Green Monster Games - Curt Schilling

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CylusSoulreaver_foh

shitlord
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Zarcath said:
I find it ironic that VG"s demise could be attributed to a case of WoW addiction (among other addictions).
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Well, keep in mind that my experience is/was limited to what I saw. I"m sure that there were plenty of meetings that I wasn"t privy to and that they were much more hands-on in the early stages of the project, just not at the end.

Ultimately, it comes down to visibility. I currently sit two chairs down from my lead designer, three from the lead programmer and a short ways from the lead artist. They"re all out there on the floor, visibly working along side the rest of us. The fact that they aren"t closeting themselves up in an office like some CEO is quite a boon to the pipeline as well as general morale.
 
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Dymus_foh

shitlord
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Flight said:
I"m trying to promote a discussion among the folk who can feed into it, to :

i) find common ground and belief on what can be improved; and,

ii) discuss how we make those improvements a reality.

I"d really appreciate your feedback on those issues.

I also have to ask, in light of how extensive your experience is in non-MMO games prior to your Sony experience, how different are the issues you encounter in the two genres ?
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1. There are things to be improved in any industry. If there was nothing to be improved then people would stop trying. If I had a list of the the top three things of what could be improved it would be the following:
- Foster Communication within and between development teams for what works and what doesn"t.
- Focus on what the product is, not what it could be. Narrow things down to what are realistic goals, develop that core, then if time allows expand it but always maintain the core focus, never ever lose sight of it.
- Learn (and teach) not only from your own mistakes but those of others. Continuously re-evaluate against your goals. Success can teach a lot, failure can teach more. This is why post-mortems are always so valuable.

2. The only way to make them a reality is to actually put some ideas into practice. Prove that your method works and then explain to other people how you accomplished it. Blizzard does an excellent job of this. They have a method of development that works very well for them and they go to great lengths to explain those methods to others. The more studios who do this kind of thing the more those ideas can be combined, refined, and it pushes the whole thing forward.

They biggest differences between an MMO and any non-MMO games are these (sorry if this is obvious).

Scope- MMO"s are big, really big, they are often literally like making 5 (or more) other games at once. A "system" in an MMO can often be larger than other whole games. That inherently makes focus and polish exceptionally difficult. And as has been pointed out already, you need to be aware of scalability, at all times, in everything. "Sure Bob, that runs well with 5 avatars here, but what happens when we have 500?"

Time- It takes longer to develop things which are larger in scope. Also, another thing which has been pointed out in this discussion a couple times: Long term planning. Yes, you do have to plan ahead for 10 years. All systems should be geared for that and allow for growth, adaptation, and addition. This is really really hard because you have to play oracle and look way ahead into the future in an environment which completely flips itself around every four years or so.

Frontier- MMO"s by their very existence are new. They are a frontier of game development which is what makes it interesting and exciting... and unpredictable. It"s like going on Safari in the 1800"s. You might see things you"ve never seen before and come back with incredible stories... or you might get eaten by lions.
 
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Monsoon_foh

shitlord
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Ngruk said:
... Allow them to do what you pay them to do, while creatingpassionand energy in the team for the products, andeach other.
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I would highly advise against inciting intra-company lust. In-office romance almost never turns out good. Especially if they"re caught doing it in the paper supply room. Unless, of course, both of them are female. Hot ones. Then management should definitely let it fly under the radar. Especially at company parties after a few bottles of wine.
 
tyen

tyen

EQ in a browser wait time: ____
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CylusSoulreaver said:
Ultimately, it comes down to visibility. I currently sit two chairs down from my lead designer, three from the lead programmer and a short ways from the lead artist. They"re all out there on the floor, visibly working along side the rest of us. The fact that they aren"t closeting themselves up in an office like some CEO is quite a boon to the pipeline as well as general morale.
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Cylus is just mad that I can"t sit on his lap.
 
F

Fog_foh

shitlord
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Pancreas said:
If you are going to make a calculation a critical part of any game,it needs some sort of accurate representation, period.
Threat in WoW is completely invisible without 3rd party mods. And yet it will cripple any raid if it is not completely understood. This is really inexcusable in my opinion.

What players need is accurate feedback for every calculation they are subject to. How this feedback is delivered is something to be considered though.
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I strongly disagree. In many games of all sorts, limited information adds a layer of skill and decision-making to the game that isn"t present otherwise.

You could say the same thing about poker; your opponent"s cards aren"t visible unless you cheat. However, your opponents" cards are a hugely important unknown, and if you don"t consider what they might be, you will lose consistently. Is that "inexcusable?" It certainly doesn"t make poker less interesting.

At the same time, you need to incorporate the information you"re giving to (and withholding from) the player into your game design. Example: Before BWL, WoW threat was important, but less demanding of precision. Most fights just required you to keep a tank at the top of the threat list, so the tank had to try his best to keep threat and the DPS and healing classes needed to try to estimate where they were on the threat list so as not to draw aggro.

However, they changed the game, and started creating fights which were reliant on a more precise understanding of threat, like Vael in BWL, where a threat meter made things a lot easier. Soon after, threat continued to become more important to the point where players and Blizzard agreed (by the creation of threat meters) that accurate threat information should be given to the player.

Neither concealing or revealing threat (or mob HP, or player attributes, or hundreds of other things) by itself is a good or bad idea. What counts is how you adapt your game to the mechanics and rules you"ve set in place.
 
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Gecko_foh

shitlord
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Forgive me for jumping in late, but as a long time DBA working in IT, I see some issues here.

Dymus said:
1. There are things to be improved in any industry. If there was nothing to be improved then people would stop trying. If I had a list of the the top three things of what could be improved it would be the following:
-Foster Communication within and between development teams for what works and what doesn"t.
- Focus on what the product is, not what it could be. Narrow things down to what are realistic goals, develop that core, then if time allows expand it but always maintain the core focus, never ever lose sight of it.
- Learn (and teach) not only from your own mistakes but those of others. Continuously re-evaluate against your goals. Success can teach a lot, failure can teach more. This is why post-mortems are always so valuable.
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All these points are solely related to leadership. Good leadership encourages productive feedback and intergroup communications. It also enables teams not to have to reinvent the wheel.

The difference between strong, competent leadership is the difference between Vanguard and World of Warcraft, in a nutshell.

2. The only way to make them a reality is to actually put some ideas into practice. Prove that your method works and then explain to other people how you accomplished it. Blizzard does an excellent job of this. They have a method of development that works very well for them and they go to great lengths to explain those methods to others. The more studios who do this kind of thing the more those ideas can be combined, refined, and it pushes the whole thing forward.
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I disagree here completely. The proof is in the results. Consensus is the deathbed in a development environment. There needs to be a captain and a crew. The minute they are on equal footing, the inmates are running the asylum and you get another vapid, disorganized heap. Blizzard is transparent and succinct. They also are well led and run, which is why they are where they are.

The bigger problem isn"t the scope, size, or leadership, but the fact that the MMO industry is run by corporate suits with tunnel vision who solely can follow the monkey see, monkey do philosophy that has so interjected itself in games recently, and miss the big picture of MMOs and their real potential.
 
R

Requiem_foh

shitlord
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Just got forwarded a press release - Looks like they"ll be using the BigWorld platform. I take this as good news - they will be able to focus their resources on design and implementation rather than server/client/tools work, and the platform is supposedly able to predict hardware/network bottlenecks and provide you with a map of how things should be set up on the backend to prevent major problems(see: the first year of wow).

Back when the Uberworlds project was more serious and I was looking for the best MMO platform to court for a free license for them to use, I did quite a bit of research and BigWorld was the clear winner for several reasons.

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38 STUDIOS LICENSES BIGWORLD TECHNOLOGY SUITE

BigWorld Technology Suite to Provide Technical Foundation for Upcoming Original MMOG

MAYNARD, MA, February 26, 2007 - 38 Studios (www.38studios.com), a pioneering entertainment force delivering a broad spectrum of immersive products, today announced the company has entered into an agreement with BigWorld to license its BigWorld Technology Suite. The licensed engine will provide 38 Studios with the tools and technologies to support an unparalleled OEET, (Online Entertainment Experience), for its upcoming massively multiplayer online game.

"BigWorld provides the most proven, robust and technically solid game engine and toolset available, while still allowing us to be flexible and tailor the technology specifically to our game," said Jon Laff, 38 Studios" Chief Technology Officer.

Led by the artistic vision of Todd McFarlane and the enthralling storytelling of R. A. Salvatore, 38 Studios is developing an original IP - a world made up of fantastical elements, settings, characters, creatures, rules, and experiences. The IP will encompass multiple media forms including the online game experience that is currently scheduled for release in late 2010.

"38 Studios is in a unique position in the MMOG market with an exciting project underway," said Gavin Longhurst, Vice President of Business Development at BigWorld. "Our engine and toolset is very flexible, and allows them to use the technology in a very specific way that is ideal for long-term projects such as this. We are thrilled to be working with such a professional and talented group of game developers."

President and CEO of 38 Studios, Brett Close added, "In our current development phase, 38 Studios is focused on prototyping the exceptional quality of our signature Online Entertainment Experience. This process can only come from tools and technology designed to deliver flexibility, efficiency, performance, and processing power. By licensing the BigWorld Technology Suite, we are empowered as developers to exceed the expectations of gamers, and ultimately achieve cross-media market penetration based on a completely original IP."

About the BigWorld Technology Suite
Comprised of the BigWorld Server Software, Content Creation Pipeline, 3D Client Engine Package, Live Management Tools & Instrumentation, BigWorld Technology Suite is the only complete MMOG solution, providing all of the complex technology required to produce an engaging next-generation MMOG or Virtual Worlds.

About BigWorld Pty Ltd
BigWorld Pty Ltd was formed in 2002 to commercialize years of intense R&D, which started in 1999 and continues to this day. BigWorld Pty Ltd is a privately held company based in Australia that licenses its BigWorld Technology Suite middleware platform to game studios around the world that are looking to produce successful next-generation Massively Multiplayer Online Games and Virtual Worlds. Further information can be found on BigWorld websiteBigWorld Technology.

About 38 Studios
38 Studios, a media and entertainment company founded in 2006 by Curt Schilling, is developing an original fantasy IP driven by the creative and artistic visions of pop-culture icons R. A. Salvatore and Todd McFarlane. Entertainment products will include a massively immersive online entertainment experience that transcends the traditional MMO genre, novels, comics, toys, movies, TV, and more. For more information, visit38 Studios | World Domination Through Gaming.
 
Zehnpai

Zehnpai

Molten Core Raider
399
1,245
Fog said:
You could say the same thing about poker; your opponent"s cards aren"t visible unless you cheat. However, your opponents" cards are a hugely important unknown, and if you don"t consider what they might be, you will lose consistently. Is that "inexcusable?" It certainly doesn"t make poker less interesting.
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I really, really hate real life anlogies. You could make the argument that not showing threat is like not being able to see your own cards either. Also, you don"t know how many cards are in the deck so you can"t play the odds either. At which point you might as well just go play the slot machine.

Anyways...

Yea but after posting that, I noticed that BigWorld Technology - Games still has Stargate listed. Perhaps Stargate may be using their other tools or server/database software, not the actual client.
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Or they could have just not updated the list. Wouldn"t be the first time. I"ve seen our companies name posted all over websites despite not using their technology/services for 3+ years.
 
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Lonin_foh

shitlord
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So is 38 Studios just using the graphics engine in the suit as well, or is it doing something similar to SGW? The press release makes it sound like the former, but just wondering.
 
F

Fog_foh

shitlord
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Zehn - Vhex said:
I really, really hate real life anlogies. You could make the argument that not showing threat is like not being able to see your own cards either. Also, you don"t know how many cards are in the deck so you can"t play the odds either. At which point you might as well just go play the slot machine.
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I don"t understand. How could you make that argument? In WoW, you know quite a lot without the threat meter (more than you know about your opponent"s cards in poker!) You see about how much damage you"re doing, you have experience fighting with your tank so you know vaguely how much threat he produces, and you know who"s on top of the threat list right now because they"re getting attacked.

Anyway, I"m not trying to make some complicated analogy. I"m just pointing out one example of a game -- and there are many -- where limited information is used as an important component of the gameplay.
 
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