I am curious to hear your thoughts on it afterwards. My brothers and I are just going to wait for the starter set rulebook to find its way to ebay before we make the jump.
28mm Miniature Tabletop Wargaming Thread
- Thread starter Jx3
- Start date
Erronius
Macho Ma'am
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Pro: GW already put out a bunch of FAQ's,
Con: They fucked a bunch up and/or rolled some of the prior FAQs back
Pro: GW actually updated some of the new FAQs they just released
Con: they seemed to be minor changes for the most part.
Also the Psychic Cards have mistakes. The spell/faction matrix is very misleading and they've already had to FAQ the cards saying that a couple spells have the wrong # of WC listed
Con: They fucked a bunch up and/or rolled some of the prior FAQs back
Pro: GW actually updated some of the new FAQs they just released
Con: they seemed to be minor changes for the most part.
Also the Psychic Cards have mistakes. The spell/faction matrix is very misleading and they've already had to FAQ the cards saying that a couple spells have the wrong # of WC listed
From some read-throughs and seeing what other people have come up with:
Putting the psychic stuff to one side for the moment, I like most of the changes. Some things have been clarified, some things are more streamlined, and some things got more balanced. If they hadn't made any changes to psychic powers then this really would be 6.5, or even 6.1.
The unbound / weird allies army stuff doesn't really bother me, because tournaments aren't going to allow it and between friends that stuff doesn't matter anyway. If you want a pick-up game, don't bring your unbound army of doom.
As for the psychic changes, the psychic phase itself seems a good idea if only that people don't forget to use the powers. Unfortunately, and sadly predictably, GW have made a mess of the implementation. If you didn't know it was GW you'd expect the biggest rule changes to receive the most attention pre-release and so need the fewest fixes, but it looks like the opposite. The summoners-summoning-summoners ever-growing army I don't think is quite the problem it looks, not least because of how many models you'd have to buy to run it - and how happy you'd be if GW then went and nerfed it. Invisibility does look broken, however.
Jx3
Riddle me this...
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Played a game yesterday, Crimson Fists vs Orks. Think we topped out at 2k points. Objectives were laid out normally (6 total, each players lays down 3) and they are numbered. Nothing much changed there, the mission cards make it awesome though. I had on my first turn to capture Objective 5 which was right next to me, objective 3 which was way on the other end of the board and the other which was nullify a psychic power. Since neither of us had a psyker I got a new card. Now, thats not how it normally done we just house ruled it. On the flip side though if you have a shitty card you can get rid of it on your next turn to hopefully pull a better one. You also draw new cards when you meet the criteria of the cards. Example is the previously mentioned objective 5, another one is to kill a unit in the shooting phase, blow up a tank etc. Also what is nice is I score points at the end of MY turn. Not the game turn but once I say I'm done if I'm holding the objective I need or blow up his tank (if I have that card) then I get those points. First blood, slay the warlord and break the line are all still there, don't need a card to get those.
Every unit can score, that means my Dreadnaught can park his fat ass on the objective and score it. This doesnt man troops are shit though. If my enemy parks his troops on it (say he has the card for Objective 5 also) then its his because in scoring troops beat everything except other troops. 2 opposing troops on the objective means it's contested. So no walking your Killa Kans up and contesting from my tactical marines. Now if the Killa Kan murders all my marines on the objective then that means it's his now. So it made me happy to still know that troops aren't shit.
Flyers/Skimmers have to declare jink before shots are rolled, so I could jink which forces me to snap fire next turn even though my opponent rolls like shit. It forces you to gamble a bit more. I don't run many flyrs so it wasn't so bad.
Unbound, the 500lb gorilla in the room. Not going to lie, at first I was hating this and was thinking of all the ways it could be broken and how shitty it was going to be blah blah etc. In the wrong hands or against the wrong people it will still suck major balls. For me though it was simply, freaking, fun. I got to run models I haven't played in years. I had something like
3 tac squads
2 scout squads
3 Venerable Dreanaughts
Land Speeder
Terminator Squad
Pedro Kantor
Captain with Command Squad
ThunderFire Cannon
2 Devastator Squads
He had
2 Battle Wagons filled with boyz and a Big Mek (his warboss)
2 trukks filled
20 Storm Boyz
Ork quad gun
Ork Flyer
A nob Squad
I know I could have more than likely made that legal with some use of the ally chart but I didn't give a shit. It was fun. Assault is still faggy (2d6") but I might propose house ruling that also (6"+d6"). The cards forced me to run around the board instead of camping and shooting and I got to murder some Orks.
In conclusion I don't think 40k is going to be a tournament game without a whole lot of FAQs and Erratas on the tourny organizers part. I had a lot more fun with this than I thought I would though. I can't speak about the psyker phase but I'll try it out later. I'll more than likely pick up the rulebook soon.
P.S. Any of you crackers find yourself in the Charleston WV area with a need to 40k don't be scared to yell at me. Crimson Fists are always looking fight and drink.
Every unit can score, that means my Dreadnaught can park his fat ass on the objective and score it. This doesnt man troops are shit though. If my enemy parks his troops on it (say he has the card for Objective 5 also) then its his because in scoring troops beat everything except other troops. 2 opposing troops on the objective means it's contested. So no walking your Killa Kans up and contesting from my tactical marines. Now if the Killa Kan murders all my marines on the objective then that means it's his now. So it made me happy to still know that troops aren't shit.
Flyers/Skimmers have to declare jink before shots are rolled, so I could jink which forces me to snap fire next turn even though my opponent rolls like shit. It forces you to gamble a bit more. I don't run many flyrs so it wasn't so bad.
Unbound, the 500lb gorilla in the room. Not going to lie, at first I was hating this and was thinking of all the ways it could be broken and how shitty it was going to be blah blah etc. In the wrong hands or against the wrong people it will still suck major balls. For me though it was simply, freaking, fun. I got to run models I haven't played in years. I had something like
3 tac squads
2 scout squads
3 Venerable Dreanaughts
Land Speeder
Terminator Squad
Pedro Kantor
Captain with Command Squad
ThunderFire Cannon
2 Devastator Squads
He had
2 Battle Wagons filled with boyz and a Big Mek (his warboss)
2 trukks filled
20 Storm Boyz
Ork quad gun
Ork Flyer
A nob Squad
I know I could have more than likely made that legal with some use of the ally chart but I didn't give a shit. It was fun. Assault is still faggy (2d6") but I might propose house ruling that also (6"+d6"). The cards forced me to run around the board instead of camping and shooting and I got to murder some Orks.
In conclusion I don't think 40k is going to be a tournament game without a whole lot of FAQs and Erratas on the tourny organizers part. I had a lot more fun with this than I thought I would though. I can't speak about the psyker phase but I'll try it out later. I'll more than likely pick up the rulebook soon.
P.S. Any of you crackers find yourself in the Charleston WV area with a need to 40k don't be scared to yell at me. Crimson Fists are always looking fight and drink.
Jx3
Riddle me this...
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- 173
Are the cards / random objectives "manditory", are they "encouraged", or do you roll ahead to see what mission you play and one of them uses the cards?
Jx3
Riddle me this...
- 1,039
- 173
From what was told to me the cards are mandatory. You can buy them separate or there is table you can roll on in the rule book. I like the fact I can discard one if its hard or just retarded. An example would be one of the one I got was for 3 of my units to be within 12" of my table edge and none of my opponents be there. I got this card when all my units were well over halfway across the table. So beginning of my next turn I pitched that card and got a new one. So you aren't stuck with a shitty card all the time. I know there is a card for killing a flyer and another for psychics but unless your opponent is a mega dick I don't see why you couldn't immediately discard them of they didn't have a flyer or psyker.
Erronius
Macho Ma'am
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I didn't think the cards are mandatory as you can use the chart(s) in the BRB. I imagine you can just write things down on scratch paper but I dunno.
I also thought that you only needed the extra objective 'cards' if you played a "Maelstrom of War" mission but I didn't have as long to read through the BRB as I would have liked otherwise.
Land Raider w/Maulerfiend and/or spawn escort.
CSM Landraiders might be a hair cheaper but they are still a large chunk of your army cost. Especially if the unit in it is pricey. CSM LRs don't have machine spirit though so their shooting while moving forward is terrible (compared to loyalist chapters like the IMPERIAL FISTERS WHO DEEPSTRIKE TERMIES WARBLEGARBLE) plus CSM doesn't get any of the 'decent' LRs that you often see loyalists use. Now, termies with a LR taken as a dedicated would meant that the LR would have Objective Secured, but still...I can spend 500pts on a termie squad in a LR and with all of the current plasma spam lose them in a turn of shooting if I'm unlucky. Maulerfiend is still AV12 so it is susceptible to being glanceraeped.
Heldrake
That motherfucker got nerfed and nerfed hard. The BF/Cannon is now HULL MOUNTED (45 degree arc to the front?) and the VS only does one hit against ground stuff now. I guess you can go into hover if you want to have a better firing arc and try relying on the 5++, but meh. I agree that it needed a nerf, but this? hahahahaha (I'd like to take a second to mention that I still don't have a Heldrake so I don't really care anyways)
"The Black Legion book is looking pretty crunchy."
"One cute little wargear item from Crimson Slaughter..."
I don't want to buy the supplements or dataslates because THAT SHIT SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE FUCKING CORE CODEX. THAT'S WHY IT WAS ALWAYS CALLED A CODEX AND NOT "THIS WORTHLESS FUCKING SHITTY BOOK THAT YOU HAVE TO BUY IN ORDER TO USE THE GOOD STUFF THAT YOU HAVE TO BUY SEPARATELY"So like when the author says that the BL supp is looking "crunchy". Yeah, IDGAF, the core codex needs to be good before anything else. If the codex wasn't shit I might consider buying other stuff.
I want to stab that guy right in the eye. RIGHT IN THE FUCKING EYE
"Since rhinos aren't going to immediately blow up anymore"
I mean fuck. FUCK. Who in God's name ever worried about rhinos blowing up and not that rhinos got glanced to death by everything under the fucking sun? I mean I can give them to troops for OS, sure, but that means that you're either taking vanilla CSM (ugh, but I do it anyways) or your making cults into troops with a marked Lord meaning that your force is even more points constricted and less numerous.
I also thought that you only needed the extra objective 'cards' if you played a "Maelstrom of War" mission but I didn't have as long to read through the BRB as I would have liked otherwise.
I see where he gets down to CSM brass tacks:
Land Raider w/Maulerfiend and/or spawn escort.
CSM Landraiders might be a hair cheaper but they are still a large chunk of your army cost. Especially if the unit in it is pricey. CSM LRs don't have machine spirit though so their shooting while moving forward is terrible (compared to loyalist chapters like the IMPERIAL FISTERS WHO DEEPSTRIKE TERMIES WARBLEGARBLE) plus CSM doesn't get any of the 'decent' LRs that you often see loyalists use. Now, termies with a LR taken as a dedicated would meant that the LR would have Objective Secured, but still...I can spend 500pts on a termie squad in a LR and with all of the current plasma spam lose them in a turn of shooting if I'm unlucky. Maulerfiend is still AV12 so it is susceptible to being glanceraeped.
Heldrake
That motherfucker got nerfed and nerfed hard. The BF/Cannon is now HULL MOUNTED (45 degree arc to the front?) and the VS only does one hit against ground stuff now. I guess you can go into hover if you want to have a better firing arc and try relying on the 5++, but meh. I agree that it needed a nerf, but this? hahahahaha (I'd like to take a second to mention that I still don't have a Heldrake so I don't really care anyways)
"The Black Legion book is looking pretty crunchy."
"One cute little wargear item from Crimson Slaughter..."
I don't want to buy the supplements or dataslates because THAT SHIT SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE FUCKING CORE CODEX. THAT'S WHY IT WAS ALWAYS CALLED A CODEX AND NOT "THIS WORTHLESS FUCKING SHITTY BOOK THAT YOU HAVE TO BUY IN ORDER TO USE THE GOOD STUFF THAT YOU HAVE TO BUY SEPARATELY"So like when the author says that the BL supp is looking "crunchy". Yeah, IDGAF, the core codex needs to be good before anything else. If the codex wasn't shit I might consider buying other stuff.
I want to stab that guy right in the eye. RIGHT IN THE FUCKING EYE
"Since rhinos aren't going to immediately blow up anymore"
I mean fuck. FUCK. Who in God's name ever worried about rhinos blowing up and not that rhinos got glanced to death by everything under the fucking sun? I mean I can give them to troops for OS, sure, but that means that you're either taking vanilla CSM (ugh, but I do it anyways) or your making cults into troops with a marked Lord meaning that your force is even more points constricted and less numerous.
Jx3
Riddle me this...
- 1,039
- 173
It seems a lot of people aren't happy with 7th edition 40k locally and I have noticed a lot of games either popping up or re-surging at my local store. There is a Dreadball league that formed, I went ahead and joined it. The owner is pretty kick ass and has like 3 box sets open, so all you need to do is buy a team and you're in. Been playing Heroclix also. I'm a big time Green Lantern fan boy and the next set coming out is War of the Light. Seems like the perfect time to learn how to play. My Space Marines gather dust while my Cygnar and Dreadball and clix all get to play.
Does anyone have experience with Mordheim? My local shop is starting up a campaign soon and I wanted to get some opinions on a Pirate Warband list. Trying to keep the list fluffy and WYSIWYG with the models I have but I have no experience with Fantasy and want to be at least somewhat competitive.
Heroes
Captain: Dueling Pistol, Cutlass, Dagger = 100gc
Ships Mate #1: Pistol, Cat O' Nine Tails, Dagger = 58gc
Ships Mate #2: Axe, Cutlass. Pistol = 65gc
Cabin Boy #1: Boat Hook, Belaying Pins = 26gc
Cabin Boy #2: Cutlass, Belaying Pins, Dagger = 28gc
Henchmen
Gunner: Handgun, Cutlass, Dagger = 70gc
Crew x3: Cutlass, Pistol, Dagger = 150gc
497/500 GC
I think I need more long range shooting but handguns are pretty expensive and bows/crossbows don't really fit the pirate theme. Hopefully I'll be able to add another Gunner with a Swivel Cannon after a few games.
Heroes
Captain: Dueling Pistol, Cutlass, Dagger = 100gc
Ships Mate #1: Pistol, Cat O' Nine Tails, Dagger = 58gc
Ships Mate #2: Axe, Cutlass. Pistol = 65gc
Cabin Boy #1: Boat Hook, Belaying Pins = 26gc
Cabin Boy #2: Cutlass, Belaying Pins, Dagger = 28gc
Henchmen
Gunner: Handgun, Cutlass, Dagger = 70gc
Crew x3: Cutlass, Pistol, Dagger = 150gc
497/500 GC
I think I need more long range shooting but handguns are pretty expensive and bows/crossbows don't really fit the pirate theme. Hopefully I'll be able to add another Gunner with a Swivel Cannon after a few games.
I just bought a ridiculously large dark eldar army for a ridiculously low price. What the fuck am I doing.
Burren
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 4,058
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*Sigh* GW still fucking up this game and raping players in the ass on prices. 17 years and 5 armies (between fantasy and 40k) and I'm so glad I'm done. It's like meeting the love of your life and for 17 years, putting up with her murdering puppies and kittens on the weekends. Excusing the craziness because of the hotness and fun, but one day, you just snap, say "fuck it, I'm out" and it breaks your heart, but it has to be done.
Fuck you GW, fuck you very much.
Fuck you GW, fuck you very much.
Rumors circulating that the 7th edition starter for 40k will be Orks VS Space wolves... I will make the plunge if that's the case
Sludig
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 9,011
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Negative, imo read books, play the video games, and just collect a few of the random badass models for a shelf. Keep in mind if you can't already paint well..... aside from the whore mongering prices, rules and power creep etc. You still have to find a place that plays, with decent terrain, and not a bunch of cock bags unless you are in the mood to powergame. (I can go either way, but it's a big turnoff for noobies to be playing "that guy".)
Recently got turned onto where I can find some foreign produced knock off resins. I think it's the closest I'll get to being back in the game. Some 3d art for my house, but never will I go full retard again as spending 1-2,000$ to build a full decent army and then deal with the ongoing shenanigans and limited playtime. (Another reason I'm bitter, is realistically a "good" scenerio is once a week getting 2-3 games which for the money is not a good ROI to me.)
For that money I can do so many more rewarding things, car upgrades, new pet and supplies for a long time, multiple guns and/or a year of ammo. Etc.