The Big Bad Console Thread - Sway your Station with an Xboner !

Adam Orth's twitter is now protected. He fucked up, big time. You don't just say "I don't see what the big deal is with always online" and then when people FUCKING EXPLAIN why, such as where they live, why Diablo and SimCity have failed, tell people "Why would I want to live there" or "Deal with it" in meme form. Fuck man, based on that smugness alone I already almost don't wanna touch the next 360. We all know EXACTLY why though every company is pushing for always on; it's all about money in they end.

I'm fine with an "always-online" XBOX, if the online verification/check is done at the time the hardware is turned on/booted. I'm good with the console itself doing a verification, I just don't want the individual games I'm playing to have to be hosted on an online server like D3 or Sim City 5. That's where the problems come in, a hugely popular game launches and the servers go to sh*t. Happens every time. Happens with MMOs & their expansions as well as D3 and SC5.

Make the console be verified and online to be able to play games, but don't make every single game have to be online with its own dedicated servers. That's a recipe for disaster.

The problem is not on the user end of things. I can count the number of times my internet has been down for any significant amount of time in the last decade on one hand. The problem is with the servers on the other end(generally at launch)

ha. yeah. neogaf had a huge thread on that yesterday.
They didn't think any news sites would pick it up.

My favorite was when someone pointed out, when my mobile phone looses its connection, I can still play the games.



As a primarily PC gamer, and 90% of may games are bought on Steam... I'd be a bit of a hypocrite to get too angry. but for what I want my consoles to do, being online isn't one of them. Hell, having a game system in a place where I DON'T have cable or satellite is one of the reasons.

A better question is why doesn't my vacuum cleaner have an internet connection so I can upload to facebook when I vacuum?

Achievement unlocked* You made your bed.
Achievement unlocked* You vacuumed the living room 5/300.

The problem with the new Xbox is that it is not being designed as a game console but as a media consumption device. I mean the PS4 is also going to be a media consumption device but at least Sony is designing it for games first whereas for Microsoft it is the other way around: media consumption first, games second. So of course Microsoft is going to be making a few bone headed decisions. There was a good article recently by one of the Xbox's original devs lambasting Microspft on this very subject.

If this "rumor" wasn't true, why would someone like Adam Orth bother to so vehemently defend the notion that always having to be connected to the Internet is not a big deal?

Xalara_sl said:

The problem with the new Xbox is that it is not being designed as a game console but as a media consumption device. I mean the PS4 is also going to be a media consumption device but at least Sony is designing it for games first whereas for Microsoft it is the other way around: media consumption first, games second. So of course Microsoft is going to be making a few bone headed decisions. There was a good article recently by one of the Xbox's original devs lambasting Microspft on this very subject.

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Unfortunately, the Nintendo Wii proved that you don't need anywhere close to the best or most powerful system to be the "best selling" system. Ultimately, Microsoft and Sony don't give a rats ass if they have the most powerful game system, or the system with the best graphics, they just want to sell the most systems(and software). When you have games like Minecraft, Angry Birds, Wii Fit, etc become some of the best selling games of the last generation, the focus is now on the casual gamer. Hell, look at how many systems Sony sold just because their system was a blu-ray player. I have many friends who haven't gamed on their PS3 in years, but still use it as their primary blu-ray player.

If Microsoft wants to release more of a media device than a game system, it could still end up being the best selling system, and that's all they care about. It may not be the best choice for hardcore(online) gamers, but that's a very small percentage of the market nowadays, not something they really need to cater to extensively in order to sell a lot of units.

Eyashusa_sl said:

If this "rumor" wasn't true, why would someone like Adam Orth bother to so vehemently defend the notion that always having to be connected to the Internet is not a big deal?

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Well, if you go through the reddit thread, people who have worked with him have said that he's a completely insufferably douchebag and a total asshole to work with. He'll probably defend any idiotic notion in he believes in to the death.

And soooooo lol at him demanding that others call him "Sweet Billy" and refuse to talk to them if they don't.

Microsoft is really going to have to fuckingwowme at their upcoming conference to get me to buy one now though. If Microsoft can't convince me to play games on their systems over Sony's then I'm not sure I see the point in buying one, even as a collector. With this last generation Microsoft was a pretty easy choice since Sony's controller was ass, their online was terrible forever, and for a long while X360 games had a slight edge in performance and some games still pop up with huge issues like Skyrim even though performance is near identical 99% of the time now.

However, it looks like Sony's fixed all but one of my gripes with the PS4 controller. The stick placement is still stupid, but the grip looks vastly improved and the triggers aren't retarded anymore. So I can deal with the sticks being in a dumb place. Their online has improved a lot and PS+ is an absurdly better value than XBL Gold plus they look to be having a ton of new awesome features in the PS4 like the Sharing stuff and built in streaming. And finally, from every rumor I've heard, the PS4 is a more powerful machine unless Microsoft changes its specs to match them, but even then developers have said that Sony allows them a hell of a lot deeper and freer access to the hardware and that it's easier to work with over Microsoft's restrictions.

Plus, if they really go through with the Always Online thing I just don't think I could support them. It might not ever affect me, but the thought that it'd totally screw over our servicemen really pisses me the fuck off.

To top that all off, Microsoft has jack and shit as far as exclusives go anymore. I love Halo and all, but not enough to buy a console for just that and never play anything else on it. They are sitting on a bunch of good IPs still, but that means dick all if they never fucking use them:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microso...and_properties

joeboo_sl said:

Unfortunately, the Nintendo Wii proved that you don't need anywhere close to the best or most powerful system to be the "best selling" system. Ultimately, Microsoft and Sony don't give a rats ass if they have the most powerful game system, or the system with the best graphics, they just want to sell the most systems(and software). When you have games like Minecraft, Angry Birds, Wii Fit, etc become some of the best selling games of the last generation, the focus is now on the casual gamer. Hell, look at how many systems Sony sold just because their system was a blu-ray player. I have many friends who haven't gamed on their PS3 in years, but still use it as their primary blu-ray player.

If Microsoft wants to release more of a media device than a game system, it could still end up being the best selling system, and that's all they care about. It may not be the best choice for hardcore(online) gamers, but that's a very small percentage of the market nowadays, not something they really need to cater to extensively in order to sell a lot of units.

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The Wii may have sold the most hardware, but it also collected the most dust. It had an absolutely pathetic software library that didn't sell shit outside of Wii Fit and Mario Kart. Nintendo dropped the ball hardcore on the system having a good game library. They basically got lucky and hit a market that's now all moved on to mobile devices.

You're also totally wrong about gamers being a small percentage of the market. The big games that sell are all still gamer's games on consoles. Call of Duty, Skyrim, Assassin's Creed, Far cry, etc. The only "casual" franchise that pulls good numbers is the Just Dance series. Consoles are, and will continue to be, for gamers.

And you know all that media crap that Microsoft does? Sony doesevery single bit of it too. Netflix, Hulu, Crunchyroll, whatever your streaming media poison is, they have it too (and their apps for them are usuallybetter). Plus, unlike Microsoft,they don't charge you to use it. The PS3 also works as a great media server and the PS4 is going to have that amazing Game Streaming service built right into it which is a pretty huge thing. Easily streaming the games you play and being able to easily capture your own gameplay footage is going to be awesome.

Maybe I'm just jaded as fuck, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say if the next XBox does indeed have an always-online requirement, its still going to be the best-selling Microsoft console of all-time. Why? Because the vast majority of people are dumb as shit culture-programmed zombie consumers and will eagerly bend over and buy it if some washed-up celebrity in a TV ad says they've got to have it in order to be cool.

Its been pretty clear for some time. "bend over and take it" has been the prevailing mindset.

ThunderCougarFalconBird_sl said:

Maybe I'm just jaded as fuck, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say if the next XBox does indeed have an always-online requirement, its still going to be the best-selling Microsoft console of all-time. Why? Because the vast majority of people are dumb as shit culture-programmed zombie consumers and will eagerly bend over and buy it if some washed-up celebrity in a TV ad says they've got to have it in order to be cool.

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Well, I'm going to go with optimism over being jaded. I think consumers deserve a bit more credit than that. The PS3 beat out the X360 in Europe and absolutely destroyed it in Japan. The main reason the PS3 lost in the US was due to being out 1 Year Later + the ridiculously high price tag. People are still reeling over the X360's absurd hardware failures of the first 2-3 years of the console's life and are going to be extremely wary about being early adopters. Sony doesn't have that stigma and if they launch at about the same time and the PS4 is reasonably priced, I'm betting on there being a $399.99 model, then I think Microsoft is fucked unless they seriously blow people away.

I also think that consumers are savvy enough now that if Microsoft does go for "Always Online" they will call them on it being terrible. Social Media spreads things like wild fire now a days, far more than it did during the early days of the previous generation, and people aren't blind to what's happened with shit like SimCity.

I am getting pretty sick of the need to be "outraged" at everything right now. It seems so much worse in the gaming/internet culture. I understand the need for people to pick sides, and have "a team" so to speak, but the growing need to be "OUTRAGED" at anything you don't like or don't agree with is just dumb. I have an xbox/ps3/Wii, I have no idea where my Wii is, my ps3 is my bluray player and I buy most games on the xbox. I like the xbox controller and ecosystem better. It has nothing to do with liking Microsoft or Sony. I don't have any brand loyalty. I simply buy what offers me what I want at the best price. If MS has some box that locks everything behind internet connected DRM and I cant play it offline at all, I will simply buy what Sony is offering. I don't need to be outraged at what they are doing, I am sure they have a really good reason for it. Whether that reason aligns with my needs has yet to be seen, but again I am not going to be outraged at what they are doing.

Any way, thinking about it rationally... Why would they even do this? Their model is based on XBLA subscriptions and money from hardware and game sales. Online only is going to cut at least 1/3 of their sales. Are they going to make up that extra 1/3 in licensing fees from publishers? I doubt it. While publishers do loose money on pirating and used games sales, they still need the biggest install base to sell games. Limiting themselves to the internet only crowd just does not make sense. I do see advantages to online only, but the disadvantages VASTLY outweigh them. And if my dumb ass can come up with that, I am sure the teams and teams of smart folks over at MS can to.

Anyway, I bet $20 bucks that this whole fiasco of a rumor spawned from a devkit that required an internet connection to work. Which makes perfect sense for a company that wants to keep a tight leash on their pre-release devkits.

But seriously, when does your internet ever go down for any longer than it takes to just reboot your modem/router? My internet is only down when my power is out, which is maybe once every few years.. and if your power is out you aren't doing shit, regardless.

Like I said earlier, always-on DRMs problem isn't the local users connection, 99% of the time it's the servers on the game/publishers end.

pretty sure my power goes out more then my net.

But you know what? I have a generator.
Parents have a lake house. which doesnt have cable or satellite. having a game system there is nice.
Taking a game system to a hotel room, or vacation. ski lodge, etc.
As always having to depend on the reliably of their services is shit.

Forces everyone to buy a router. Where in your house was your game system? are you going to be able to use Wifi? or will you need to run cables?
Either FORCING the issue is dumb. Having no opt out is horseshit.

Lol:http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/a...onnection.aspx

We received an official statement from Microsoft, via the company's PR firm Edelman, concerning the tweets sent by Microsoft Studios' creative director Adam Orth last evening.

The statement reads as follows:

"We are aware of the comments made by an employee on Twitter. This person is not a spokesperson for Microsoft, and his personal views are not reflective of those of the company. We have not made any announcements about our product roadmap, and have no further comment on this matter."