GoT - Is Over, Post Your Drogon Sightings

Merrith · May 23, 2019

Szlia said:
It just put a giant wedge between Jon and Dany, gave the opportunity to Jon to betray Dany by revealing the secret to the Starks, gave Sansa the opportunity to share this secret with Tyrion, knowing full well it would destabilize's Dany's allies. So yeah, the most important reveal in the entire series painted Dany into a corner and convinced her to rule by fear, which conditions the whole ending, but yeah... nothing....

Apparently Missandei/Jorah/dragon deaths were far more important issues in driving her to "rule by fear" even though she had already won when the Lannister army was surrendering. Only made same faces after Missandei got her head cut off, if she was that mad at Jon for anything, she would have executed him. Instead, she just kept trying to get the D from him.

Being the 3 Eyed Raven allowed Bran to give legitimacy to Jon's parentage (see above) and his particular relationship with the Night King lead to the victory against the undeads. So yeah... nothing...

Sam finding the records frankly was far more legit than Bran saying "no seriously, I saw it". Bran had no idea he was actually not a bastard without Sam informing him of the annulment of Rhaegar's first marriage.

Her key influence on that battle was not her parlor tricks, it was sending Arya on her path to fulfill her destiny as the Night King's killer. In the end, it was her whole purpose. Not epic, but critical.

Which was weak as fuck, and the Arya kill was done poorly as well. Zero exposition about her long fight against NK/Others.

Varys' treason and him spreading far and wide Jon's secret was instrumental in painting Dany into a corner and, as such, is critical to reach the ending. So yeah... nothing...

Far and wide to whom? We never have any evidence his letters reach a single person as no one acknowledges Jon's parentage other than those Bran tells and who they in turn tell.

Arya being a facless assassin just meant she single-handedly wiped out the Frey. Her being a trained assassin also meant she could kill the Night King. So yeah... nothing...

Her wiping out the Freys the way she did was well done and made sense with her faceless training. Her killing of the NK was contrive and poorly executed, didn't seem to use any real "faceless" training in doing so other than figuring out how to drop her dagger from one hand to the other.

Jozu · May 23, 2019

Lol....I was one of this shows biggest defenders.

I even kind of glossed over the Dorne shit, and even though I wasnt a huge fan of season 6 or 7, I was kind of still on bored and had a good amount of hope for the final season. But trying to defend what happened this season?

No. There is no explaining the larger plot elements that unfolded this season. All of it is either stupid or doesnt make sense.

Break · May 23, 2019

Don't worry guys, D&D will redeem themselves with the next Star Wars movie.

Halfway through writing the screenplay for the second one, they'll be offered to remake LOTR as a single movie and their heart just won't be in Star Wars anymore.

Goatface · May 23, 2019

Jive Turkey said:
This is a point that a lot of people are missing. The show runners were never meant to handle writing duties aside from adapting for TV. And they did a mostly awesome job of it. When they took on the project, it was with the intent of GRRM finishing his books in time for the show to keep up. It's not their fault that he completely shit the bed and left them with the entire trajectory of the story in their hands. That isn't what they signed up for

the was an interview with grrm after season 2 and he was thinking he had at least 6 more seasons before they ran out of books
during which time he thought he would surely be done with the last book

Chukzombi · May 23, 2019

Jozu · May 23, 2019

LMAO @ Jamie and Cersei being uncovered by Tyrion after being crushed by tons of rubble but still intact, "They were protected by plot armor even after death...."

Chukzombi · May 23, 2019

Jozu said:
LMAO @ Jamie and Cersei being uncovered by Tyrion after being crushed by tons of rubble but still intact, "They were protected by plot armor even after death...."

that dude's videos have been making the last 3 seasons watchable. now its over.

Arbitrary · May 23, 2019

Szlia said:
It just put a giant wedge between Jon and Dany, gave the opportunity to Jon to betray Dany by revealing the secret to the Starks, gave Sansa the opportunity to share this secret with Tyrion, knowing full well it would destabilize's Dany's allies. So yeah, the most important reveal in the entire series painted Dany into a corner and convinced her to rule by fear, which conditions the whole ending, but yeah... nothing....

Jon Snow's true identify is something that was only hinted at for five books spanning over two decades and that's all we get out of it?

That is a long walk for a short glass of water.

Oblio · May 23, 2019

This explains a lot...

Chukzombi · May 23, 2019

Arbitrary said:
Jon Snow's true identify is something that was only hinted at for five books spanning over two decades and that's all we get out of it?

That is a long walk for a short glass of water.

that wedge could have literally been anything, the wedge could easily be Jon and Sansa's relationship driving her crazy because she thinks Jon is betraying her somehow.

Arbitrary · May 23, 2019

Chukzombi said:
that wedge could have literally been anything, the wedge could easily be Jon and Sansa's relationship driving her crazy because she thinks Jon is betraying her somehow.

In the books and in the show as well Robb Stark sends out an official decree legitimizing Jon Snow as Jon Stark and releasing him from his duty at the Night's Watch.

The legitimacy of that decree and its implications would do all the same things and it's all right there.

etchazz · May 23, 2019

Szlia said:
It just put a giant wedge between Jon and Dany, gave the opportunity to Jon to betray Dany by revealing the secret to the Starks, gave Sansa the opportunity to share this secret with Tyrion, knowing full well it would destabilize's Dany's allies. So yeah, the most important reveal in the entire series painted Dany into a corner and convinced her to rule by fear, which conditions the whole ending, but yeah... nothing....

Being the 3 Eyed Raven allowed Bran to give legitimacy to Jon's parentage (see above) and his particular relationship with the Night King lead to the victory against the undeads. So yeah... nothing...

Her key influence on that battle was not her parlor tricks, it was sending Arya on her path to fulfill her destiny as the Night King's killer. In the end, it was her whole purpose. Not epic, but critical.

Cersei is the one who thinks she is diabolical and cunning, but time and time again, the show reminds us (and her) that her father was right about her: she is about as stupid as she thinks she is smart.

Varys' treason and him spreading far and wide Jon's secret was instrumental in painting Dany into a corner and, as such, is critical to reach the ending. So yeah... nothing...

Arya being a facless assassin just meant she single-handedly wiped out the Frey. Her being a trained assassin also meant she could kill the Night King. So yeah... nothing...

I agree with you on that one, except it's not a flaw, it's the point of the story. It's a cautionary tale, for the viewers, but also, in the story itself, for Arya.

Considering you don't seem to understand the story presented to you, I am not sure it's wise of you to go around calling people retards.

I agree though that Bran going from "I can't be Lord! I am not even human anymore!" to "I traveled all this way to be the King", makes very little sense.

Dude, seriously, kill yourself.

Lanx · May 23, 2019

Oblio said:
This explains a lot...

TLDR? no one can watch cobert and not vomit

Lambourne · May 24, 2019

Read a good post on reddit last night which I can't find right now, but the gist of it is that many of the Starks have become extremely unlikable over the past few seasons, especially Arya and Sansa.

Arya's been insufferable since she came back from killing the Freys. Smug and overconfident works in a story for a character that eventually gets their comeuppance, but she never did. She's just this self-appointed dealer of justice that threatens other characters.
Sansa's supposed to be very smart and have learned from Cersei and Littlefinger, but she's been nothing but catty and snide (shushing Edmure, Lord of the Riverlands at a meeting where the lords are to decide on a new king being merely the latest example). Littlefinger was effective because he was friendly and helpful to people's faces while plotting behind their back, that's the main lesson she should have learned from him.
Jon's just been moping around about wanting to follow Dany and not wanting to be king, however he drops all of this as soon as she does something he disagrees with, and turns to assassination immediately. Why not press your claim on the throne if you think you can do better? He was never one to take killing lightly, he was always forced into it and unifying opposing parties is probably his central theme in the first few seasons.

They're really not likable characters any more but they are presented as the good guys we're supposed to be cheering on. I wish there was some deeper meaning to it (like power turns the the good guys into the bad guys) but I'm afraid it's just that badly written.

Ossoi · May 24, 2019

Szlia said:
It just put a giant wedge between Jon and Dany, gave the opportunity to Jon to betray Dany by revealing the secret to the Starks, gave Sansa the opportunity to share this secret with Tyrion, knowing full well it would destabilize's Dany's allies. So yeah, the most important reveal in the entire series painted Dany into a corner and convinced her to rule by fear, which conditions the whole ending, but yeah... nothing....

This is nonsense. Jon's questions about his mother and his bastard status were on his mind from episode 1 and integral to his character.

Think back to the way the show informed the viewer, gradual flashbacks to the Tower of Joy culminating in a reveal that overlapped baby Jon with adult Jon.

The reveal to Jon himself should have lead to scenes of him coming to grips with his new identity, divided loyalties of him to Stark/Targaryen and divided loyalties of his Northern Bannermen now they know he's a Targaryen etc

Instead the only reaction we got was 30s of him squaring up to Sam in defence of Ned's honour, Jon then forgot about it except when it came to sleeping with his aunt. The jilted lover was then used as motivation for genocide

Jon's identity could easily have helped flesh out an entire season

But the way s8 handled it is indefensible

spronk · May 24, 2019

he thought it was confusing

Chukzombi · May 24, 2019

Lambourne said:
Read a good post on reddit last night which I can't find right now, but the gist of it is that many of the Starks have become extremely unlikable over the past few seasons, especially Arya and Sansa.

Arya's been insufferable since she came back from killing the Freys. Smug and overconfident works in a story for a character that eventually gets their comeuppance, but she never did. She's just this self-appointed dealer of justice that threatens other characters.
Sansa's supposed to be very smart and have learned from Cersei and Littlefinger, but she's been nothing but catty and snide (shushing Edmure, Lord of the Riverlands at a meeting where the lords are to decide on a new king being merely the latest example). Littlefinger was effective because he was friendly and helpful to people's faces while plotting behind their back, that's the main lesson she should have learned from him.
Jon's just been moping around about wanting to follow Dany and not wanting to be king, however he drops all of this as soon as she does something he disagrees with, and turns to assassination immediately. Why not press your claim on the throne if you think you can do better? He was never one to take killing lightly, he was always forced into it and unifying opposing parties is probably his central theme in the first few seasons.

They're really not likable characters any more but they are presented as the good guys we're supposed to be cheering on. I wish there was some deeper meaning to it (like power turns the the good guys into the bad guys) but I'm afraid it's just that badly written.

thats a good read, but you're looking at the Starks in TV terms. in reality all of the houses are just rich assholes looking out for their own self interests. its why i got shit for talking up cersei as not being a "villain" (up until they made her a cartoon villain when she blew up the septum) her character was capable of good and bad, but only so much as it benefitted her. the Starks were no different.

Lambourne · May 24, 2019

Not sure if I'm understanding you right, but yes I do look at them in TV terms, because that's ultimately what we're watching. There are rules of storytelling and if they aren't followed at least most of the time you end up with a story that the audience finds boring or confusing, or we end up dislking the characters that the writers want us to like.

Nobody wants to read the story of how Luke left everything behind to go destroy the Death Star, only to die in a bar fight on Tattooine. It's something that could happen but it's not a good story.

Caliane · May 24, 2019

Tarrant said:
So much I haven’t read here so not sure if anyone else had the same line of thinking as me or not I’ve been traveling the last 4 days and haven’t been on here (just a couple posts in this thread is all) or the internet in general much until now.

So, Bran knows the future. He claims he is the three eyed raven and wasn’t Bran anymore.

Well, he confirmed to Sam knowing about Jon’s true origins. He did this knowing he would tell Jon which would lead to Jon telling both his sisters and Dany. He knew this would lead to the North not following Dany and lead to Dany viewing Jon as a threat which would also lead to Jon turning away from her which would also drive her mad and cause her to kill hundreds of thousands of innocents.

Bran knew it would lead to Jon killing Dany and even though he claimed to not be Bran anymore and not desire anything....at the end when asked to be the king he looks up with a slight smile and says “Why do you think I came all this way?”

Bran Stark was the true Mad King the whole time.

If Bran knowing what was going to happen, makes him culpable. What do you think about Cap, allowing 9/11 to happen? or, Harvey Weinstein? or, Jfk?
Steve let every atrocity in the last 60 years happen just so he could dance with a lady.

Oblio · May 24, 2019

Lanx said:
TLDR? no one can watch cobert and not vomit

She had two Brain Hemorrhages whilst filming GoT, I think she said Seasons 1 & 3.

GoT - Is Over, Post Your Drogon Sightings

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