tad10
Elisha Dushku
- 5,518
- 583
SOE really needs to get some better gameplay video up. The current one focuses on sound and fury, not on skilled play.
EQ Never
- Thread starter Convo
- Start date
Convo
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 8,761
- 613
Not even going to pretend to have the level of understand as Mughal but they as in SoE are already trying to raise the bar on AI so who's really to say what's possible.
Lithose
Buzzfeed Editor
- 25,946
- 113,035
I hate that statement--as if the mobs not going after healers is simply because the AI is too poor to figure it out. Given the technical expertise of the WoW programers, they could not make a mob that could rip any raid group in half (Without tweaking other variables beyond the "standard" current tier statistics). The fact is, the AI going after healers does not=good. Not by a long shot. People who assume an AI is bad just because it doesn't kill the priest have a really narrow view of why games operate the way they do (I know you understand this, just saying because I hate that line heh)
As I've said a few times , I'm hanging my hopes on some more hardcore PVE/PVP ruleset servers.
I'll last a lot longer playing it and deal with the "this isn't EQ other than in name" much better if they have such.
I'll last a lot longer playing it and deal with the "this isn't EQ other than in name" much better if they have such.
Lithose
Buzzfeed Editor
- 25,946
- 113,035
I don't get why there are raid caps...everything about this game screams that item value is huge and effeciency in finding and killing mobs>>difficulty of actually killing them. So I'd wish they just allow zergs and say the penalty for zerging is less gear per person.
I just wish developers would leave their games open....
Teekey
Mr. Poopybutthole
- 3,644
- -6,335
No one knows for sure. Tad got the hunch after talking to the developers it would be around 24.
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 7,039
- 2,113
Eh its a wait and see, but history is not on their side. AI is just so hard to do to a point where it doesn't get exploited by users once patterns are figured out. There was a post before from someone about UO. They had a nifty AI system or something but they had to scrap it because players would just camp a stage forever, never letting it expand. If you were to force it, then there is no "consequences" which seems what they are going for(that halas example, you may slow it down or something but you can't really stop it, its inevitable). From that, I gather everything is going to proceed no matter what, the speed is the only variable.
Again I think the only real way to have a "living" world is through player vs player interaction. It's the only form that cannot be reduced to patterns or programming.It's why EVE does so well, or the MOBAs, they are all based on PvP.
tad10
Elisha Dushku
- 5,518
- 583
Sorta. Talisker said "Smaller raids". Which I speculated as 24 or less. Since that's the standard small raid compared to the usual EQ raid.
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 7,039
- 2,113
Which means its locked size. Which if you look at this thread before the reveal, was a horrible idea and companies are dumb for doing it ;P And if its a locked size, that means it has to be instanced or maybe phased, only way to control who enters and fights. Which is another horrible idea just a few weeks ago.
having to wait for boss spawn time is how you say DENIAL OF SERVICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!
tad10
Elisha Dushku
- 5,518
- 583
Teekey
Mr. Poopybutthole
- 3,644
- -6,335
I don't necessarily see what's wrong with players exploiting AI, to an extent. I mean - I'd rather Orcs act believable, even if it's predictable - then to just sit at a camp with their thumb up their asses. I guess my point is, Mobs AI should be predictable in that they're always acting in character. Orcs like pillaging gold, but hate Guards. They shouldn't act against those likes and dislikes. I should be able to track them based on their known behavior.
Where they can improve upon UO's system is a more robust loadshifting. If Orcs hate being beaten up, they shouldn't continue to spawn where there are people waiting to beat them up.
I do agree with this, though. Sandboxes are amazing because the 'content' is created by player interaction, both positive and negative.
My hope for EQNext was for there to still be conflict, even through PvE. Rallying Calls would have been there perfect chance, for two sides to struggle over which way the event goes. Ideally PvP would be allowed as well, but honestly it could be PvE only.
However, I don't think they're taking that route because they're using Rallying Calls for story driven events. Some might progress more slowly, but there's only one real path for them.
I hope they reconsider.
I joked about this like 20-40 pages ago.
But with Next is SOE going to do the lockbox thing that you need to buy keys for a chance at rare mounts, loots etc like they do for Vanguard now as well as they have in Neverwinter and STO?
But with Next is SOE going to do the lockbox thing that you need to buy keys for a chance at rare mounts, loots etc like they do for Vanguard now as well as they have in Neverwinter and STO?
Grumpus
Molten Core Raider
- 1,927
- 223
Could it really be that difficult?
Just have a system where like they said, mobs act the way they would actually act. Every action has a value and the boss responds to those values on the fly.
Big giant armored boss is being fought. He doesn't care to much about melee damage done to him because of his armor. Melee dps is valued at 1. Magic damage is more dangerous as it get through armor so its value is 3. So melee needs to be doing triple the damage of the magic to gain aggro.
Also defense ability's have a value of 1 and utility has a value of 1.
So you can either use a ton of defense ability's off tanks, but the damage they were taking would require more healing which would cause a tip towards healer aggro.
In a system like this you could run fights in many different ways.
Also if said big armored monster loses 50% of its health its armor falls off and the melee are suddenly able to hit vulnerable spots and so the melee value goes up to 5.
Etc etc
Jysin
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 6,286
- 4,053
EQ2 did the 24 man raids (4 groups of 6) and I just didnt care for it nearly as much as the larger EQ1 raids. With so few people, it was pretty specific and restrictive on the necessary classes. Again, EQ2 as an example had 24 classes and 24 raid slots but you would be damn sure there was always a disproportionate amount of healers in those raids. You would generally always need a bard in each group too. In that situation you would have entire classes excluded from raids simply by the stupid numbers limitation put in by the Devs.
I would love to see at minimum 30 man raids, 36-42 being optimal. The numbers give a lot more flexibility if X critical role person goes on a couple week vacation.
woah look at how shit EverQuest 1 combat is, you just shoot really fast fireaballs and solo dragons
I think we all understand what we saw so far is not what its really like but there are problems here. They are going for an open system where a reliance on any 1 class is gone. They can do all the internal testing they want but they can't test how it would be like in a large environment. Sure they can play with each person having a role in the battles etc but how can they guarantee the game wont devolve in to a DPS fest where you worry about yourself only?
It's sad that I recognize it as completely absurd, but still hope there's some chance for the ghost of Brad McQuaid to rise from the ashes, use those pushed to the side assets, and create a proper EQ3. Despite everything that happened during the development of Vanguard, I still want McQuaid to have another go once he gets out of the development stomping grounds at SOE.
But yeah, for all my negativity I'm still going to play the shit out of this game because there seems to be a lot of good coming with what I perceive to be bad.