NVidia GeForce RTX 40x0 cards - x2 the power consumption, x2 the performance

Mist

Mist

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Kirun said:
Power-throttled to what though? You're power throttling to the same wattage as a 4080 and beating its performance by 30%? Same VRAM and everything? I'd like to see the math on that one.
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Yes, if you choke the power on a 4090 to the rated TDP of a 4080 you will still get ~30% more performance. My point is that the 4090 is 30% more money for >60% more CUDA cores, that's fucking huge. 16128 vs 9728.
 
Kirun

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Mist said:
Yes, if you choke the power on a 4090 to the rated TDP of a 4080 you will still get ~30% more performance.
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Have the math? I'm not saying I don't believe you, I just need to see it.
 
Xexx

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Has 13900k and 4090 and plays no games....


but when i see a game to play i'll be so prepared..
 
Mist

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Kirun said:
Have the math? I'm not saying I don't believe you, I just need to see it.
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Considering the 4080 isn't actually out yet, no, but it's pretty obvious from what we've already seen out of testing the 4090 with a 60% power limit, and then comparing to a 3080 ti which has more CUDA cores than a 4080.

I think the 4080 is going to be an absolute dud of a card for the price they're asking.
 
Springbok

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Xexx said:
Has 13900k and 4090 and plays no games....


but when i see a game to play i'll be so prepared..
Click to expand...
I just put together a 7700x 4090 system to get on the new socket (had originally purchased 13600k, but decided to take advantage of a sweet mobo/ddr5/cpu deal and wait for 7800x3d next spring).

Kind of in same boat, though Plague Tale, new COD, and CP2077 look absolutely unreal with everything turned on. Just need a good ATX 3.0 PSU to come out and I'll feel set for awhile. .
 
Bubbles

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the funniest thing would be the Corsair guy who blasted GN and Guru3D about that adapter and forced the company to make a public apology, to tweet something like "seems like the adapter aint that smart after all"
 
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gak

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Mist

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Leadsalad said:
Eh, that doesn't make any sense though. The pin part of the adapter is melting, not the cable part.

Click to expand...
The part that's going to melt is going to be the part where the resistance happens. If there's a break at the end of the pin and it has to build up energy to overcome a gap, that's where the heat is going to be.

Dumbed down explanation but that's my understanding of EE.
 
mkopec

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Those small ass pins along with the small ass gauge on those wires is jut not suited for so much wattage running through it. Maybe it did in the 100w-150w days but these cards pushing 500w+ is insane on small ass connector pins like that. Shit my kids car stereo that we installed this summer was a 500W amp (which is peak power btw) had a 10 gauge power wire with a copper 10mm crimped connector on it to run it. Maybe the 10 gauge was overkill for the amp but you have to think of the distance too which is about 8 feet from the battery to trunk. Either way I just dont think these small ass connector pins and the tiny wires are enough to push the wattage through them these new 4090 monsters draw. They need to think about a new standard which utilizes better connectors suited for the amount of wattage these things draw now.

The resistance IS the fucking small ass wires and pins. Bigger the wire and plug the less resistance. At least its how I understand it. Ever tried to run a space heater or some other really high wattage appliance at home with a small ass extension cord? shit gets hot really fucking fast. This is why they have amperage ratings on cords and such. And the below is for copper, do they even use coppper wires in PSUs?

1667006146706.png
 
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spronk

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wish i had a microcenter near me, nice deal 79xx CPU + 32gb memory + mobo for like $500 total
slickdeals.net

Microcenter 32GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5 5600 Memory Kit for Free with In-Store Purchase of AMD Ryzen 7700x 7900x 7950x Processor

This deal just got better with additional $50 off when buying with a motherboard. FREE 32GB DDR5-5600 RAM and $50 Motherboard Bundle Savings Applies to 7700x, 7900x 7950x ...
slickdeals.net slickdeals.net

newegg also has this mini lian tower with 750W psu (small FF so no 4090s lol) for $170
www.newegg.com

LIAN LI O11D MINI-X Black With SP750 (750W) SFX PSU / Aluminum / Tempered Glass ATX Mini Tower Computer Case -- O11D MINI750-X - Newegg.com

Buy LIAN LI O11D MINI-X Black With SP750 (750W) SFX PSU / Aluminum / Tempered Glass ATX Mini Tower Computer Case -- O11D MINI750-X with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!
www.newegg.com www.newegg.com
 
Nemesis

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spronk said:
newegg also has this mini lian tower with 750W psu (small FF so no 4090s lol) for $170
www.newegg.com

LIAN LI O11D MINI-X Black With SP750 (750W) SFX PSU / Aluminum / Tempered Glass ATX Mini Tower Computer Case -- O11D MINI750-X - Newegg.com

Buy LIAN LI O11D MINI-X Black With SP750 (750W) SFX PSU / Aluminum / Tempered Glass ATX Mini Tower Computer Case -- O11D MINI750-X with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!
www.newegg.com www.newegg.com
Click to expand...
incorrect, sir!

 
Xexx

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Shoved my old system into a Torrent Compact to send to best friend - 12900k and 3090Ti, i couldnt stomach selling it for less than 50% of its original cost so it was better to give it away.

Still havent used my 4090, will give this rig to gf when the X3D comes out next year and i go full AMD.
 
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Fadaar

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mkopec said:
Those small ass pins along with the small ass gauge on those wires is jut not suited for so much wattage running through it. Maybe it did in the 100w-150w days but these cards pushing 500w+ is insane on small ass connector pins like that. Shit my kids car stereo that we installed this summer was a 500W amp (which is peak power btw) had a 10 gauge power wire with a copper 10mm crimped connector on it to run it. Maybe the 10 gauge was overkill for the amp but you have to think of the distance too which is about 8 feet from the battery to trunk. Either way I just dont think these small ass connector pins and the tiny wires are enough to push the wattage through them these new 4090 monsters draw. They need to think about a new standard which utilizes better connectors suited for the amount of wattage these things draw now.

The resistance IS the fucking small ass wires and pins. Bigger the wire and plug the less resistance. At least its how I understand it. Ever tried to run a space heater or some other really high wattage appliance at home with a small ass extension cord? shit gets hot really fucking fast. This is why they have amperage ratings on cords and such. And the below is for copper, do they even use coppper wires in PSUs?

View attachment 440329
Click to expand...

yeah I work on aircraft and have had to do mods to upsize wiring because engineers had a derp moment. usually going from 22 to 20.
 
Mist

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mkopec said:
Those small ass pins along with the small ass gauge on those wires is jut not suited for so much wattage running through it. Maybe it did in the 100w-150w days but these cards pushing 500w+ is insane on small ass connector pins like that. Shit my kids car stereo that we installed this summer was a 500W amp (which is peak power btw) had a 10 gauge power wire with a copper 10mm crimped connector on it to run it. Maybe the 10 gauge was overkill for the amp but you have to think of the distance too which is about 8 feet from the battery to trunk. Either way I just dont think these small ass connector pins and the tiny wires are enough to push the wattage through them these new 4090 monsters draw. They need to think about a new standard which utilizes better connectors suited for the amount of wattage these things draw now.

The resistance IS the fucking small ass wires and pins. Bigger the wire and plug the less resistance. At least its how I understand it. Ever tried to run a space heater or some other really high wattage appliance at home with a small ass extension cord? shit gets hot really fucking fast. This is why they have amperage ratings on cords and such. And the below is for copper, do they even use coppper wires in PSUs?

View attachment 440329
Click to expand...
Which pins are you referring to? The top 4 pins are just for sideband signaling for the ATX 3.0 PSUs.
 
mkopec

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Mist said:
Which pins are you referring to? The top 4 pins are just for sideband signaling for the ATX 3.0 PSUs.
Click to expand...
Well one of those pins obviously is the power, right? And even if you split that 500w into 3 connectors its still 160+ watts each on a 20 or 22 AWG wire.
 
mkopec

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There is 2 ways to get around this problem, use bigger connectors and bigger wire or convert the 12v current design of the cards to 24v which will halve the amps the wire and connector carries.

  • 120 Watts @ 12V = 12 Amps
  • 120 Watts @ 24V = 6 Amps
  • 120 Watts @ 120V = 1 Amp
All the charts im reading say you need at least a 14-10 AWG wire for 150W @ 12v Its kinda sketchy because they use shit like 15m length, where the computer obv does not need that length, but still this goes to show that those wires and 1mm pin connectors are just way too fucking small for the wattage required.
 
Mist

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mkopec said:
Well one of those pins obviously is the power, right? And even if you split that 500w into 3 connectors its still 160+ watts each on a 20 or 22 AWG wire.
Click to expand...

ATX 3.0 Power Supply Connectors and Pinouts

Intel's ATX 3.0 specification, connectors and pinouts. Diagram, pinout and wire colors of PCIe 12VHPWR auxiliary connector.
www.smpspowersupply.com www.smpspowersupply.com

So 6 of the 12 main pins are 12v. So for a 600w adapter (the max possible under this new spec) that's 100w per pin, though most of these are supposed to be 450w adapters so 75w per pin.

1667101244778.png
 
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