Desktop Computers

Mist_sl said:

TRIM is essentially defrag + other shit. The SSD's firmware does it, and Windows just tells it when to do it.

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Not even remotely close. Try again.

popsicledeath_sl said:

Probably.

Win 8.1 won't defrag your SSD,

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I haven't looked lately to see if it was fixed, but there is a bug where is does. On a freshly installed and patched 8.1 Pro, it was the difference between ~.2GB written for a trim and ~5.3GB for a "defrag."


Edit: Just pulled my logs, and it's still doing it. At first MS denied it, then they claimed it's a sort of "SSD defrag" to consolidate the SSD file allocation tables.

OK so I just put together my first computer myself (well, my GF helped a bit, bless her heart!). Now we are thinking about upgrading her to a desktop (she currently has an old laptop that she uses for school and gaming). Her budget is quite a bit tighter then mine, so we have been looking at some options in her range. She doesnt play very intensive games, with the two games that she plays on a regular basis being WoW and hearthstone. Im just curious what you guys think about this build - it would likely be 3+ years before we are in a position to upgrade again, and the impression that I am getting is that this system wouldnt have much room to upgrade so we would maybe be thinking about a new better build eventually. Will there be any regrets if my gf has this as her gaming computer for the next 3 years or so:

CPU

Intel Core i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core Processor
$103.99 $103.99 SuperBiiz Buy
Motherboard

ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard
$68.98 $68.98 OutletPC Buy
Memory

G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory
From parametric filter
Speed: DDR3-1600, DDR3-1866, DDR3-2133
Type: 240-pin DIMM
Size: 8GB (1x8GB), 8GB (2x4GB)
Voltage: 1.35V - 1.5V
$54.99 -$5.00 FREE $49.99 Newegg Buy
+ USD $5 off w/ promo code EMCARKR66, ends 4/20
Storage

Hitachi Ultrastar 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive
From parametric filter
Capacity: 1TB
Type: 7200RPM
Form Factor: 3.5"
$42.00 Free two-day shipping with Amazon Prime $42.00 Amazon Buy
Video Card

XFX Radeon R9 280X 3GB Double Dissipation Video Card
From parametric filter
Chipset: Radeon R9 280X, Radeon R9 290
$209.99 -$20.00 FREE $189.99 Newegg Buy
$20.00 mail-in rebate
Case

NZXT Source 210 Elite (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case
$45.99 $45.99 SuperBiiz Buy
Power Supply

Corsair Builder 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply
$59.99 -$25.00 FREE $34.99 Newegg Buy

Alkorin_sl said:

Odd. My 8.1 install won't do that. Wonder what the particular set of circumstances is.

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According to MS, the conditions are, " Storage Optimizer will defrag an SSD once a month if volume snapshots are enabled."

To see if Defrag is being run on your SSDs, open Powershell and run:
Check the output and look for lines similar to which shows a defrag. A trim only entry wouldn't have the second message with the same timestamp.

I believethis blogis the original discovery of the issue.

Here's myAT threadwhere I pull SMART info for LBA before and after to show that a defrag is writing more data than the trim. Note that this thread has some old assumptions about when SSD defrag is run, but the data is otherwise solid.

MS's original stance was to state that it was a bad log entry, and that no defragging of SSDs was happening. My thread strongly suggested that more than a simple Trim was happening since the Defrag pass 27X the data of the Trim pass.

MS seems to acknowledge and explain what is going onin this blog. Unfortunately the blog itself itself makes assumptions and hints that the SSD defrag is special (which he corrects in the comments), but AFAIK Windows is still at the mercy of the SSD controller with respect to file placement. A SSD defrag may help to orgranize the file fragments, but there is no guarantee.

RandAlThor420_sl said:

Will there be any regrets if my gf has this as her gaming computer for the next 3 years or so

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You'll regret not having a SSD now, let alone in 3 years. IMHO, you need to include it as a standard component in any build today.

OK thanks, thats actually one change I was thinking she might want to make, and without too much additional expense (just less storage space, which I doubt will matter much to her)

She'll crap her pants the first time she plays WoW off of a SSD. 100% worth it. Heres a 250GB SSD(decent brand too) for $69.99 after rebate, only adds about $30 to your budget

TigerDirect - OCZ ARC 100 SERIES 240GB SSD - Slickdeals.net

250GB is PLENTY of room for Windows + half a dozen games

popsicledeath_sl said:

If you know of the problem and haven't fixed it, it must really be serious!

Half joking!

I've heard of it before, and I'm not sure what to believe, really. When I first read up on it nobody was really providing read/write logs that coincided with anything, and it was a relative drop in the bucket anyhow and I didn't really figure it actually mattered that much to the overall realistic expectancy of the SSD. I mean, 5 gig once a month? I install/uninstall random shit from Steam at like 10 times that rate.

Point taken, though, I should know better than to say Windows isn't doing something, but rather that it shouldn't be.

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Some people are anal about SSD writes. I don't care. The issue is/was MS's outright denial of the behavior up until Dec 2014.

Nah, at this point dont bother upgrading to 8, just wait for the free upgrade to 10.

And your new SSD might come with cloning software, all of the new Samsung drives do, it's a super quick & easy process if you're just cloning SSD to SSD(I'd never recommend cloning an OS from mechanical HD to SSD)