Baldur's Gate 3 by Larian Games

TJT

Mr. Poopybutthole
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BG1 topped out at 6. BG2 you got to the 15-17 or something and you might have hit 20 in TOB.

No idea what their game plan is but 12 is pretty high when looking at the previous titles. If they just intend 1 expansion or something before moving onto new development it may be okay.
 
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Mr Creed

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BG 1 topped you at a certain amount of xp, a characters actual max level varied according to their class choice(s).
 
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Caliane

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can't compare directly, as the leveling system has changed. bg1 time had exp penalties for multiclass, and bonus levels for drow, etc. that kind of stuff.

I don't think tabletop to crpg compares well either. as tablettop has tons of action that is rp, and noncombat. crpgs tend to focus way more on combat, thus character building is a bigger element. yeah, you can spend years at one level.. becuase you have entire sessions of shopping, talking, etc.
this likely will push power towards martials. low level=limited spell slots. cprg in general means limited spell lists.
labeling it BG 3 doesn't help with this. as noted, you kindof expect that progression. to go back to a smaller, more grounded level, for 3 is odd. Then on top of that, the level range expected for mindflayers/gith.. A single, regular ass mindflayer is CR 7.
A wizard gets one 6th level spell at 11.


like I said about wrath of the righteous, its insane build depth makes it one of the best crpgs in history. if you are throwing CR into the trash and just having players start at 1, regardless of foes or backstories, I think its better to just go full build depth and give full level 1-20 access. (kingmaker was a bit silly starting the characters at level 1. they should have started at level 3)

there is another option here, which again goes back to WotR. secondary progression/feats/level ups. Mythic paths. you could have your 1-12 class levels, then another 1-12 "Mythic" progression, that is separate and unique to the game/setting. in Wotr, its outsider/alignment based. but doesn't have to be. the "mythic paths" could be mage guild, theives guild, slayers guild, werewolf, vampire, aboleth path, hivemind path, blessings of shar, blessings of elune, etc. A secondary leveling system, to allow deeper character builds.
of course, afaik theres nothing like this. just saying a system like this could justify a lower class level.
 
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Aaron

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I'm one of the few who start to lose interest in D&D characters after lvl 10 (and especially lvl 14 or so) due to ability bloat. Combat starts to take so fucking long that it becomes a chore. It's why I prefer modern CRPGs that don't use table top mechanics, and also limit ability use more (have more passive things or shit). I still have nightmares from our weekly table top campaign a few years back when we were up to lvl 16 and one fucking encounter would take half the session.

Granted, many like having lots of options and microing everything, but I prefer more streamlined stuff. Mass Effect 1 and 2 did that well (never played 3).
 
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Arden

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Looking for a good crpg to occupy my time until BG3 release (I'm trying my best not to play through the EA a 5th time).

I know there is probably nothing out there comparable to BG3, but anyone have recs? The system makes a big difference to me. I couldn't go back to something like 2nd Ed dnd, for example. I'm also trying to avoid games with mandatory tedious management stuff, which is why I've been avoiding Pathfinder.
 

Nirgon

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Ya but still, pathfinder. Wrath was next level. Maybe some mods cure your ails.
 
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Burns

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Looking for a good crpg to occupy my time until BG3 release (I'm trying my best not to play through the EA a 5th time).

I know there is probably nothing out there comparable to BG3, but anyone have recs? The system makes a big difference to me. I couldn't go back to something like 2nd Ed dnd, for example. I'm also trying to avoid games with mandatory tedious management stuff, which is why I've been avoiding Pathfinder.
  • Solasta: Crown of the Magister - DnD 5e - I thought it was a little short, but they have 3 DLCs now, for more content.
  • Tyranny - house rules DnD like - You start off as the bad guy. The first 3/4 of the game is great, but the ending was rushed. It didn't sell well, so didn't get much love after release. Still, one of my favorite RPGs of the 2010s.
  • Pillars of Eternity 1/2 - house rules DnD like - Some people love these games. I found them good for the time they were released. They have some stronghold stuff, but I dont think it was micromanagement heavy.
  • Wasteland 2/3 - Post Apoc, not DnD - I liked Wasteland 2 over 3, but both were good and don't need the previous games to follow the story.
  • UnderRail - Pixel GFX - Post Apoc but all underground - long game with a lot of reading
  • ATOM RPG - Post Apoc Indi - you need to like/play Fallout 2, to really appreciate this game. Its basically FO 1 style game set in Russia.
None of these games are as good as the two pathfinder games, but they don't have the city management. You can use a mod called Toybox to just cheat through all the city/army management stuff in both games, or set them to auto. I read the auto option makes you miss some good loot though, so I use toybox to cheese the tedious army management in Wrath. I liked the kingdom/city management in Kingmaker, so only light cheating through it in that game (made all projects take 1 day).
 
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Arden

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Ya but still, pathfinder. Wrath was next level. Maybe some mods cure your ails.

yeah, I may end up just doing PF anyway. Seems like the tedious management stuff is the only negative I've heard about it. Everything else is great.
 

Burns

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yeah, I may end up just doing PF anyway. Seems like the tedious management stuff is the only negative I've heard about it. Everything else is great.
On my first one and a half play throughs of Wrath, I did the Army management as intended, and it wasn't terrible, there was just too much of it (and it gets old, fast). Once you clear the map that you can access in chapter 3, you can pretty much forget about it for a while (shouldn't need to worry about increasing army power/recruiting while you finish up the chapter).

You can always try a few battles, then, if you hates it, check the option in Toybox where it just auto wins when you use the autocomplete battle option and you don't even have to sit through loading screens.
 
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Arden

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On my first one and a half play throughs of Wrath, I did the Army management as intended, and it wasn't terrible, there was just too much of it (and it gets old, fast). Once you clear the map that you can access in chapter 3, you can pretty much forget about it for a while (shouldn't need to worry about increasing army power/recruiting while you finish up the chapter).

You can always try a few battles, then, if you hates it, check the option in Toybox where it just auto wins using the autocomplete battle option and you don't even have to sit through loading screens.

Cool, going to give Wrath a shot I think. Thanks for the info
 
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Randin

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Tyranny really did deserve more love than it got, even if it did fumble the end a bit. Really good magic system, and the whole 'what if the Dark Overlord was your boss?' thing was a good premise.

For another underrated title, I'd point you towards the Expeditions series. Tactical RPGs (so turn-based combat reminiscent of Divinity or BG3) in various historical settings. I'm actually currently doing a replay of Expeditions: Rome at the moment.
 
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mkopec

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King Arthur II: The Role-Playing Wargame

Seems pretty decent. I have not played it but interest in it had me watch some YouTube of the game and it seems pretty solid for a crpg. Tactical turn based combat with party members. Decent skill trees and all the other crap like gear and all the other crap.
 

mkopec

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On my first one and a half play throughs of Wrath, I did the Army management as intended, and it wasn't terrible, there was just too much of it (and it gets old, fast). Once you clear the map that you can access in chapter 3, you can pretty much forget about it for a while (shouldn't need to worry about increasing army power/recruiting while you finish up the chapter).

You can always try a few battles, then, if you hates it, check the option in Toybox where it just auto wins when you use the autocomplete battle option and you don't even have to sit through loading screens.
Thing that got old in wrath for me was all the fucking dialogue. I was rolling my eyes at all of it after the first few acts. It just went on and on, I was like ok next battle please. But the build combos you can do in that game are crazy and deep. It’s too bad I can’t stand playing through it more because of the damn talking all the fucking time.
 
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Caliane

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Cool, going to give Wrath a shot I think. Thanks for the info
I'm also trying to avoid games with mandatory tedious management stuff, which is why I've been avoiding Pathfinder.
I love wrath.. but uh, I'd think that stipulation would disqualify. it does still have the crusade management. it does have lots of prebuffing. lots of talking. its a long campaign.
 

Burns

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I love wrath.. but uh, I'd think that stipulation would disqualify. it does still have the crusade management. it does have lots of prebuffing. lots of talking. its a long campaign.
You can use Toybox to remove the tediousness of prebuffing all the time too, if you want. Give all your casters the 2 abilities that make all buffs over 5 min last 24h. Then all you have left is the short in-battle buffs, like haste, to worry about.

I'm pretty sure you know, but for anyone who doesn't: There is also an auto buff mod that is a bit tedious to set up, but once it's done, you just update it every time you get new buffs. Highly recommended.
 

Nirgon

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I have profound, weaponized autism and do everything manually as Crossbow Man intended.

Who is he, might you ask? I only know him from OwlCat's team photo.