. There is almost nothing to be gained by fighting invaders, aside from minimal souls, but if the invader is spamming corrosive urns (and there are a lot like Jin doing this) just to be a dick, I could be out a massive repair bill (the life protection ring will generally break early) along with all my progress. Its almost always better just to slip on a life prot ring and suicide if you get invaded one on one. I know you get your jollies pissing off the carebears, but for most people this game is more about PvE, not a giant griefer circle jerk.

But Angel is right and we are never going to see eye to eye on this, mostly because I am pretty certain we are from different age brackets of gamer and the whole dick punching helpless baby seals for lulz thing doesn't do it for me anymore. I love the coop in the game, could not care less about the PvP aspects, though I do like how it was incorporated into the Rat King zones and Looking Glass battle. Bell zones are meh, but at least they are largely optional.

Playing through as a dedicated mele guy (though I did minor in Faith magic for homeward and other utility) has been a completely different experience. Trash seems loads easier, mostly because armor actually matters against them, but certain bosses have been a lot more difficult (and a couple much easier). The Spider gave me issues for some reason (my caster solo one shotted it the first play through) and Rotten was a lot harder. My biggest gripe is that unless you want to asthetic farm materials, getting a good engame weapon is a lot harder than getting the essential caster spells. It is also kind of dumb how BK GS and BK Halberd are so much better than most of the boss soul weapons. Also the effects of Adaptability are pretty much negligible. You have to dump a pile of points to see anything noticeable and even then its a minor benefit. Any one hander that scales STR at A or S seems to outclass most of the two handers, as well. Poise seems to hit the sweet spot at 70 and mainly for avoiding stunlock.
 

a_skeleton_00

<Banned>
1,027
616
Of course you can react, under ideal circumstances. But looking at the regular invaded zones in this game the all have a couple things in common. They all have mobs with tons of HP, treacherous terrain (usually water levels), and tend to have the longest clears between bonfires. There are good reasons for this, if you are piling up the wins for token farms. Are you seriously suggesting that if you are playing peekaboo with the casters in the second half of Shrine while trudging through the water that you can just stop mid engagement to cope with an invader? Kinda doubt it and you are more prepared than the bulk of the people playing this game. And even if the victim is unengaged at the time of invasion, the invader can just go sit in the middle of a bunch of enemies and wait. The host can't quit, zone out, or do anything aside from maybe engaging the area boss or waiting for the invader's time limit to expire.

But lets say I get to face an invader on even footing, like say in a fully extinct Dragon Temple or something. The invader is still going to be much more optimized for PvP than you are, especially if you are on NG. They are still going to be slotting PvP spells while you are probably loaded with trash clearing ones. There is almost nothing to be gained by fighting invaders, aside from minimal souls, but if the invader is spamming corrosive urns (and there are a lot like Jin doing this) just to be a dick, I could be out a massive repair bill (the life protection ring will generally break early) along with all my progress. Its almost always better just to slip on a life prot ring and suicide if you get invaded one on one. I know you get your jollies pissing off the carebears, but for most people this game is more about PvE, not a giant griefer circle jerk.

But Angel is right and we are never going to see eye to eye on this, mostly because I am pretty certain we are from different age brackets of gamer and the whole dick punching helpless baby seals for lulz thing doesn't do it for me anymore. I love the coop in the game, could not care less about the PvP aspects, though I do like how it was incorporated into the Rat King zones and Looking Glass battle. Bell zones are meh, but at least they are largely optional.

Playing through as a dedicated mele guy (though I did minor in Faith magic for homeward and other utility) has been a completely different experience. Trash seems loads easier, mostly because armor actually matters against them, but certain bosses have been a lot more difficult (and a couple much easier). The Spider gave me issues for some reason (my caster solo one shotted it the first play through) and Rotten was a lot harder. My biggest gripe is that unless you want to asthetic farm materials, getting a good engame weapon is a lot harder than getting the essential caster spells. It is also kind of dumb how BK GS and BK Halberd are so much better than most of the boss soul weapons. Also the effects of Adaptability are pretty much negligible. You have to dump a pile of points to see anything noticeable and even then its a minor benefit. Any one hander that scales STR at A or S seems to outclass most of the two handers, as well. Poise seems to hit the sweet spot at 70 and mainly for avoiding stunlock.
i'm 30 years old as a district manager for a cell phone company, i cannot believe you think because i throw urns and use pyromancy and sorcery in burst dps strategies that i'm some 13 year old with an epenis problem. i don't think saying i'm a dick puncher because bad players like you roll off when they see an invade happening makes sense either. i have the same amount of time to setup my gear as anyone else and i never have a problem, and yes, if you are fighting those mages you can turn RIGHT the fuck around and run to a different part of the zone. hell i did it yesterday and had to run all the way back to the demon of song area because i couldn't get a flask off while the invader was chasing me in the water.

on a side note, NG+ is unforgiving and i love it. the fact that stuff can still one shot you at level SL200 is why i love this game. just needs more weapons to go in line with magic users.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
12,650
877
His point of it being sick punching is the penalty for loss is normally minimal, just delay or annoyance possibly souls if you can't retrieve.

Urning someone before testing is committing tons of souls of pain on them for no reason most of the time since you'll be ambushing adventurers more often than PVPers. I use Repel when people start Urning personally but that's s late game option that requires very specific stats to carry full time.

If you (or other Urn Fags) would test resistances/skill level of the target FIRST then Urning IF NECESSARY this likely would have never been a discussion. Urning has it's place, yes, but that's 10% of fights or so - and Urn Fags respond as if it's 100%.

And side note further details on the translation, they were apparently talking about Knuckle Ring not defending against Urn properly, not sure if it was translation or speculation but someone said something about Knuckle Ring being the only thing that will take durability damage in PVP until broken in 1.05
 

axeman_sl

shitlord
592
0
a_skeleton_00 sounds like an imbecile and a shitty gamer who has to find the thinnest possible pretense of PvP in order to be able to "win." He's like the guy at school who would only play footie with the kids three years younger than him because it was the only way he wouldn't get humiliated. What a weak character.
 

Budos

Golden Knight of the Realm
593
10
Invasions aren't really a bad thing. If you join the Way of the Blue, you'll get help when you're invaded by a red phantom. If you have sin, a blue phantom killing you reduces your sin. The red invaders get sin every time they kill someone in an invasion, thus, the blues terrorize them. Getting 10 red phantom kills in the Way of the Blue will also get you rank 3 in it.

I dabble in invading with the red/blue covenants, even the bell & rat covenants, but it isn't my primary reason for still playing Dark Souls either. My opinion is, if you're hollow and get invaded/killed, all you really lost was some time. Just zerg back to where you were. If you're human and get invaded, you should have some phantoms with you. The Ring of Life Protection (repaired for 3k souls a pop -- I have like 6 of them on NG++) makes the soul/humanity lost moot, as you won't even have a blood stain anymore.
 

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
14,636
31,437
It also does not help that you can start buying unlimited urns right after the primal fires are lit, but repel (and indeed most of the PvP related hexes) don't turn up until much later. You can buy a knuckle ring around the time the Urns become available, but they were not even that helpful when they were working properly. And Vaclav hit the nail on the head. The couple of times I have been bushwhacked by urn spammers, I was trudging around with fairly pedestrian gear in Crypt, very clearly not any sort of PvP build, and the other guy tossed a couple urns first thing and broke all of my gear. Luckily, caster repairs are inexpensive. Mele armor build guys really take it in the ass on the repair bill.
 

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
14,636
31,437
Invasions aren't really a bad thing. If you join the Way of the Blue, you'll get help when you're invaded by a red phantom. If you have sin, a blue phantom killing you reduces your sin. The red invaders get sin every time they kill someone in an invasion, thus, the blues terrorize them. Getting 10 red phantom kills in the Way of the Blue will also get you rank 3 in it.
My understanding is that the Way of the Blue thing is more or less not working right now. And, even if it was, it requires both parties to wear their respective rings which serve absolutely no other function (unlike, say the Sun or Umbral Rings). Most people I run into cooping are (like me) doing Sun Guild most of their play through. I did spend some time as a blue guardian wearing the ring and never got summoned, nor did anyone ever seem to be around to duel with tokens of fidelity. The Rat and Bell covenants, on the other hand, work pretty well and pretty much exactly as designed.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
12,650
877
It works, but it's on an insane delay only times it's triggered for me is when I've been invaded and the invader and I spend minutes even finding each other.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
12,650
877
It also does not help that you can start buying unlimited urns right after the primal fires are lit, but repel (and indeed most of the PvP related hexes) don't turn up until much later. You can buy a knuckle ring around the time the Urns become available, but they were not even that helpful when they were working properly. And Vaclav hit the nail on the head. The couple of times I have been bushwhacked by urn spammers, I was trudging around with fairly pedestrian gear in Crypt, very clearly not any sort of PvP build, and the other guy tossed a couple urns first thing and broke all of my gear. Luckily, caster repairs are inexpensive. Mele armor build guys really take it in the ass on the repair bill.
Knuckle Ring supposedly isn't working vs Urns at all....
 

Quineloe

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
6,978
4,464
well, when this comes out for real, you can just alt F4 out of invasions again, so pretty moot discussion anyways.