Hearthstone

Gavinmad_sl said:

Having watched a few different streamers play Patron warrior, it's a much better deck than you're giving it credit for. You seem to have just played a lot of people who lacked skill/had bad lists.

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Well from my experience (I played some patron warrior over the last couple days), it's good against most decks but HORRIBLE vs druid, it used to be pretty bad vs. zoo as well but the addition of the egg does help out that match-up quite a bit. The reason is basically druid gives you no time to develop a lethal hand before they are threatening large minions with their own combo behind it, and they have nothing to combo off of (usually everything is 3 attack or more, often with taunt). Druid is the most common deck on the ladder right now (at least where I am), so warrior has no presence there anymore, face hunter has also quietly become more rare as well which I am not as sure about.

As for zoo coming back, it's because of druid man, it's one of the best counter druid lists. You wouldn't even need imp gang boss, the harvest golem would still be good enough.

Haven't played this game since September, so i had some catching up to do. I like playing mage and since i had some dust lying around i made a ghetto mechmage deck without Antonidas and Boom (Pyroblast and Flamstrike in their place, man it felt dirty netdecking like that, completely unknown cards to me too lol). I went from Rank 23 to 10 in one sitting, only dropped a couple of games to hunters (one was winnable, but i was rusty and literally forgot what hunter secrets can do). That was while playing completely retarded and just lolspamming mechs on board. I mean, i played against this new patron warrior deck 4 times i think, it didn't stand a chance, their combo comes too late to make a difference. I didn't even know what i was facing and i won lol. I guess mechmage is the new zoo, right? No idea if this is good enough to make rank 5 or legend since shit starts to get real around rank 10, but that was a fun session.

Rank 7: Literally every game I have played today has been against Warlock. Mostly Zoo but more than a few Handlocks.

Tempo mage isn't working so I need a new deck.

Angelwatch_sl said:

Rank 7: Literally every game I have played today has been against Warlock. Mostly Zoo but more than a few Handlocks.

Tempo mage isn't working so I need a new deck.

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Face hunter is the natural predator of Warlocks (both of 'em).

slippery_sl said:

I love watching Hearthstone tournaments, but fuck me watching Lifecoach play is like watching grass grow

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Worth when he fucks up and loses his turn to rope (really though I would get so salty having to play that guy, fuck taking the entire turn every gd time).

Switched to control warrior and immediately got back to back huntards. Good matchup for me.

valishar_sl said:

Well from my experience (I played some patron warrior over the last couple days), it's good against most decks but HORRIBLE vs druid, it used to be pretty bad vs. zoo as well but the addition of the egg does help out that match-up quite a bit. The reason is basically druid gives you no time to develop a lethal hand before they are threatening large minions with their own combo behind it, and they have nothing to combo off of (usually everything is 3 attack or more, often with taunt). Druid is the most common deck on the ladder right now (at least where I am), so warrior has no presence there anymore, face hunter has also quietly become more rare as well which I am not as sure about.

As for zoo coming back, it's because of druid man, it's one of the best counter druid lists. You wouldn't even need imp gang boss, the harvest golem would still be good enough.

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Huh? Druid is one of the easiest match ups for patron warrior unless they get perfect draws in which case most decks are fucked anyway. Once you get a patron board going they have no way of clearing it. You really have to focus on massive card draw with this deck so keeping an acolyte + an activator is super important, especially vs druid where you can often get away with not having a starting axe. Vs most other decks you will probably have to prioritize weapons 1st and acolyte 2nd.

Anyone mind showing me a low-cost Priest deck that I can make? They seem to be the class I lose to the most, and I wanna give them a try.

Haven't played much in many months. Played a shitty arena, completely shitty draws as Shaman, went 2-3. Oh well, this guy seems good?

slippery_sl said:

I love watching Hearthstone tournaments, but fuck me watching Lifecoach play is like watching grass grow

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Yeah real fun watching Zoo, Face Hunter, and Stall mage. The plays so exciting! I'm on the edge of my seat as he turns that card then plays it..

This game is such a joke

Column_sl said:

Yeah real fun watching Zoo, Face Hunter, and Stall mage. The plays so exciting! I'm on the edge of my seat as he turns that card then plays it..

This game is such a joke

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You've been championing everyone playing face hunter for months! Which in fairness doesn't mean that you actually like the deck's dominance.

The problem is that aggro is simply too strong. Hearthstone is all about initiative and tempo. Aggro takes control of both of these. It forces other decks to, instantly, go on the defensive and be extremely reactive. When you are forced into a reactionary stance, it's extremely difficult to regain the initiative and stabilize. Especially against Face Hunter where many times you finally stabilize but so late in the game where the Hunter is already threatening lethal just with steady shot.

Another main problem with Aggro is the lack of a bad hand. Sure it happens but it's very rare for it to happen when 50% of your deck is made up of 1 or 2 cost cards and you top out at 5. Between the tempo/initiative issues I listed above and the ability to draw all of your high cost cards, "counter" aggro decks just don't work reliably enough.

There's a fallacy that control decks simply want to hero power until turn 5 when the "real" game starts. Control decks are forced to load up on cheap removal just to survive long enough to get their game going. But if you get a bad mulligan, you're left holding a fist full of 5+ cost cards while your opponent is dropping leper gnome, mad scientist, animal companion. GG you just lost. Control decks have a much higher chance of getting a bad hand.

Stall mage isn't an aggro deck. Control warrior isn't an aggro deck. That midrange pally that was big last season wasn't an aggro deck.

Aggro decks are the most popular because of how you get through games quicker. There is no way to combat that but make them strictly worse than late game decks, which I don't think anybody sensible wants.

Stock face hunter lists have been all over SeatStory Cup and now Hearthstone Spring Masters 2. It's not just a ladder thing where people pick aggro for speed.

Beat this guy playing zoo at rank nine and got the friend request. He was playing fuckingFACE HUNTER!!!!

HA! I played and beat the exact same guy when I was Rank 7. I remembered the name and an hour later noticed I had a friend request from him. I didn't accept it so I didn't get the same words of wisdom.

Angelwatch_sl said:

HA! I played and beat the exact same guy when I was Rank 7.

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Might be losing streak salt then. Pretty ironic to call any other player out when you are face hunting.

The Ancient_sl said:

Stall mage isn't an aggro deck. Control warrior isn't an aggro deck. That midrange pally that was big last season wasn't an aggro deck.

Aggro decks are the most popular because of how you get through games quicker. There is no way to combat that but make them strictly worse than late game decks, which I don't think anybody sensible wants.

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Those have the most efficient forms of removal across all classes. Win axe, deaths bite, frost bolt, skillstrike...pally has a million ways to deal with shit. But really all three of those decks are very susceptible to getting blown up by aggro.

I don't know that "aggro" is the problem as much as face hunter aggro.

Mech mage is aggressive but can curve into midrange and late combos and also needs to consider trading and think about what to play and when, how to use coin best, fireball for removal or saving for burst, etc.

Zoo matches everything Angel described in his lack of a bad hand statement, but it requires board control and trading and there are real counters to it. Of course lifetap is a very different dynamic than skilly shot.

Hunter just drops shit and starts spamming hero power by turn four. Which brings me back again to the hunter hero power being the most broken part of the whole thing. Everything else snowballs from that fucking skill shot shit.