Retirement... (i.e. what are you going to be after you've grown up)
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Cad
scientia potentia est
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I've never bought any kind of life insurance, term or otherwise. My kids and wife would just have to make due with my millions of fucking dollars, boo hoo.
If you accumulate assets instead of spending it, you don't need life insurance.
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Cad
scientia potentia est
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A lot of it is tax dodging for people over the estate tax threshold. Theoretically lower returns make sense to pass it tax free rather than pay Uncle Sam.
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Burren
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Furry
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OU Ariakas
Diet Dr. Pepper Enjoyer
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It's really weird that it started as him hating on a dude trying to help the most financially ignorant group out there and then turned into him hating on something designed for truly wealthy people because he is financially ignorant about its true purpose.....
Burren
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Do you have any idea how much financial and legal risk there is in lying to people with money, who have lawyers?
Gravel
Mr. Poopybutthole
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This is the way I've always felt about it.
Insurance makes sense for someone if they need to provide for their kids during their earning year, and before the kids leave the house.
Once you have assets, they can live off those if you die.
The only kind of insurance like that that I've ever considered would be umbrella, just in case some asshat sued me.
BrutulTM
Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
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Cad
scientia potentia est
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Tons of things are bullshit but make sense for an individual person, and some things are judge hedges against market events or losses when you are rich enough.
Look at it this way - if you have $50M, your goal isn't necessarily to make $100M, it's to ensure you keep your $50M and stay in front of your spending. You REALLY don't want to end up poor again, so you buy some structured financial products with $10M of it (that also bypass probate and go straight to your kids on death, so no estate tax) that also are very unlikely to tank in the event the market (or your business that got you the $50M in the first place) tanks.
That is a super simplified reason, but thats a justification that some people use. Me, I'd just move some into safer investments, but different strokes for different folks. I don't think Burren or others like him are "scammers" in the sense, UNLESS they are marketing or trying to push their products on people they KNOW it isn't suitable for. Which is what I have absolutely seen happen with Northwestern Mutual with my own eyes. If Burren does shit like them then yea, thats shady and borderline unethical in my opinion.
If he's selling rich people tax avoidance and hedge strategies then it's just rich people doing rich people things.
Just my $0.02.
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Cad
scientia potentia est
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An umbrella is insurance against personal liability which is completely not the same thing as any kind of life insurance at all. Anybody with assets should have a $1-2M umbrella, they are cheap as shit and you never know what might happen.
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Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Burren
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Estate planning, business planning for c-suite and boards, and tax-free income when it makes sense. We also do managed money and variable assets. This shit isn’t rocket science. The solutions are hundreds of years old.
FFS, I do planning for some of the nation’s largest banks, law firms, and RIAs. You think these people are getting scammed? No, they have brilliant minds that understand leverage and diversification. Most of America doesn’t hear of this stuff or understand it because it’s not appropriate or applicable to them.
I’m not calling you out Cad, I know you get it. Just piggie-backing off your post.
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Cad
scientia potentia est
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It's tough though because the life insurance people absolutely do position non-wealthy people as "protecting their family" if they buy these structured whole life insurance products... when they'd be better off doing just about anything else. You may not do it, and thats fine, but it's like me denying some lawyers are predatory shitbags... there absolutely are plenty of predatory shitbags and people need to look out.
The default reaction of hearing annuity/life insurance broker is, for most normal people, immediately thinking "scam" and they're not wrong.
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Burren
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Very true. A lot are shit. Same with doctors. Same with teachers. Same with _________.
End of the day, nothing we have talked about here affects me. Just trying to add value to the conversation and make people aware of what’s out there that might fit their needs. You want a Simple SEP or you want to put $1000/mo into SMAs, that’s cool. I’ll refer you to one of my assistants. It’s not like we don’t help everyone. I just don’t. Like I’m sure you don’t do pro bono work.
This reminds of why I just say I do financial planning when people ask what I do.
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Control
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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I'm poor, but I enjoy knowing things. At what point, or in what situations, should people start doing things that might not be commonly known?
Rangoth
Vyemm Raider
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I’m trying to get close myself, currently 43 and with any luck I hope to be retired by 45, for sure before 50. As others have said I have plenty to do, but for me it’s not about being tied to teams meetings, my inbox, whatever drama of the day went down(office job). it Used to be about money for me but not anymore, I’m just sick of being tethered and my new job is not flexible at all(previous one was) so I’m feeling the sting particularly hard.
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BrutulTM
Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
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That's fine. For the vast majority of people it's a terrible way to invest your money and whether or not Burren is doing it, other people are aggressively marketing it to people who barely have anything to invest and they are getting sold on "infinite banking" horseshit that is being advertised as a smart and sound investment when it will mean orders of magnitude less money when you retire if you fall for it and keep doing it for a long time. My grandfather bought a couple of them and I have received these sales pitches myself and you would think they are giving you the keys to a happy life when all they're doing is ruining your retirement for their own gain. I'll take your word for it that there are rich people fucking around with it to avoid taxes etc, but 95% of people should run away from that shit and any national radio program would be irresponsible to say anything else.
EDIT: BTW, annuities pay very high commissions for obvious reasons so financial advisors have a lot of incentive to rationalize why people should buy them. Conversely, they can't make much money at all by telling people to invest in index funds or simple mutual funds.
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