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Kythik

Molten Core Raider
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What version of Zlandicar is that even? I mean I know it isn't the one I 2 boxed in dragon necropolis during POP with my war and Rynoa's cleric.
I'm wondering the same thing since necros were soloing Zland in PoP. Or I remember soloing it in PoP at least.
 

Regime

LOADING, PLEASE WAIT...
14,041
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Man I remember reading FoH as a 9 year old and thinking Kreugan was cool. It was wild when I ended up on the same server as him in 2011 on Vulak and got to see him training Trak on me.
I remember playing battlefield and having him kill his own teammates with the C4 and atv combo. “Wann ride reg?”


Fuck no I don’t
 
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Kuro

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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Does EQLive have raid progression anymore? Or are new expansions just multiboxer/group content?
 

Rajaah

Paperhands McGee
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What version of Zlandicar is that even? I mean I know it isn't the one I 2 boxed in dragon necropolis during POP with my war and Rynoa's cleric.

The two-headed New Zlandicar is, from what I can tell, a product of him fusing with Talendor.

Talendor is the Big Bad of the Kunark remake. Zlandi isn't the Big Bad of the Velious remake (Vulak is) but he's still doing a lot of scheming and so forth.

So basically after you defeated Talendor in the Kunark remake, Zlandi obtained his severed head and kept it on ice, then somehow fused with it to form this new Talen-Zlandi. Not sure if the fusion was intentional or if Zlandicar was trying to do something else and botched the experiment.

During the fight, Talendor's head argues with Zlandicar's head so they aren't exactly amicable. Zlandi controls the body though.

From what I can tell all of the dragons in the Velious remake (Zland, Kland, Yelinak, Sontalak, Aaryonar) are all just sorta doing their own thing and not involved with Vulak nuking the continent. You basically go through all of them beating them down for information so they can lead you to the real source of the destruction, which of course ends up being Vulak and his devotees (who are all holed up in Sleeper's Tomb). Aaryonar might be on-board with Vulak's insurgence but I don't think the others are.

Kinda bummed they didn't bring Kerafyrm back if the expansion was going to end in ST anyway. And we fight the Crusaders that "arrested" Kerafyrm in SoF, so in theory he should have factored in somewhere. Vulak is a cool villain too, at least.
 

Rajaah

Paperhands McGee
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Does EQLive have raid progression anymore? Or are new expansions just multiboxer/group content?

Yeah. Raid progression is pretty much mandatory now because the group game seems to be tuned for raid gear. Like I have basically maxed-out raid gear from the expansion before the current one, minus a few major key items like the Artisan's Prize, and as a Zerker I can barely tank anything above my level in the new expansion without getting spam-healed. Zerkers can take a fair amount of punishment for most of the game, up until the 110+ expansions when they need to be fully raid-geared just to tank a single yellow mob.

The new expansion looks pretty anemic for raids: There are 9 fights and they're releasing them in sets of 3 (I think). First 3 went down pretty easily, even with me botching an emote on one of them. I assume there'll be a Luclin Pt 2 where all the interesting stuff is (Ssra Temple, Mayong), much like they did with the Kunark and Velious remakes.
 

Vanessa

Uncle Tanya
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The two-headed New Zlandicar is, from what I can tell, a product of him fusing with Talendor.

Talendor is the Big Bad of the Kunark remake. Zlandi isn't the Big Bad of the Velious remake (Vulak is) but he's still doing a lot of scheming and so forth.

So basically after you defeated Talendor in the Kunark remake, Zlandi obtained his severed head and kept it on ice, then somehow fused with it to form this new Talen-Zlandi. Not sure if the fusion was intentional or if Zlandicar was trying to do something else and botched the experiment.

During the fight, Talendor's head argues with Zlandicar's head so they aren't exactly amicable. Zlandi controls the body though.

From what I can tell all of the dragons in the Velious remake (Zland, Kland, Yelinak, Sontalak, Aaryonar) are all just sorta doing their own thing and not involved with Vulak nuking the continent. You basically go through all of them beating them down for information so they can lead you to the real source of the destruction, which of course ends up being Vulak and his devotees (who are all holed up in Sleeper's Tomb). Aaryonar might be on-board with Vulak's insurgence but I don't think the others are.

Kinda bummed they didn't bring Kerafyrm back if the expansion was going to end in ST anyway. And we fight the Crusaders that "arrested" Kerafyrm in SoF, so in theory he should have factored in somewhere. Vulak is a cool villain too, at least.
Ugh.... this just sounds like the WORST EQ fanfic ever.

This is kinda why I have a love/hate relationship with EQ nowadays. God bless the people still working on the game... you guys are doing a good job with actually producing content it seems but when it comes to creativity mixing with lore... it's a disaster, but at the same time, I ask myself could I shit out new story after new story over the course of 22 years and like 25 expansions like they have? Probably not, but you expect more from the guys who are payed to make it all happen.

I can see the devs and creators logically puzzling out the fact that players love their nostalgia but they need new cheese to eat... the very fact you said "Kunark remake" is just gross. There's Kunark. No remake. No Neuvo Kunark. Kunark II. Grand Kunark or some crap like that... It's just... Kunark. But noooooo, they gotta tread over all the old ground but make the numbers go up a few decimals. ...and Talendor and Zlandicar fuse together and become a frankenstein monster...LoL... it's just lazy imagination, I'm sorry to say.

Call me a bitch for all this but this rant is a product of actually caring about the IP and future of such a remarkable gem in this game.
 
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Rajaah

Paperhands McGee
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Ugh.... this just sounds like the WORST EQ fanfic ever.

This is kinda why I have a love/hate relationship with EQ nowadays. God bless the people still working on the game... you guys are doing a good job with actually producing content it seems but when it comes to creativity mixing with lore... it's a disaster, but at the same time, I ask myself could I shit out new story after new story over the course of 22 years and like 25 expansions like they have? Probably not, but you expect more from the guys who are payed to make it all happen.

I can see the devs and creators logically puzzling out the fact that players love their nostalgia but they need new cheese to eat... the very fact you said "Kunark remake" is just gross. There's Kunark. No remake. No Neuvo Kunark. Kunark II. Grand Kunark or some crap like that... It's just... Kunark. But noooooo, they gotta tread over all the old ground but make the numbers go up a few decimals. ...and Talendor and Zlandicar fuse together and become a frankenstein monster...LoL... it's just lazy imagination, I'm sorry to say.

Call me a bitch for all this but this rant is a product of actually caring about the IP and future of such a remarkable gem in this game.

You're a bitch for all this. I'm just kidding, I agree. They did a pretty good job with the Kunark remake and I think a lot of people were happy to get a fleshed-out version of Kunark with tons of quests, etc. The quality level went way downhill for the Velious remake, especially the back half, probably because of COVID. I figured they'd stop with the remakes after Velious, since Kunark and Velious are two of the most popular expansions that happened to have a ton of remake potential in terms of filling out those big empty zones with things to do.

The Luclin remake just baffles me though, because it only uses like 4 zones from the original and doesn't particularly flesh them out (there's still a COVID content drought). I hope this isn't the trend they're gonna follow for the rest of time, just remaking old expansions.

I can say for sure that the next expansion will be Luclin Pt 2 since Pt 1 wraps up none of the story (and Kunark/Velious had pt 2s). One after that will be PoP. Good news is, they already remade parts of PoP with the TBM and TBL expansions, which fell before and after the Kunark remake. So they only have one more PoP remake to do, Plane of Earth/Water with Loruella as the new Mearatas. After that, I guess I'd get my long-awaited wish of more Muramites with GoD/OoW remakes, but knowing my luck, they'd completely stop the remakes before that. Or make a LDON 2.

Either way, once Luclin and PoP remakes are finished, I'd like to see some new stuff that draws on the lore of the past. I assume Luclin II will bring us Mayong's return, so I hope future expansions will have more with Kerafyrm being on the loose again, or a trip to the Muramite homeworld, stuff like that would be awesome and keep me playing.
 
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Rajaah

Paperhands McGee
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How I'd do it:
2022: Luclin Remake Pt 2 (Mayong)
2023: PoP Remake Finale (Loruella, Earth/Water)
2024: Muramites return (not a GoD remake, but something vaguely similar with them invading Alaris or something) with the 4th and final Rider as the endboss. I'd have the first zone of Alaris be the final zone where the endboss is, with you making landfall somewhere else on the continent (as the normal entrance zone is now Muramite-controlled).
2025: Level raise to 125, trip to Muramite home planet (not a OoW remake, but something similar). Endzone is full of glass pods where the Riders are being cloned / re-created so you can fight Tunat/Mata/Brekt/? again. Endboss is a giant eyeball in a pillar of ooze or something.
2026: Kerafyrm returns, builds a new crystal palace somewhere (probably the largely-unused frozen north lands of Antonica), remaining dragons flock to his standard to prepare for a new attack on Norrath.
2027: Back half of Kerafyrm expansion, so we can get some real beef added to the zones in this one. Kerafyrm has his old model back.
 
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Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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How I think I'd do it:
  • Grand plan making the game open-source and ultimately unprofitable
How I'd actually do it:
  • Wake up, realize I'm developing a 25 year old game and find a new job
 
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yerm

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
4,358
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Fuck kerafyrm. Seriously fuck her, her lore, and every single faggot who rubs em out to her. Every tlp should wake her immediately. Alla used to have literal hundreds of pages of people writing lore ideas and stupid garbage. She is THE WORST fuckstain in all of eq lore, so bad that if she was just retconned away like the potime ending (the literal worst writing in eq) I'd still be totally ok with it.
 
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Vanessa

Uncle Tanya
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Fuck kerafyrm
Kerafyrm 07.jpg


Look at it Yerm.

Look.

Look at it
 

Sieger

Trakanon Raider
277
309
3d 2h 18m
How I'd do it:
2022: Luclin Remake Pt 2 (Mayong)
2023: PoP Remake Finale (Loruella, Earth/Water)
2024: Muramites return (not a GoD remake, but something vaguely similar with them invading Alaris or something) with the 4th and final Rider as the endboss. I'd have the first zone of Alaris be the final zone where the endboss is, with you making landfall somewhere else on the continent (as the normal entrance zone is now Muramite-controlled).
2025: Level raise to 125, trip to Muramite home planet (not a OoW remake, but something similar). Endzone is full of glass pods where the Riders are being cloned / re-created so you can fight Tunat/Mata/Brekt/? again. Endboss is a giant eyeball in a pillar of ooze or something.
2026: Kerafyrm returns, builds a new crystal palace somewhere (probably the largely-unused frozen north lands of Antonica), remaining dragons flock to his standard to prepare for a new attack on Norrath.
2027: Back half of Kerafyrm expansion, so we can get some real beef added to the zones in this one. Kerafyrm has his old model back.
While not 100%, they kind of reuse EQ2 assets in EQ1 now, which is sometimes a pretty good predictor of what's coming next. They now can use EQ2 assets in EQ1, and do so heavily. For example the Empires of Kunark (EQ1) Sarnak, enemy Iksar, forest / mountain giants, skorpiki etc are all straight copies of the EQ2 Kunark expansion models (EQ2 had a Kunark themed expansion in 2016, same year as Empires of Kunark opened.)

The only slight diversion in recent years has been Velious, EQ2 hasn't done a Velious expansion all that recently, however a lot of the EQ1 two Velious revamp expansions have still used EQ2 assets--there was an EQ2 Velious expansion in 2011 and then one that isn't set in Velious, but involves a lot of Velious mobs (like Lord Yelinak) in 2013, and several of those assets got reused.

For example

EQ2: Kunark Ascending (2016) --> EQ1: Empires of Kunark (2016) + Ring of Scale (2017)
EQ2: Planes of Prophecy (2017) --> EQ1: The Burning Lands (2018)

It then diverged a bit:

EQ2 did a second PoP expansion while EQ2 moved on from PoP revamp to Velious Revamp 1.

Then EQ2 did a Luclin revamp in 2019 and 2020, and of course many of those assets have been used in 2021's EQ1 Luclin Revamp, and it's already been announced the Luclin revamp will be two expansions worth of content for EQ1 so you can expect more of the EQ2 Luclin revamp assets being reused in EQ1.

My understanding is the art team between the two games is basically shared now, so I wouldn't expect EQ1 to get expansions too far afield from what EQ1 is doing, or they'd have to do unique art for both, so EQ1 will either follow in EQ2's footsteps, or will draw from older EQ2 content that's already usable and out there. They did this after TBL instead of doing the "second" PoP revamp they went back to Velious. I personally liked TBL but it was really controversial for a lot of live players (particularly casuals, most end game raiders really liked it, but it had a brutal mission-based group progression system and raids that shut out a lot of casual guilds), so I suspect that may be part of the reason EQ1 made the decision to not do a 2nd PoP revamp like EQ2 did and go back to Velious instead.
 
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Kirun

Buzzfeed Editor
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While not 100%, they kind of reuse EQ2 assets in EQ1 now, which is sometimes a pretty good predictor of what's coming next. They now can use EQ2 assets in EQ1, and do so heavily. For example the Empires of Kunark (EQ1) Sarnak, enemy Iksar, forest / mountain giants, skorpiki etc are all straight copies of the EQ2 Kunark expansion models (EQ2 had a Kunark themed expansion in 2016, same year as Empires of Kunark opened.)

The only slight diversion in recent years has been Velious, EQ2 hasn't done a Velious expansion all that recently, however a lot of the EQ1 two Velious revamp expansions have still used EQ2 assets--there was an EQ2 Velious expansion in 2011 and then one that isn't set in Velious, but involves a lot of Velious mobs (like Lord Yelinak) in 2013, and several of those assets got reused.

For example

EQ2: Kunark Ascending (2016) --> EQ1: Empires of Kunark (2016) + Ring of Scale (2017)
EQ2: Planes of Prophecy (2017) --> EQ1: The Burning Lands (2018)

It then diverged a bit:

EQ2 did a second PoP expansion while EQ2 moved on from PoP revamp to Velious Revamp 1.

Then EQ2 did a Luclin revamp in 2019 and 2020, and of course many of those assets have been used in 2021's EQ1 Luclin Revamp, and it's already been announced the Luclin revamp will be two expansions worth of content for EQ1 so you can expect more of the EQ2 Luclin revamp assets being reused in EQ1.

My understanding is the art team between the two games is basically shared now, so I wouldn't expect EQ1 to get expansions too far afield from what EQ1 is doing, or they'd have to do unique art for both, so EQ1 will either follow in EQ2's footsteps, or will draw from older EQ2 content that's already usable and out there. They did this after TBL instead of doing the "second" PoP revamp they went back to Velious. I personally liked TBL but it was really controversial for a lot of live players (particularly casuals, most end game raiders really liked it, but it had a brutal mission-based group progression system and raids that shut out a lot of casual guilds), so I suspect that may be part of the reason EQ1 made the decision to not do a 2nd PoP revamp like EQ2 did and go back to Velious instead.
Tom Toby has basically said in interviews this is exactly how it works. He basically models everything in the EQ2 engine and then it gets ported over to EQ1. Didn't EQ2 just release some dinosaur shit? I'd expect EQ1 will get that content after the Luclin stuff. Or, like you said, they'll reuse some other EQ2 assets released years ago.

It isn't the worst system and honestly makes a TON of sense if you're trying to remain a small, profitable studio. Art is usually one of the largest expenses in game dev.
 

Rajaah

Paperhands McGee
<Gold Donor>
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Fuck kerafyrm. Seriously fuck her, her lore, and every single faggot who rubs em out to her. Every tlp should wake her immediately. Alla used to have literal hundreds of pages of people writing lore ideas and stupid garbage. She is THE WORST fuckstain in all of eq lore, so bad that if she was just retconned away like the potime ending (the literal worst writing in eq) I'd still be totally ok with it.

I think Kerafyrm (he/him btw, IIRC) was just created because the devs wanted to create a ludicrously-OP mob just to rampage around and kill players. I got the feeling that a lot of the early EQ development revolved around "what can we design that'll kill people". Like when Kunark first came out and Trakanon's AE one-shotted everyone. They knew a tiny fraction of the playerbase would figure out how to get past these things and everyone else would just get murdered, and it'd be hilarious.

Kerafyrm being a very powerful dragon who rebels against the others and has the power to fully displace all of them is a very interesting story to me, at least. You can have familiar faces like Yelinak showing up on the side of the players since Kerafyrm is a big enough threat to negate all previous enmity. I'd be interested to see which dragons sided with Kerafyrm. Could see Zlandicar jumping ship and "going with the winner", no doubt. I was hoping to get more stuff like this in COV, with Vulak apparently going renegade. However it looked like his only supporters were Melalafen and a couple of jobber dragons, and they didn't flesh out Melalafen's importance at all, whatsoever.

View attachment 394596

Look at it Yerm.

Look.

Look at it

I'd like to see something like this in EQ again, except in the context of an actual winnable struggle. Some sort of fight that takes place over multiple zones. Kerafyrm expansion could have 3 zones (think Heart of Fear). Like Crystal Palace: Layer 1, etc. After you beat up Kerafyrm enough on Layer 3, he warps down to Layer 2, and then 1, and then the snowy plains outside (if this is north Antonica), then finally ends up charging the gates of Qeynos like Fippy Darkpaw and absolutely annihilating everything before making his final stand there. Would require the fight to be open-world rather than instanced. I suppose they could instance-up this whole scenario in a controlled way like the Dragons x3 raid, but I'd rather just see it in open world. Could also have Kerafyrm attack Permafrost, then Sol B, killing off his parents*, then storm Freeport because fuck Freeport.

* - I'd like to see an expansion with Vox and Nagafen as the main antagonists at some point as well. Maybe the level 130 expansion. Something with a bunch of old-school classic lore and content updated, I guess similar to EoK/RoS except with a group of classic zones getting that kind of revamped new version. Flesh out the north lands of Antonica a bit, have Vox and Nagafen as an incredibly tough Zek Bros style super-fight that only 10 guilds serverwide can beat in-era. New revamped Runnyeye/Permafrost/Sol B that are open-world and drop high-tier loot, like the old days.

Maybe I should just try to become a dev instead of fapping over my ideas here, IDK.

While not 100%, they kind of reuse EQ2 assets in EQ1 now, which is sometimes a pretty good predictor of what's coming next. They now can use EQ2 assets in EQ1, and do so heavily. For example the Empires of Kunark (EQ1) Sarnak, enemy Iksar, forest / mountain giants, skorpiki etc are all straight copies of the EQ2 Kunark expansion models (EQ2 had a Kunark themed expansion in 2016, same year as Empires of Kunark opened.)

The only slight diversion in recent years has been Velious, EQ2 hasn't done a Velious expansion all that recently, however a lot of the EQ1 two Velious revamp expansions have still used EQ2 assets--there was an EQ2 Velious expansion in 2011 and then one that isn't set in Velious, but involves a lot of Velious mobs (like Lord Yelinak) in 2013, and several of those assets got reused.

For example

EQ2: Kunark Ascending (2016) --> EQ1: Empires of Kunark (2016) + Ring of Scale (2017)
EQ2: Planes of Prophecy (2017) --> EQ1: The Burning Lands (2018)

It then diverged a bit:

EQ2 did a second PoP expansion while EQ2 moved on from PoP revamp to Velious Revamp 1.

Then EQ2 did a Luclin revamp in 2019 and 2020, and of course many of those assets have been used in 2021's EQ1 Luclin Revamp, and it's already been announced the Luclin revamp will be two expansions worth of content for EQ1 so you can expect more of the EQ2 Luclin revamp assets being reused in EQ1.

My understanding is the art team between the two games is basically shared now, so I wouldn't expect EQ1 to get expansions too far afield from what EQ1 is doing, or they'd have to do unique art for both, so EQ1 will either follow in EQ2's footsteps, or will draw from older EQ2 content that's already usable and out there. They did this after TBL instead of doing the "second" PoP revamp they went back to Velious. I personally liked TBL but it was really controversial for a lot of live players (particularly casuals, most end game raiders really liked it, but it had a brutal mission-based group progression system and raids that shut out a lot of casual guilds), so I suspect that may be part of the reason EQ1 made the decision to not do a 2nd PoP revamp like EQ2 did and go back to Velious instead.

I feel like they're gonna "finish" the PoP revamp at some point, since they're so close to covering all the major zones. Burning Lands is a decent spot to leave it on if they're gonna do that, though. I also liked Burning Lands a lot, and think that the super-hard final boss was actually a good time. Was the most challenging fight we ever had on Phinigel, before or since, and it isn't even close. Was great to actually lose to a boss and have to work at the victory.

If EQ1 is following EQ2 so closely (which I'm going to guess started around 2014 with COTF's storyline that EQ2 mobs were invading? I always thought that was sus)... then there may be a fair chance we don't get any more muramite expansions, as I don't see any way muramites get involved in EQ2. Then again, their models have never been changed over multiple expansions anyway.
 

Ambiturner

Avatar of War Slayer
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I think Kerafyrm (he/him btw, IIRC) was just created because the devs wanted to create a ludicrously-OP mob just to rampage around and kill players. I got the feeling that a lot of the early EQ development revolved around "what can we design that'll kill people". Like when Kunark first came out and Trakanon's AE one-shotted everyone. They knew a tiny fraction of the playerbase would figure out how to get past these things and everyone else would just get murdered, and it'd be hilarious.

Kerafyrm being a very powerful dragon who rebels against the others and has the power to fully displace all of them is a very interesting story to me, at least. You can have familiar faces like Yelinak showing up on the side of the players since Kerafyrm is a big enough threat to negate all previous enmity. I'd be interested to see which dragons sided with Kerafyrm. Could see Zlandicar jumping ship and "going with the winner", no doubt. I was hoping to get more stuff like this in COV, with Vulak apparently going renegade. However it looked like his only supporters were Melalafen and a couple of jobber dragons, and they didn't flesh out Melalafen's importance at all, whatsoever.



I'd like to see something like this in EQ again, except in the context of an actual winnable struggle. Some sort of fight that takes place over multiple zones. Kerafyrm expansion could have 3 zones (think Heart of Fear). Like Crystal Palace: Layer 1, etc. After you beat up Kerafyrm enough on Layer 3, he warps down to Layer 2, and then 1, and then the snowy plains outside (if this is north Antonica), then finally ends up charging the gates of Qeynos like Fippy Darkpaw and absolutely annihilating everything before making his final stand there. Would require the fight to be open-world rather than instanced. I suppose they could instance-up this whole scenario in a controlled way like the Dragons x3 raid, but I'd rather just see it in open world. Could also have Kerafyrm attack Permafrost, then Sol B, killing off his parents*, then storm Freeport because fuck Freeport.

* - I'd like to see an expansion with Vox and Nagafen as the main antagonists at some point as well. Maybe the level 130 expansion. Something with a bunch of old-school classic lore and content updated, I guess similar to EoK/RoS except with a group of classic zones getting that kind of revamped new version. Flesh out the north lands of Antonica a bit, have Vox and Nagafen as an incredibly tough Zek Bros style super-fight that only 10 guilds serverwide can beat in-era. New revamped Runnyeye/Permafrost/Sol B that are open-world and drop high-tier loot, like the old days.

Maybe I should just try to become a dev instead of fapping over my ideas here, IDK.



I feel like they're gonna "finish" the PoP revamp at some point, since they're so close to covering all the major zones. Burning Lands is a decent spot to leave it on if they're gonna do that, though. I also liked Burning Lands a lot, and think that the super-hard final boss was actually a good time. Was the most challenging fight we ever had on Phinigel, before or since, and it isn't even close. Was great to actually lose to a boss and have to work at the victory.

If EQ1 is following EQ2 so closely (which I'm going to guess started around 2014 with COTF's storyline that EQ2 mobs were invading? I always thought that was sus)... then there may be a fair chance we don't get any more muramite expansions, as I don't see any way muramites get involved in EQ2. Then again, their models have never been changed over multiple expansions anyway.

Vox and Naggy aren't his parents you n00b
 
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Maul

Dental Dammer
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What difference if any will the 64bit version make? Or is it just some straight up bullshit technojargon