Weight Loss Thread

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

Whether or not he's lying gotta give him credit for the patented "Can't do it anymore bros, those were the old days."

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C'mon now, you've done the same in past threads on FOH!

Eomer_sl said:

C'mon now, you've done the same in past threads on FOH!

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Because I said I can't squat and deadlift anymore because I have spinal stenosis? Do I need to post xray shots of the epidural needle in my spinal fluid for you to believe that? lmao

I have never come out with an outrageous or unbelievable claim regarding lifts because I don't have any to make. I've never benched that much.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

I've never benched that much.

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Pussy.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

Whether or not he's lying gotta give him credit for the patented "Can't do it anymore bros, those were the old days."

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How much you wanna make a bet I can throw a football over them mountains?... Yeah... Coach woulda put me in fourth quarter, we would've been state champions. No doubt. No doubt in my mind.

Alright, alright I get it. It was stupid to talk about what I could or could not lift in any capacity. Carry on.

As your punishment you must make Uncle Rico your avatar.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

Boxing is largely aerobic. True anaerobic bursts make up a very small amount of a fight. Same with muay thai, same with MMA. Aerobic base is #1. They aren't exactly endurance sports, but still. They are much longer than running the 100m, and therefore apply for this purpose because he claimed that powerlifting/sprinting was the sweet spot for carb based diets, and ketogenic for the opposite.

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Muay Thai and MMA aren't my sport, so I am certainly no expert, but I do drop in for classes once in a while at my academy. My experience is that pad work and sparring are just as intense as rolling, and while I wouldn't dispute that an aerobic base is extremely important, I wouldn't characterize the training as even remotely low-intensity and more than any other fighting sport.

And cutting weight does not in any way OFTEN involve ketosis, that's a RIDICULOUS statement. I know dozens of fighters who don't fuck with water until the last few days and eat carbs up until the day of the weigh in, and bodybuilders can really eat whatever they want and often do because the drugs offset it. Very few bodybuilders do ketogenic diets, and the ones that do work with Dave Palumbo who is generally considered a fucking idiot. Speaking of fucking idiots, that's why I brought up Gary Taubes.

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Sure it does. Pretty much all of the "cutting" diets (cutting as in losing an appreciable amount of weight quickly), especially for bodybuilders, are essentially protein sparing fasts. Those are extremely low in carbohydrates, fat, and Calories. Cutting just water isn't the same, that means you compete at relatively close to your walking around weight. And this is seriously the first I am hearing about bodybuilders NOT going on competition diets, that is absolutely standard procedure (not that I am a body builder or even like the page- I mean sport).

Gary Taubes' books are great reads.

Most people have trouble benching their body weight, but we are to believe that in a year and a half you were doing double that. It is a highly believable story and I for one trust you.

Reminds me of my dad, used to brag about "back in the day" how he was squatting 400+ pounds. Guy was skinny as a rail. He liked to say "squatting with 405 strapped to my back." I always laughed when he said "strapped to his back", not sure why.

Denaut_sl said:

Muay Thai and MMA aren't my sport, so I am certainly no expert, but I do drop in for classes once in a while at my academy. My experience is that pad work and sparring are just as intense as rolling, and while I wouldn't dispute that an aerobic base is extremely important, I wouldn't characterize the training as even remotely low-intensity and more than any other fighting sport.



Sure it does. Pretty much all of the "cutting" diets (cutting as in losing an appreciable amount of weight quickly), especially for bodybuilders, are essentially protein sparing fasts. Those are extremely low in carbohydrates, fat, and Calories. Cutting just water isn't the same, that means you compete at relatively close to your walking around weight. And this is seriously the first I am hearing about bodybuilders NOT going on competition diets, that is absolutely standard procedure (not that I am a body builder or even like the page- I mean sport).

Gary Taubes' books are great reads.

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I didn't mention Jiu Jitsu, as I have no idea what rolling feels like. But drilling on pads in Muay Thai is nothing like an actual fight. It's essentially 2-3min rounds of close to max effort, and bag work is even worse. This doesn't happen in a real fight, not in boxing, not in MMA, not in Muay Thai.

And no it doesn't. Sadly there was a point in my life when I followed bodybuilding heavily. Once I got to around 22 or so and couldn't really lift anymore because of my back and picked up an actual sport, I realized exactly how gay(literally gay) and pointless it was. I could rattle off diets of people from the past 30 years. My dad was a bodybuilder @ the State level, I know a million juicehead gym rats who have competed, and a million juicehead gym rats from Philly and Jersey(think Jersey Shore) who just essentially contest diet for the entire summer to get laid. No contest diet involves cutting weight "quickly". We're talking 16 weeks or 12 weeks that are usually low carb, sure, but they all have refeeds unless they are behind schedule. Dieting with a straight up ketogenic diet didn't even come into vogue until 6-8 years ago. People like Layne Norton prep people for shows and he doesn't use keto diets and keeps more carbs in diets than probably any other coach, and usually with natural athletes. I know way more about the culture than I care to admit. And to be totally honest it doesn't even fucking matter what they do or how they do it because they are so filled with drugs that worrying about muscle loss is pretty much a non issue.

And making weight for athletes(read: fighting sports) is literally done in the last few days before a weigh in. Their carb intakes are through the roof until they start fucking with water. People drop 10, 20, 30lbs in 2-3 days and put it all back on in 24 hours with a carb bonanza and an IV filled with fluid.

Gary Taubes is a retard.

Khane benching 345 after 18 months isn't completely impossible. I mean, it is terribly unlikely, he would have had to have been ridiculously dedicated and have really good genes for packing on weight and strength... but I ran the numbers and it is possible.

For the sake of argument (I have no idea what program he did) let's assume he did Starting strength as his Novice program and the Texas Method as his intermediate program.

We'll assume he started benching much less than half his body-weight when he started, an even 100 pounds. A spectacular, but still plausible, length of time to do SS is probably 4 months. We'll assume a modest 5 pound increment per workout which averages out to 7.5 pounds per week (10 on A week 5 on B week). Over 4 months that ends up being a 120 lb increase bringing his total to 220.

The Texas Method focuses on weekly increases. So, after 4 months he has 14 more months to make up the remaining ~125 pounds. That averages out to 2.2 pound increase per week to reach his number. In practice the increases would be front-loaded, but the numbers do work out. Ambitious? Certainly. Unlikely? Sure. Downright impossible? I'd say no.

I feel like someone sent Denaut here to fuck with me like T-1000 in Terminator 2.

Denaut_sl said:

Khane benching 345 after 18 months isn't completely impossible. I mean, it is terribly unlikely, he would have had to have been ridiculously dedicated and have really good genes for packing on weight and strength... but I ran the numbers and it is possible.

For the sake of argument (I have no idea what program he did) let's assume he did Starting strength as his Novice program and the Texas Method as his intermediate program.

We'll assume he started benching much less than half his body-weight when he started, an even 100 pounds. A spectacular, but still plausible, length of time to do SS is probably 4 months. We'll assume a modest 5 pound increment per workout which averages out to 7.5 pounds per week (10 on A week 5 on B week). Over 4 months that ends up being a 120 lb increase bringing his total to 220.

The Texas Method focuses on weekly increases. So, after 4 months he has 14 more months to make up the remaining ~125 pounds. That averages out to 2.2 pound increase per week to reach his number. In practice the increases would be front-loaded, but the numbers do work out. Ambitious? Certainly. Unlikely? Sure. Downright impossible? I'd say no.

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And yet diet is not factored in one bit. There is no way a dude lost 100 pounds while increasing his bench by 300-400%. The calories wouldn't add up.

Denaut_sl said:

Khane benching 345 after 18 months isn't completely impossible. I mean, it is terribly unlikely, he would have had to have been ridiculously dedicated and have really good genes for packing on weight and strength... but I ran the numbers and it is possible.

For the sake of argument (I have no idea what program he did) let's assume he did Starting strength as his Novice program and the Texas Method as his intermediate program.

We'll assume he started benching much less than half his body-weight when he started, an even 100 pounds. A spectacular, but still plausible, length of time to do SS is probably 4 months. We'll assume a modest 5 pound increment per workout which averages out to 7.5 pounds per week (10 on A week 5 on B week). Over 4 months that ends up being a 120 lb increase bringing his total to 220.

The Texas Method focuses on weekly increases. So, after 4 months he has 14 more months to make up the remaining ~125 pounds. That averages out to 2.2 pound increase per week to reach his number. In practice the increases would be front-loaded, but the numbers do work out. Ambitious? Certainly. Unlikely? Sure. Downright impossible? I'd say no.

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And yet diet is not factored in one bit. There is no way a dude lost 100 pounds while increasing his bench by 300-400%. The calories wouldn't add up.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

I didn't mention Jiu Jitsu, as I have no idea what rolling feels like. But drilling on pads in Muay Thai is nothing like an actual fight. It's essentially 2-3min rounds of close to max effort, and bag work is even worse. This doesn't happen in a real fight, not in boxing, not in MMA, not in Muay Thai.

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I've never competed in striking, only grappling. In that sport competing is like rolling only worse, I defer to you when you say that an actual fight is not nearly as intense as training is.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

...No contest diet involves cutting weight "quickly". We're talking 16 weeks or 12 weeks that are usually low carb, sure, but they all have refeeds unless they are behind schedule. Dieting with a straight up ketogenic diet didn't even come into vogue until 6-8 years ago.

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Ok, maybe we are speaking past each other a bit here, I consider 12-16 weeks a short time-frame, with 1-4 being a very short time-frame. When I say cutting I mean that period of time. What you described is Lyle's Rapid Weight loss diet almost to the T (including the re-feed periods). It only takes a couple of days to enter ketosis so on a diet like that you still spend a solid amount of time in ketosis... they are ketogenic diets. The leaner you are the more frequent the re-feeds but even a weekly refeed (which is very frequent) will put you in ketosis for at least 40% of the time you are the diet.

And making weight for athletes(read: fighting sports) is literally done in the last few days before a weigh in. Their carb intakes are through the roof until they start fucking with water. People drop 10, 20, 30lbs in 2-3 days and put it all back on in 24 hours with a carb bonanza and an IV filled with fluid.

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Well, depends on the athlete I have to drop 2 weight classes sometimes depending on when the competitions fall.

Boy did I cause a stir. You guys don't believe me, it's fine, I can see why you wouldn't.

Noodleface_sl said:

And yet diet is not factored in one bit. There is no way a dude lost 100 pounds while increasing his bench by 300-400%. The calories wouldn't add up.

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I have no idea what he was eating and neither do you. He could have been seriously fat and packed on a sizable amount of lean mass while overall losing weight. Frankly I don't quite believe him either, his weight was probably higher and his max lower. If he said he was about 100kg that would be a lot more believable.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

I feel like someone sent Denaut here to fuck with me like T-1000 in Terminator 2.

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Its tough when you are about as knowledgeable as someone but fundamentally disagree about something Fortunately for me that describes about half my job so I am used to it.

Denaut_sl said:

Ok, maybe we are speaking past each other a bit here, I consider 12-16 weeks a short time-frame, with 1-4 being a very short time-frame. When I say cutting I mean that period of time. What you described is Lyle's Rapid Weight loss diet almost to the T (including the re-feed periods). It only takes a couple of days to enter ketosis so on a diet like that you still spend a solid amount of time in ketosis... they are ketogenic diets. The leaner you are the more frequent the re-feeds but even a weekly refeed (which is very frequent) will put you in ketosis for at least 40% of the time you are the diet.

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4 months is a long ass time. People can change their whole lives in 4 months physically. And no it isn't anything like RWL. That diet is basically a starvation diet, it's like bare minimum to not get sick and he states as much. Bodybuilders diet on 2000-3000 calories a day. That's a lot of clean food. Some of their refeeds are 400-800 carbs per day, and their version of low carb is like 150g. Even contest diets for natural athletes are no where near the 800 calories a day of RWL on some days. Anyone can get shredded not going below 1800-2000 calories a day if you know what you are doing. Ketosis is a non issue.
Diff worlds.

This doesn't prove anything about my lifting claims but it does show the transformation I went through:

Me at 280lbs

Me 10 months later

Me after I bulked up a bit, I actually am not sure on timeline but I had broken past 300 by this point and it was less than a year after the previous pic, I fibbed a little, I was about 183 lbs in this picture

Incoming ginger jokes