Girls who broke your heart thread

Gryeyes said:

Have you ever cheated on someone in a relationship? Feedback on a marriage involving weird behavior? For sure.

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Yes, I have. Not something I"d ever brag about, but then again I was 18 or so and pissed off because I got cheated on so I kissed someone else. We "broke up", so technically I didn"t cheat, but since it was a "Fuck you don"t ever call me again!!!" break-up, it wasn"t discussed and finalized yet. It didn"t end until months later. I also won"t deny being immature at times, this being a prime example. I even called him moments later to rub that event in his face. Looking back, that"s pretty disgusting and childish of me having kissed a stranger while having a drunken temper tantrum.

I"m going to spoiler the marriage story.

Tarrant I just woke up (will chat tomorrow). I am getting over strep, some virus that makes me puke, my son is sick, and arm surgery 2 1/2 weeks ago plus Cataclysm. Great times, did I mention my mom is coming to town Friday?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Characters, role, age:
Sabrina - Wife - 34
Tom - Husband - 35
Hope - Woman #1 - 38
Derby - Woman #2 - 27
Tina - Our mutual friend - 33

Sabrina and I don"t talk tons, but keep in touch. Now we talk a lot more because I feel like I have to prevent her from being crazy. About a year ago she had problems with her husband. A woman not in the character list above and Tom had been carrying on flirtatious chats (calling one another sexy and stuff) for several months. Sabrina was unaware until Tom stupidly left his messenger open on the family-shared laptop. They stayed together, but this issue was never resolved. Fast forward a year to now.

Sabrina uses this in nearly every fight. Since then, she also snoops (I swear to God Tina and I didn"t know, or we"d have intervened). Well, the snooping finally pays off a month ago. She hosted a party at her house where another couple was present, Derby being the wife in that couple. Derby was hammered, on the ground in a skirt and made a few passes at Tom. She ended up sending a friend request via Facebook to Sabrina and Tom. She then messages Sabrina saying, "I can"t believe Tom didn"t cover my ass up when I fell", Sabrina then says, "I can"t believe your own husband didn"t do that for you....". Upon snooping, she finds Tom and Derby have been carrying out flirtatious discussions that continued to email, IM"s, texts, and phone calls.

In the emails, she finds some he started sending to Hope. His ex who he supposedly had coffee with when he went back home to visit in PA. Sabrina, IMO, handles the rest poorly. She CALLS Derby and freaks out. Derby insists that she and Tom are only friends, calls Sabrina psycho, yadda yadda. Sabrina was being psycho(Tina and I told her NOT to call). She told her husband about all of it (lolol) and he then says, "I"m canceling my phone and getting a new one where you can"t access it, I will continue talking to Derby, too. You try to control everything, I can"t have any female friends...(etc)"

Later, she drags Hope in and calls her. Says, "My husband is talking to you, talking to another woman, and still coming home and f--king me". Hope tells her that Tom trash talks her, said they"re split up right now and getting divorced, that she"s jealous and controlling, etc. Tom denies most of it. Tom, however, is some high ranked sergeant in the military and is a super bragger about this - he is also an immature cunt. He changes his Facebook status to "widowed" or "engaged" when they fight, it"s the most retarded shit I"ve ever seen. He also, in a fight, used the worst possible wording but so funny I had to share. Tom said to Sabrina, "When I met you, you were Lara Croft. Now you"re Peg Bundy. Derby is more like Lara than you". She posted this on FB, "If I ask a friend or an acquaintance to please stop doing something out of respect for me and mine, I expect that person to have a bit of ettiquette and step down.

There is a true lack of integrity and respect in some of the peopleof this Nation, especially younger generations."

and

"Apparently I"m Peg Bundy, not Lara Croft..."

Not to mention the status updates showing Sabrina is now friends with Tom. Sabrina is marries to Tom. It"s like they let all of us know (even though Tina and I totally know) they"re having problems.

I mean Tina and I constantly laugh at how many chicks on our girl website that don"t allow Facebook in their relationships citing it ruins them. We stupidly pointed out people ruin relationships, not social networking, and were lynched by man-bashers (it gets scary at times). We call ourselves the Men Defenders! Anyway, Sabrina will also make these passive aggressive semi-subtle Facebook status updates to take stabs at the other woman. Since she asked the other woman nicely to leave her husband alone (she did, kinda), she was pissed when Derby said "fuck you, no".

Hope all along seemed nice enough, very apologetic. Said she knew there was something Tom was leaving out, told Sabrina she"d reject his calls from here on, etc. Well, Tom stopped calling her (Hope) and 3 days later, Hope calls Sabrina and was hysterical. She tells Sabrina she"s sorry but when Tom was in PA they spent the night together and had (unprotected) sex.

At this point, Tina and I told Sabrina her always accusing him when he"s innocent is probably pushing him away.[Are we accurate?]We told her she"s mean to him, and she is, she"s always on his shit. We figured this. Sabrina doesn"t control her crazy -- at all. It"s on her sleeve. Since the last incident wasn"t resolved, she was left paranoid and insecure. She had the crazy controlled prior to this. She was riding his ass, always asking where he was, would flip if he added any exes on Facebook, would question him about his female friends, etc. They lost touch, really. They fell into a routine, I think he got bored and instead of bringing it up to her - he did it with someone else. Once she flipped, they went to therapy but with the town they were stationed in, it was more of someone to talk to - not a real therapist. It didn"t work. He WAS willing to go.

Anyway, he denies screwing Hope. His mom even called Sabrina to confirm he was very sick and stayed home (he had the flu). Hope ends up calling non stop like a psycho, and I told Sabrina I think Hope took Tom complaining about her (Sabrina) as coming on to her (Hope). I told her I think she"s lying. I have no doubts Tom cheated, just not with Hope. Tom doesn"t talk to Sabrina, never has, about problems. Sabrina is a serial dweller. We"ve had to make her stop creating all of these false things in her head over all of this.

Yes, Tom should NOT be talking for 4 hours to random chicks all night long while on duty. BUT, we think if Sabrina told him straight up, "I don"t feel like I am over the incident a year ago and it"s really bothering me" he"d have been given a chance to help her feel more secure and hopefully have avoided all of this[Would a dude even give a shit if this was said to him?]Instead, she kept it in and went nuts and pushed him into the arms of someone else.

At this current time, he and her are Facebook married (haha). They are on their second therapy session with a real therapist. He"s opened up with her about random things she does that annoy him. She"s upset she didn"t know and feels stupid because it"s something she can fix. Apparently he can"t stand how she chews her gum. He also said she makes him feel insecure, 5 years ago he was slouching and looked like he had a pot belly and she poked it (he"s very slender and in shape) which hurt his feelings (???). Up until this past month, I didn"t know guys let small weird things bother them. No joke.

They"re getting along, but she"s still hung up on Hope. He"s blocked her and Derby on Facebook, phones, emails, IM"s, etc. He offered to call Hope to confront her for lying, too. I told Sabrina this.

IF Hope is lying, she"s probably nuts. If Tom calls her, what he says will be irrelevant. She will only note that he thought of her and called, him being pissed will not matter. If he wants to confront her, wait until she contacts Tom or you again. Don"t do it out of the blue.[Anyone have to do something like this before?]

I don"t know any guys like Tom. He"s very immature, he"s a total attention whore. It"s extremely clear he whines to a lot of women about his wife to get babied. He tells the same war stories non-stop...only to women. He"s jealous, too. Sabrina was a massage therapist but was accused of fucking her clients so much she finally quit.

It"s weird, though. They can"t split up. It"s so hostile, so...dirty. I couldn"t handle being paranoid daily. I had a couple bouts of insecurity and it nearly drove me insane, that was less than a week. She"s done this for a whole year. They are spending time together, he"s opening up and so is she. BUT, I think she"s going to sabotage it if they don"t resolve the Hope issue (and prevent it from happening again).[Have any of you ever cheated or betrayed someone and got past it? If so, how did you do it?]

This is where I gave the most random advice. He"s away at work a lot, but has access to a PC in his tower thing. That"s how he ends up talking to these women, his wife is asleep or busy being a mom and he talks to other people. He loves FPS games and some MMO"s, she likes crap like Sims. I suggested they play WoW together. I realize this can end up in them bickering, but it"s healthy bickering. It"s bickering without all of these wild accusations and it"s also a way for them to spend time together when he"s away.

I"d like to think they"re better off throwing in the towel and walking away. However, they both fight so hard to stay together and are really trying to make it work. It"s so blatantly obvious it"s going to keep happening if she can"t get past this crap and if he doesn"t learn about boundaries when talking to other women. I"ve never been in situations like that to know what to do. I"ve also never let my crazy get so out-of-control. Just the thought of calling another woman and speaking that way freaks me out.

Anyway, has anyone ever dealt with crap like this? I really want to help her, all I am doing right now is literally calling her daily and saying, "Don"t accuse him of something you don"t know is a fact. You will make him leave you if you keep being psycho". That"s all I"ve got. Haha. How does she help raise HIS self esteem so he stops attention whoring? How can HE help her get over the past, what do they need to do?

PS: Sorry this is kind of all over the place. My elbow is angry and my pain pills make me a little "tarded.

They need to get divorced. ASAP. That shit is a ruined, terrible relationship.

I agree. Just because it never seems to be good with them longer than a week. I don"t think she"ll ever trust him and she"s so vocal about it, it stands no chance.

I couldn"t live that way, I even told her it"s no way to live. She needs to work on her trust issues regardless of who she"s with, too.

Ravvenn said:

Yes, I have. Not something I"d ever brag about, but then again I was 18 or so and pissed off because I got cheated on so I kissed someone else. We "broke up", so technically

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Hahah thats kinda fucked up but I wouldn"t consider it cheating. The most important factor is if you told the dude after the event. I personally have never cheated on someone I was committed with, I even tell those im not "committed" with if I think it would be an issue (no formal obligation but still hurtful).

But I have hooked up with someone within 24hrs of breaking up. And then got back together BUT I did tell them. But as far as I am aware I have never been cheated on. But again the instant I smell shady I will end a relationship. So I probably have.

I also avoid the "I love you forever and ever" relationships. So my perspective is relatively insulated from the drama. I just have a limited amount of giving a fuck so after a few times being burned I don"t think I would ever again want to be in anything serious.

The two people you are asking advice about not only should not be married to each other they should not be married to anyone...probably ever.

Mid-30"s and behave like they are 17. But that entire story boils down to one core problem. There was no trust! If you dont trust someone I cannot fathom how you can continue a marriage/relationship.

Ive had front row seats to some friend drama (Friend caught making out with another friends wife, by the husband, in their fucking own home after a party). And they seemed to work it out. I personally have no fucking idea how. And there were two children involved and they have been together from the age of 16 onward.

But with no children in the picture end that shit ASAP. I guess if you are really really fucking mature and can honestly forgive someone for being shady. And they are actually an otherwise honest person MAYBE it could work.

But super immature,insecure and no trust to say nothing of being petty. Fucking DOOMED.

Vatoreus said:

They need to get divorced. ASAP. That shit is a ruined, terrible relationship.

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You know I read that thing like 10 fucking times. That is a world of crazy. I got someone close who is in their 30s a military person dealing with some wacked out shit like that. He tells me stuff I cant even relate to. Lol for all I know he is that high ranking SGT in the story..

Vatoreus said:

They need to get divorced. ASAP. That shit is a ruined, terrible relationship.

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F this, sounds like they"re made for each other. They both sound like they feed off the drama.

This couple was made for each other, they are obviously too stubborn to stay the hell away from each other, and now with all the damage they are doing to each other everyday, no one else should be anywhere near them.

They don"t need a divorce. They need a reality show.

They"re made for each other. They both thrive on drama and attention and both of them are getting exactly what they want.

There"s two kids between 7 and 10. They"re not his but he raised them as his own, the real dad isn"t in the picture at all.

Story sounds almost like mine, minus the flirting. My crazy ex last year always accused me of stuff I didn"t do and in the end it was what ruined our relationship.

Tell Tom to grab the puppy and run.

Ravvenn said:

There"s two kids between 7 and 10. They"re not his but he raised them as his own, the real dad isn"t in the picture at all.

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Well that makes it much more awful.

Long fucked up story.

My GF and her friends have a rule about not dating anyone who is either in the military or has been in the military. Without getting on a soapbox I tend to agree with them.

Also, they"re both to blame. Tom is an idiot and Sabrina handled it horribly.

At this point, Tina and I told Sabrina her always accusing him when he"s innocent is probably pushing him away. [Are we accurate?]

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So the dude was openly flirting with other women, is confronted about it and knows it"s an issue and goes back to doing it again and it"s her fault? That"s bunk, man, he obviously wants to flirt with these women and whether he"s justifying it by his wife"s treatment of him is irrelevant.

Yes, Tom should NOT be talking for 4 hours to random chicks all night long while on duty. BUT, we think if Sabrina told him straight up, "I don"t feel like I am over the incident a year ago and it"s really bothering me" he"d have been given a chance to help her feel more secure and hopefully have avoided all of this [Would a dude even give a shit if this was said to him?]

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Women don"t talk like this. Even if this is exactly what she was planning to say it wouldn"t come out like this when she discussed it with him. It would end up being a fight because undoubtedly he wouldn"t be apologeticenoughto satisfy her emotions, certainly not aided by the fact that Tom doesn"t appear to be genuinely regretful.

I think she"s going to sabotage it if they don"t resolve the Hope issue (and prevent it from happening again). [Have any of you ever cheated or betrayed someone and got past it? If so, how did you do it?]

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There isn"t a road map because there are a lot of complex emotions from both parties, but I can tell you that step 1 in every case is the offending action has to STOP. The fact that Tom was at it again less than a year after the original(that we know of) instance doesn"t really offer much hope of reconciliation going forward.

Ravvenn said:

At this point, Tina and I told Sabrina her always accusing him when he"s innocent is probably pushing him away. [Are we accurate?]

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I don"t think so, no. From what I can tell, Tom"s getting bored and wandering, and Sabrina while not handling it well isn"t exactly off the mark when she accuses him of cheating or flirting. I mean, the dude DID cheat (errr, re-reading, it appears that he didn"t with Hope but did with someone else?). I dunno, maybe there"s more backstory and she"s been hectoring him for years when he was actually innocent.

But really I don"t think guys react that way. I wouldn"t, anyway. I"d be offended that my woman didn"t trust me, but I"d address that with her. It"s a female thing to be all passive aggressive and go fuck someone on the side because their spouse was mean. Men fuck on the side because they"re bored, it"s rarely an act of revenge. IMO anyway.

Yes, Tom should NOT be talking for 4 hours to random chicks all night long while on duty. BUT, we think if Sabrina told him straight up, "I don"t feel like I am over the incident a year ago and it"s really bothering me" he"d have been given a chance to help her feel more secure and hopefully have avoided all of this [Would a dude even give a shit if this was said to him?]

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If he still truly cares about the relationship and wants it to work, yes. But again, I think that he"s only halfway committed and looking for any excuse to get the rest of the way out.

He also said she makes him feel insecure, 5 years ago he was slouching and looked like he had a pot belly and she poked it (he"s very slender and in shape) which hurt his feelings (???). Up until this past month, I didn"t know guys let small weird things bother them. No joke.

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Everyone has their insecurities. I laugh and joke about going bald, and having a bit of a belly. But some guys can be really, really sensitive about that kind of shit. I think my insecurity is more about what people think or say about me as a person, sometimes that shit can really bother me if I hear that someone that I respect was trashing me behind my back.

I don"t know any guys like Tom. He"s very immature, he"s a total attention whore. It"s extremely clear he whines to a lot of women about his wife to get babied. He tells the same war stories non-stop...only to women.

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I dunno, something about complaining to another woman about your spouse or girlfriend seems to set them off. The only time I cheated in a relationship I was at a bar for a female friend"s birthday, and her cousin was there. She didn"t know many people, and I wasn"t feeling like dancing etc so we started chatting. It came up that I was at the tail end of a relationship that was piddling out due to my lack of interest. I thought I was just chatting innocently with this girl about it, and honestly wasn"t coming on to her or attempting to flirt. Next thing I know she"s literally pinning me up against a wall trying to make out with me, and initially I was resisting. We ended up making out a bit before the guilt took over, and I literally woke up the next day and went and broke up with my girlfriend, feeling terrible for betraying her trust and then dumping her.

Although I"m still good friends with her, she never held it against me, which somehow makes me feel worse for it. A couple years after the fact I was chatting with her best friend, and it came up that she had never even mentioned to her best friend the circumstances of our break up, likely because she didn"t want me to look bad. I felt even more like an asshole when I found that out.

But yeah, you women love wrecking homes.

[Have any of you ever cheated or betrayed someone and got past it? If so, how did you do it?]

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As I said above, we "got past it" but the relationship ended, although it was going to end regardless. In that situation I think it"s that the ex for whatever reason continued to think the world of me and didn"t feel the need to hold a grudge. It probably helped that her boyfriend before me was a grade A asshole who repeatedly cheated and treated her like garbage, so by comparison I pretty much was a saint.

I dunno, I think in any relationship that"s more than a few months and especially if it"s a marriage is never going to recover from cheating. Maybe if it was a one time thing where the cheater was really drunk or hadn"t seen their spouse for months or whatever other extenuating circumstances it can be overcome. But most times it"s not like it was a one time thing. It"s likely that it took them months to work up the courage to actually follow through with cheating. In that case, I don"t know how or why the other half of the relationship should give the person a break. It"s not the physical act, it"s the fact that they worked behind their spouses back for so long to get to that point.

Vatoreus said:

They need to get divorced. ASAP. That shit is a ruined, terrible relationship.

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Pretty much. And in this case I don"t think it"s fair to blame the wife entirely. To me it sounds pretty 50/50. She"s super jealous and accusatory, sure, but he"s a dumbass who has repeatedly betrayed his wife"s trust.

Is that just for men? Tina is former military and very level headed (keeps crazy in check). She shouldn"t be by any means, she had a VERY traumatic childhood, enduring more than any adult I know could ever handle. She"s very sexy, but has always been one of the guys. Actually, she even has a Harley (and bedazzled that thing). She"s not whorish, never slept with anyone while she was in the military except the idiot she married. She did mention several ladies in her bunk thing being total ho"s, sleeping with multiple men in a week.

Maybe she"s the exception!

*Spoilered the rest for length*

Continued on Sabrina...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:I feel bad for Sabrina, and sometimes feel embarrassed for her. Like when you"re watching TV and someone is doing something humiliating and you can"t stand to watch it.

She loves him, and he loves her. It"s terribly sad. They move a lot, he has to train people and crap. Hawaii, Kentucky, all over. She seems bitter about it (she"s ex-military, was let go due to Chrons Disease). I think he isn"t all that aware of the stress of moving or the impact it has on the kids, he"s not home enough to see it. He doesn"t realize how much stress triggers her condition and she has to get surgery when it gets bad.

Then again, she"s unaware of how hopeless he probably feels. The way I see it, even when he"s good, she"s still sad or mad. I told her, men are black and white - they don"t look at every little color and detail. We CANNOT get mad when they dont notice the sparkling floors but do notice when they"re dirty. That"s what dudes do, we have to suck it up.

She is doing better, it"s been a week and she seems to only say things at bedtime. She says when she lays down and her mind wanders, she pictures him in bed with Hope and then tells him.

I told her to pick her fights wisely. He won"t try the way she wants, so stop expecting him to.

It makes me realize how quickly things can snowball into a big shitstorm over bad reactions and communication. It makes me thankful I"m not in a relationship like that. It also gives me more drive to keep myself in check.

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Reply for Gryeyes

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
Gryeyes,

I agree with a lot of your posts, believe it or not. But not your reply to me regarding insecurity and trust.

While my example was exaggerated, it"s true. Any open and honest female will admit to this. It doesn"t necessarily mean they"re fudged up, it means we are emotional little things and we need to keep control of that. By your own logic, I"d say with 100% certainty that everyone you dated had trust and security issues. ;p That"s silly!

Having little bouts of insecurity here and there is normal, I don"t think it traces back to trust, nor do I think it"s a massive problem. Even gorgeous famous women and men have confessed to feeling insecure or not realizing why people find them to be so attractive.

You (men in general) can do things that trigger these bouts. You could have a hard day at work and come home being quiet or end up stonewalling without noticing, using a colder tone when speaking, etc. Even though we (women) aren"t the problem, it will feel like it because this awkwardness is in the air. We end up wondering if we did something wrong.

I think emotions, even stupid ones, are a part of being human. It"s not always a character flaw or the assumed cause of a failed relationship. If both people can realize shit like this can happen and brush it off while working on not doing it as much, I think it"s fine and even healthy.

I also don"t agree these breaks are mandatory. That"s just silly. I"ve had several short trips out of town and so has he. I don"t like them, many times we have changed flights to come home early. Distance doesn"t make my heart grow fonder, but our relationship started with thousands of miles of distance, so maybe that"s why.

Maybe I misunderstood you, if so, sorry! Not trying to argue or anything. I"m just sharing my side of things.

So the dude was openly flirting with other women, is confronted about it and knows it"s an issue and goes back to doing it again and it"s her fault? That"s bunk, man, he obviously wants to flirt with these women and whether he"s justifying it by his wife"s treatment of him is irrelevant.

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Not her fault exactly. But he didn"t do anything for a year (if he did, she"d know because she was snooping daily), that entire year she was accusing him even without any proof he did anything wrong. She gets super mad, yelling and stuff. I personally don"t think yelling is appropriate, I don"t think name calling is either - and they both do that. In the past 8 years I"ve never been yelled at or called a name during an argument and I doubt I ever will be, nor will I ever do that. She even hit him in the face once after he called her a cunt and made him bleed.

I don"t think they respect eachother, they don"t trust eachother, but do love eachother.Love is never enough, ever. I have no idea how they will be able to make this work, I doubt they will. She will struggle to get over her trust issues and he will keep attention whoring when she shells up or spazzes out.

Pretty much. And in this case I don"t think it"s fair to blame the wife entirely. To me it sounds pretty 50/50. She"s super jealous and accusatory, sure, but he"s a dumbass who has repeatedly betrayed his wife"s trust.

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It"s absolutely 50/50.

I should add, he has been trying, also. He"s coming straight home from work, calling her on his breaks, spending time with her watching movies and stuff. It"s all little things, but little things he wasn"t doing when he was chatting with the other women.

He told her straight up, he likes female friends because they"re nice to him and she is always mad at him.