I have to wonder WHY they don"t have lore in the game. The old Vanguard website was loaded with well written lore.Shinrai said:
Wtf happened?
Why all the nerd rage against Vanguard
- Thread starter Shonuff
- Start date
Wtf happened?
That was incredibly true for the first few weeks after release. Every group I was in was a complete wash. That"s one reason I quit. Progressing any further felt virtually impossible due to the "grouping" requirement (for any real progression) and the fact that anyone with any skill had already leveled past. All it takes is one dumb ass to wipe a group over and over, and it happened over and over.Draegan said:
Groups now are probably better since all the dumb asses have quit (along with plenty of skilled players too frustrated to continue, like myself).
Time requirements? For waht? to get to the max?Zehn - Vhex said:
Who gives a shit about the max. No one designed vg"s leveling curve to weed out the idiots. It was designed in a way so you can stop and smell the fucking roses instead of max, max, max, raid, raid, raid. Rinse and fucking repeat....
Since when did these games turn into this shit? How come we cannot enjoy these games for what they are, the fucking jourey, not the end?
I understand youre in the "no level grind camp" Ive been reading your shit here for years, thats fine, nothing wrong with that. But I dont agree that this necesarily makes for the best game. To me this is not a mmorpg anymore. You could package that shit up single player style with "on line" play IMO. Your one step away from Guild Wars. PvP arenas? Raid instances? Perfect. I myself enjoy exploring, leveling up, going to a dungeon area and spending a week there exping and questing. And then when im done, moving on to the next. I have time, im not in a rush. But it seems too many of you are. Im there with you guys, I have a famiy, 2 kids, wife and a beagle named snoopy. And a full time stressful ass job. I dont have all day to play, but that does not matter, because again, there is no rush.
I like the way this game is set up and enjoy it, and I hope the god these games in the future dont end up like WoW but quicker, because then it would be the death of the RPG on line. As long as there is engaging group play, big immersive world, good rewards for your time spent, and seeing the power and wealth gains with your character I could really give a fuck if im lv12.8 or LV70 and gear collecting. In the end its all the same shit.
Since about the time EQ came out...people didn"t always approach it in this way (that was a subset of power gamers) but as games became more linear, this mindset seemed to spread to the rest of the community. This is why I prefer games like EVE and UO (which I may try again if they release some classic servers with the graphics update).Mkopec1 said:
Funny you should mention Velious. Because IMO that was the sign of things to come in these games. A shift from exploratory group centric to raid type gameplay. Hurry up and level so you can raid. And Wow further enhanced this type of gameplay with making everything from 1-70 worthless and in the end trivial but the end game, but... but the END GAME...WOW...Stevon said:
This is what people expect now, hurry up level quick through these worthless levels without even appreciating anything in the middle. The focus shifted from the exploratory challenging group play to RAID OR DIE !
I agree Mk, there"s no rush. I think it"s just something that was programmed into our brains from EQ. Basically, "Want to see the cool shit? Grind..."
Vanguard seems to have quite a few interesting dungeons, and places to explore. What I"m worried about (i"m not much worried about the other things anymore, they"re common to MMOs) is if Vanguard has enough time to fix itself up and stick around for years. I"ve been to various message board with people saying, "Sigil doesn"t have enough money to finish this, and since the game isn"t making a real profit yet, they"re fucked."
Tiz annoying. I don"t want to dedicate time to something that will die in a year or so.
Just my two cents.
Vanguard seems to have quite a few interesting dungeons, and places to explore. What I"m worried about (i"m not much worried about the other things anymore, they"re common to MMOs) is if Vanguard has enough time to fix itself up and stick around for years. I"ve been to various message board with people saying, "Sigil doesn"t have enough money to finish this, and since the game isn"t making a real profit yet, they"re fucked."
Tiz annoying. I don"t want to dedicate time to something that will die in a year or so.
Just my two cents.
agree with everything you say. . I am in no hurry to get to the top. I have been all over Telon looking at all the different zones or at least i try. I will be raiding in this game as well, but i am in NOOO hurry to get to max level. The guild i am in are enjoying leveling and exploring new areas. Most everyone in my guild is hardcore raiders, but we arent ones to want to hit max levels the 2nd week of release.Mkopec1 said:
Fucking thank you. All the excuse making for Sigil makes me want to stab pandas. You know where your budget is and what your constraints are and you design a team to create the best game you can with those limitations. Bottom line.Lyenae said:
The problem is when you have a lack of direction for your team and disorganized chaos throughout development and beta....you"re going to have a game that comes out in the state that VG did. Sigil sure wasn"t acting like a company that had any concern about deadlines or efficiency. Completely revamping noob zones in late beta, completely revamping classes weeks before retail, scrapping previous diplomacy ideas and rebuilding it from the ground up....that"s shit you do if you have time to fully test and work out the resulting bugs, or if you have the money and employees to throw at it.
I said it like a month ago Cuppy, but you were still on your honeymoon with VG and too in love to notice =)Witoubo said:
I wasn"t ever in love. I had fun despite the bugs at first...then the frustration was too overwhelming to ignore.
I think you"ve mistakenly posted on the wrong board.Mkopec1 said:
Here is the link I believe you"re looking forVanguard Roleplayers Community Forums - Powered by vBulletin
The whole point of these games is getting bigger and badder. If the point of the game is to explore dungeons then why bother with levels? Change it up and force people to travel and explore and smell the roses to advance, not gain xp to level.
Anyway, I think EQ2"s mentoring system fixes the xp gain vs revisting content problem nicely.
I dont think you can give them the "lack of talent" label. Its obvious there is a lot of talent thats created some pretty amazing things in the game. I"d put this down to more of a "lack of quality, structured organization skills/program".
Mismanagement of money is obviously a big tick. Not designing within constraints I"m also wary of criticizing them here too. Because of the mega fuckup of mismanagement of money this makes this one look worse. In a mmo, I"d prefer a game with potential then a lower potential, more finished game. So, I dont criticize them here. My criticism with this falls under the mismanagement of money label.
I"d also put down "horrendous marketing campaingn" but I suppose this falls under the lack/wastage of money label too.
All that said, its still a great game. Its just a shame its not what it should be... now
PS try diplomacy for lore
Mismanagement of money is obviously a big tick. Not designing within constraints I"m also wary of criticizing them here too. Because of the mega fuckup of mismanagement of money this makes this one look worse. In a mmo, I"d prefer a game with potential then a lower potential, more finished game. So, I dont criticize them here. My criticism with this falls under the mismanagement of money label.
I"d also put down "horrendous marketing campaingn" but I suppose this falls under the lack/wastage of money label too.
All that said, its still a great game. Its just a shame its not what it should be... now
PS try diplomacy for lore
STFU WITH YOUR MY LITTLE PONY AVATAR AND YOUR STUPID LITTLE SHORTS!Cuppycake said:
And now that I"ve said that...
I"m not sure if it was lack of direction. It was probably pretty organized at first, then just got crazy. I know Sigil used to be a company of like 12 people, or something.
It was probably a mix of mis-management and shooting to high. Brad had all these ideas (diplomacy, ships, seamless world, no instancing) etc, and they just couldn"t get it all in.
As I said before, what they need to do now is focus on what they HAVE. They have the adventuring, crafting, diplomacy, and world. They just need to fix it all, and add lore.
Fix and improve.
Fix and improve.
Fix and improve.
If they can get what they have solid, they can add the other stuff later.
Oh, and I WANTS MY LORE BRAD! You had great lore on the old site, there"s no excuse for it not being in game. D:
I think you"re only correct to an extent. The point of MMOs is relative to the person playing it. To the powergamer its all about logging lots of hours into the game and getting the most out of it in terms of comparing yourself with "the competition" - aka fellow players. For some people its all about accomplishing as much as you can in the varying amount of time you may have to play. And for some of us - its all about adventuring, exploration, lore, questing, crafting, socializing and developing a sense of "self" within a fantasy setting.xmod2 said:
I don"t think there is any point in calling these games an MMORPG if people are interested in taking the RP right out of the game. Sure there are ways you could accomplish creating a successful game without levels - and I"ve read some downright brilliant ideas on various developer blogs. Why aren"t they implemented? Probably because of the importance to a lot of players of seeing a tangible number grow so that they can see their character "aging" and developing in a sense. And because I have yet to see a company that can release enough dynamic and varying content that it can appease people who are solely looking to explore without the leveling aspect. Its much easier to visualize than to actually implement.
I don"t think Mkopec was speaking for the hardcore raiding scene. I think he was speaking as a general MMO enthusiast. Sure, its nice when you get to max level to have tons of shit to do once you"re there - but wouldn"t it also be fabulous to have a blast along the way with mini raids, epic long quests, elements of immersion and enough content for replayability factor?
Personally, I enjoy when people speak up for a demographic other than the hardcore raiders. Granted this is a website for a raiding guild both past and present - yet its no secret that a variety of gamers (and non-gamers) frequent these boards and have some input to offer as well. =x
Aside form the lore being completely absent from the game, what little there is just feels really generic, stale and overdone. Magic hungry elves becomming corrupted? Gee, where have I heard that before.Sithro said:
Yeah, but check out the lore on the site (if it"s still around). Morgan"s Tale, etc, was some good shit.Twobit Whore said:
They need to get Glip writing some stuff.
in case you missed it...Twobit Whore said:
try diplomacy for lore..........
edit: oh yeah and perhaps you should actually play the game before you make up any more fictitious crap
While Diplomacy may have lore, I think they should make it more accessable. Like in libraries and stuff.
And quests, definately show it in quests.
And quests, definately show it in quests.
I doubt with the contract he has with the company he can really say something like sorry I was pressured to release the game premature to what was expected and planned. Granted it sure would have some forum trolls and haters vindicated yes?kohl said:
On the top part I just dont think its realistic to ever expect a MMO to take the mass subs and addiction WoW has especially with more and more games coming to the forefront.
Very unrealistic thinking and someday it maybe proved wrong but I think we are VERY VERY FAR from it.
Some issues for sure are the fact that as many dungeons as there is to hit at certain levels. The game world is populated with players in that your only going to hit a select few.Sithro said:
Heck I thought VG was a mild ghosttown until I hit 3 rivers and the mass KE group area.
Of course the spider cave north of VE is much easier gear and then Ach is ok too if you can get by the tediusness of the first 2 quests.
To add to this I still havent been able to build a group to finish the Grugrethor Dungeon which very much pains me.