Kirun
Buzzfeed Editor
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I feel like class design during Nick's tenure was perfect. But I also feel like class design after Nick's tenure is perfect. So...
Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO
- Thread starter Flobee
- Start date
fanaskin
Well known agitator
- 58,514
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elemantalist pets are really that good though in this game and their update thingy mentioned they will be leaning more into their pets than being "wiz light"
I could've written a LOT more to clarify what I was talking about, but you clearly did not get what I was saying. I know it's a meme at this point, but what you're describing is 'immersion', and contrary to popular belief, 'immersion' is not a positive thing if the experience you are immersed in is frustration and misery. I agree, consequences and 'danger' DO create immersion, players will be more 'immersed' in the outcome of a big fight if the consequences of losing are losing a level and having to embark on a hellish corpse run. Here's the thing though, you can EASILY make dying a consequence to be feared without possibly having to spend possible hours before you can start playing the game again. Even something as simple as giving players the option of respawning at the nearest 'safe spot' instead of their bind would be a massive improvement in player experience without compromising ANY 'immersion'. The consequence is still there, you just get to respawn nearby with your group instead of scattered around the world as you figure out a way to get everyone back before you can even START your corpse retrieval. The only emotion being 'lost' is frustration, and if that's the only cost of a QoL mechanic, it should be a no-brainer. This is the absolute MINIMUM that can be changed from EQ, you can do a lot more before you begin losing 'immersion'.
I could go on and on, but the point is, when EQ was in development, the goal wasn't to create an elitist game that's 'NoT fOr EvEryOnE'. No, the goal was to appeal to anyone interested in an online DnD style fantasy experience, it would've never reached 400k subs and ruled the genre for years if it didn't.
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fanaskin
Well known agitator
- 58,514
- 143,976
uniqueuser
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 1,982
- 6,594
The art still needs good stylization to take advantage of this, but MnM’s character designs are limited to amorphous blobs and noodle-armed stick figures. The game’s overall aesthetic is like a drab, lifeless cartoon mismatched with realistic environmental effects. Memorable for all the wrong reasons.
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rad
Lord of Guk
- 1,222
- 2,738
I'm really having fun with beta, but it needs more time to cook. The only bad move I think they can make at this point is entering EA too early and October might be pushing it.
The Wizard tears with the recent rework were priceless. Some of these idiots think they're already paying a sub.
As for Rogue it'll definitely be receiving a rework. Currently it's like a mashup of EQ/WOW but your entire kit is unlocked by 16. Pretty enjoyable on the class fantasy though. Hamming it up as a loot goblin, stealthing around dungeons, sniping named and occasionally stumbling across rotting treasure has scratched an itch.
The Wizard tears with the recent rework were priceless. Some of these idiots think they're already paying a sub.
As for Rogue it'll definitely be receiving a rework. Currently it's like a mashup of EQ/WOW but your entire kit is unlocked by 16. Pretty enjoyable on the class fantasy though. Hamming it up as a loot goblin, stealthing around dungeons, sniping named and occasionally stumbling across rotting treasure has scratched an itch.
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fanaskin
Well known agitator
- 58,514
- 143,976
Woefully Inept
Silver Baron of the Realm
- 10,110
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I don't fault you for not enjoying the style but this is just absolute nonsense. Lmao
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rad
Lord of Guk
- 1,222
- 2,738
I agree to an extent, but you unlock the kit by 16 and there is not a single skill you get after that. To your point, sounds like Fighters are in the same position.
Burns
Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
- 9,243
- 17,909
Rogues still have the whole poison system that can fill in for mechanics. It needs a whole work over though. Months ago I looked at trying to make the snare poison and it required specific drop from level 20+ Asps (not just any snake). From reading on the Discord, it's also a rare-ish drop, which makes it next to worthless for the vast majority of players.
I'm not sure what else could really fill in for rogues while still keeping it EQ like. It will be interesting to see what they can come up with.
I'm not sure what else could really fill in for rogues while still keeping it EQ like. It will be interesting to see what they can come up with.
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Hatorade
A nice asshole.
- 9,682
- 9,453
Patch notes, it is almost like wizard spells were fucked and needed damage increases. Who would have thought…
# Patch notes for 0.25.0.2
# Stat changes
* Clerics, Druids, Shamans, Rangers and Paladins now scale their ability damage off of Wisdom, not intelligence
# Wizard
* Seal of Magic III - you can now apply Mark of Magic to creatures up to level 64.
* Mark of Magic - Duration increased to 60 seconds
* Fixed an inconsistency where Arcane Volley and Fire Volley tooltips did not match the amount of missiles fired -
* Set glyphs and catalyst to cast while moving - This is just the very short cast time of the glyph itself, and wizards must stand still while the glyph-triggered spell is casting. This is seeing if we can improve the glyph casting experience for players with some lag and should not be a meaningful advantage otherwise. We are not trying to turn Wizards into bards, and they do need to stand still to cast the actual spells.
* Added an earlier tier for Iceblast at level 8.
* Reclaim Magic changed to target AOE - it will now be a bit easier to use when kiting.
* Combined Reclaim Magic and Arcane Acceleration into a single spell - using Reclaim Magic will return mana and apply or refresh your group spell haste buff. This frees up one extra slot on your spell bar.
* Removed Arcane Acceleration as a stand-alone spell - it no longer has a purpose as it's been combined with Reclaim Magic. You're not losing any abilities, it just got bundled up to be more convenient.
* Slightly increased the mana return on Mark of Magic
* Based on community feedback, we removed a few spells from being glyph-castable and replaced them with spells that may be used more frequently, or buffs that you don't want to sit and memorize in order to cast once per hour. This is going to be a challenging area to find a spell set for glyphs that will please everyone, so we're not planning to continue making changes to this. Any spells that are no longer glyph-castable are still available to memorize and cast normally.
* Removed - Arcane Acceleration, Bind Vision, Wall of Force
* Added - Spellshield, Seal of Magic, Sense Magic
* We also took another balancing pass on damage spells, based on early play data and constructive player feedback. Please give your damage spells a try and post your feedback in the new threads set up for this.
# Druids
* Reduced Mantle of Winter and Mantle of Summer to a 15 minute cooldown.
* Currently the buffs provided by seasons are very strong, which is balanced by the natural rate of change for seasons.
* If we make it faster and easier to change seasons at will, the buffs offered by seasons will need to be less impactful as it was meant to be a bonus where you get a large benefit for a season, but could not easily get all the larger benefits in a short period of time.
* We fixed the bug that would sometimes cause seasons to shift unusually, or prevent Mantle of Summer or Winter from correctly setting your season. Please let us know if you run into any unexpected season transitions.
* Embers DoT spells have a shorter cast time
* We made some improvements the Ray of Sun and Winter's Chill damage spell lines. We'll continue to evaluate other druid spells in the next few days.
* Druids, along with a few other classes, will be getting bonus spell damage and healing based on their Wisdom scores. We wanted to hold off on adjust any Druid spells until this Wisdom change rolls out and we get a bit of play data. We will be keeping an eye on Druid feedback and do plan to revisit the class and address any concerns soon.
* We are evaluating additional tuning and updates for druids over the next few days.
* There have already been some very helpful and constructive posts in the Druid feedback thread - so give the Wisdom change a try and then share your thoughts with us. Thanks!
# Stat changes
* Clerics, Druids, Shamans, Rangers and Paladins now scale their ability damage off of Wisdom, not intelligence
# Wizard
* Seal of Magic III - you can now apply Mark of Magic to creatures up to level 64.
* Mark of Magic - Duration increased to 60 seconds
* Fixed an inconsistency where Arcane Volley and Fire Volley tooltips did not match the amount of missiles fired -
* Set glyphs and catalyst to cast while moving - This is just the very short cast time of the glyph itself, and wizards must stand still while the glyph-triggered spell is casting. This is seeing if we can improve the glyph casting experience for players with some lag and should not be a meaningful advantage otherwise. We are not trying to turn Wizards into bards, and they do need to stand still to cast the actual spells.
* Added an earlier tier for Iceblast at level 8.
* Reclaim Magic changed to target AOE - it will now be a bit easier to use when kiting.
* Combined Reclaim Magic and Arcane Acceleration into a single spell - using Reclaim Magic will return mana and apply or refresh your group spell haste buff. This frees up one extra slot on your spell bar.
* Removed Arcane Acceleration as a stand-alone spell - it no longer has a purpose as it's been combined with Reclaim Magic. You're not losing any abilities, it just got bundled up to be more convenient.
* Slightly increased the mana return on Mark of Magic
* Based on community feedback, we removed a few spells from being glyph-castable and replaced them with spells that may be used more frequently, or buffs that you don't want to sit and memorize in order to cast once per hour. This is going to be a challenging area to find a spell set for glyphs that will please everyone, so we're not planning to continue making changes to this. Any spells that are no longer glyph-castable are still available to memorize and cast normally.
* Removed - Arcane Acceleration, Bind Vision, Wall of Force
* Added - Spellshield, Seal of Magic, Sense Magic
* We also took another balancing pass on damage spells, based on early play data and constructive player feedback. Please give your damage spells a try and post your feedback in the new threads set up for this.
# Druids
* Reduced Mantle of Winter and Mantle of Summer to a 15 minute cooldown.
* Currently the buffs provided by seasons are very strong, which is balanced by the natural rate of change for seasons.
* If we make it faster and easier to change seasons at will, the buffs offered by seasons will need to be less impactful as it was meant to be a bonus where you get a large benefit for a season, but could not easily get all the larger benefits in a short period of time.
* We fixed the bug that would sometimes cause seasons to shift unusually, or prevent Mantle of Summer or Winter from correctly setting your season. Please let us know if you run into any unexpected season transitions.
* Embers DoT spells have a shorter cast time
* We made some improvements the Ray of Sun and Winter's Chill damage spell lines. We'll continue to evaluate other druid spells in the next few days.
* Druids, along with a few other classes, will be getting bonus spell damage and healing based on their Wisdom scores. We wanted to hold off on adjust any Druid spells until this Wisdom change rolls out and we get a bit of play data. We will be keeping an eye on Druid feedback and do plan to revisit the class and address any concerns soon.
* We are evaluating additional tuning and updates for druids over the next few days.
* There have already been some very helpful and constructive posts in the Druid feedback thread - so give the Wisdom change a try and then share your thoughts with us. Thanks!
Quaid
Trump's Staff
- 12,641
- 7,275
15 minute mantle cooldown is a step in the right direction. I think it should be 5 minutes but that's just based on my feels and how I like to play Druid.
The Druid seasons should be auras though.
Winter: +10% Healing Received
Summer: +10% Casting Haste
If 10% is too high you could fiddle with that. I'm not familiar enough at all to speak on those specifics. But this would ensure competitiveness with Shaman and Cleric at the top end, and will force multi-group comps to include more than just a lone druid for resist buffs/debuffs.
Valorath
Vyemm Raider
- 1,428
- 2,831
The healing output on druid is incredible now. I was worried about losing Nature's Respite (10 minute CD mini lay hands), but it's really not been an issue. The new healing spell they added that can only be used in Summer is currently a complete heal for the tank in my static.. which does make it a bit of an efficiency issue, since I'm never going to land it when he's at 1 HP (since you already have to have used the Touch line to get the higher potency on the Summer heal). Works great for healing a charmed pet from low HP though! As the tank gets more HP I'll be able to use it more.
I have not had any issues with shifting seasons unintentionally, though I primarily play in summer and just heal the group. I have also not really tried to go back and forth between damage and healing in my normal role in the static. We've been in a spot I can charm a pet this week, and I don't have the bandwidth to heal the party, maintain the pet, and try to get nukes in. I have, however, pulled a two-hour stint in a group as DPS. Staying in winter and just nuking felt pretty good, the mana/damage ratio was fine. Interested in trying it out after the change making wisdom increase damage - my ability to solo some stuff I'd been soloing easily was reduced drastically at the beginning of the week with the TTK changes and the class changes coming at the same time. We'll see if the wis change helps that.
edit: not sure what to make of Spring and Autumn. Losing the Summer Grace (healing line) and Winter's Wrath (dmg line) by being in the mana regen stance doesn't seem worth it. Admittedly, I do have an enchanter in my static so mana regen is less of an issue.
I have not had any issues with shifting seasons unintentionally, though I primarily play in summer and just heal the group. I have also not really tried to go back and forth between damage and healing in my normal role in the static. We've been in a spot I can charm a pet this week, and I don't have the bandwidth to heal the party, maintain the pet, and try to get nukes in. I have, however, pulled a two-hour stint in a group as DPS. Staying in winter and just nuking felt pretty good, the mana/damage ratio was fine. Interested in trying it out after the change making wisdom increase damage - my ability to solo some stuff I'd been soloing easily was reduced drastically at the beginning of the week with the TTK changes and the class changes coming at the same time. We'll see if the wis change helps that.
edit: not sure what to make of Spring and Autumn. Losing the Summer Grace (healing line) and Winter's Wrath (dmg line) by being in the mana regen stance doesn't seem worth it. Admittedly, I do have an enchanter in my static so mana regen is less of an issue.
Apostolos
Golden Knight of the Realm
- 448
- 231
I never got a key, but did mess around a bit during the open week. There were really three main things that struck me.
The first was the lack of a map. I know it's the same basically as EQ at release, but struggling with basic direction was more frustration than immersion. At least a mini map to aid in your own personal sense of at least knowing which street you were on would go a long way.
The second (and this goes with #3 a lot) was how dead the world feels. So little npc interactions (among themselves) or even walking around the world making it feel like they had actual lives.
So difficult to find quests. I thought more npc's needed to have more interconnected breadcrumb conversations leading to other quest npcs.
The first was the lack of a map. I know it's the same basically as EQ at release, but struggling with basic direction was more frustration than immersion. At least a mini map to aid in your own personal sense of at least knowing which street you were on would go a long way.
The second (and this goes with #3 a lot) was how dead the world feels. So little npc interactions (among themselves) or even walking around the world making it feel like they had actual lives.
So difficult to find quests. I thought more npc's needed to have more interconnected breadcrumb conversations leading to other quest npcs.
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