Green Monster Games - Curt Schilling

Flight said:

What Curt is saying is exactly what his company had to say when asked to comment :


Also - and its hard to call this because we don"t know how far along the development cycle their two games were - having projects on the backburner allows you room to allocate resources in their redundant time.



To coin a phrase you won"t have heard for a couple of decades, Curt, "Welcome to the Big Leagues!".

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Agreed on point 1.

Please private email me and let me know when that "redundant" time arrives JK. There is not one iota, not one single spare minute that I know of, on the calendar for the next 18 months if we hope to creating anything close to what we want.

I don"t look at this as a "welcome".

I don"t intend this in the way it sounds, but it"s the only way to say it and make the point. I never looked at this as being welcomed into anything, or being "learned" in a new job. I always looked at it with the same perspective I did playing baseball, there"s never been anyone like me (for better or worse) in this space before. It"s part of the mind game you not only have to play, but believe, to go beyond what many others see as "the limits".

Look, I have 1 year of Junior College under my belt (and truth be told the ML draft was in January so I spent the 2nd half of the year playing baseball and looking for ladies at Lynx Lake Keg parties. Even with that half year I have what might translate to NEGATIVE business education.

These past 3 years I"ve gotten an Ivy league education in business, both the good (rare) and bad sides. My list of "sucks" and "scams" is as long as the Nile. There are so many underachieving frauds in the business world it"s hilarious. There is no shortage of people who would love to take a paycheck and sit in the corner, never outputting one ounce of usable work. I had those folks in my other job but they never made it, never got to the top.

Working with unmotivated leeches is the suck, it"s why we don"t hire them But seeing the mass of folks out in the world LIVING by the motto of "how can I make the most with the least amount of effort" is staggering.

Oh and don"t get me started on how long the list of folks that "I can get you the money in 60 days, I know (name drop inserted here) and I also was golfing with (name drop inserted here) and I"ve raised over eleventy billion dollars for (name drop inserted here).

People name drop on me, dismissing the fact that I lockered next to Cal Ripken. I played with Dale Murphy, Jeff Bagwell, Eddie Murray, Randy Johnson...

Really? You are name dropping on me someone I have no idea who it is, and are surprised when I respond with "Who"s that???"

It"s a movie I tell ya...

Quince said:

I think this is what Curt was talking about earlier about "stylized reality". Has a really cool look to it but it isn"t "Photo realistic".
Reminds me of things like the old Secret of Mana games.

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I could see this from this perspective:

If it can run on a linux/OpenGL netbook or Android/Iphone, etc from a wifi hotspot, then there is unrealized international market share to be tapped (as in the social blog/facebook/twitter crowd, etc)... they are already socially connected & plugged-in. Pushing-up the client"s technical demands beyond that only reduces the number of potential players.

The Dell mini 9 on Ubuntu Linux $279

The one thing I"m really looking forward is to see the lore Salvatore comes up with for the game. I"m not normally a big lore person at all, but I respect and love what he"s been able to do with the books he has written and I can only imagine what he"ll come up with for MMO lore.

Just so long as he learned his lesson and this time when he kills off a character, they -stay- dead.

Fuck you Wulfgar. Fuck you.

Zehn - Vhex said:

Just so long as he learned his lesson and this time when he kills off a character, they -stay- dead.

Fuck you Wulfgar. Fuck you.

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While I generally agree that it ended up being bad for the series, the WAY he came back, that fight and everything, was completely badass.

I"m excited to see what he comes up with as well.

Araxen said:

The one thing I"m really looking forward is to see the lore Salvatore comes up with for the game. I"m not normally a big lore person at all, but I respect and love what he"s been able to do with the books he has written and I can only imagine what he"ll come up with for MMO lore.

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Agreed. I can safely say as a Tolkien, LotRo and fantasy fan, he"s delivered far beyond anything I had hoped for.

Ngruk said:

Agreed. I can safely say as a Tolkien, LotRo and fantasy fan, he"s delivered far beyond anything I had hoped for.

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Does this mean less than 98% of bosses will be insane or corrupted?

Ngruk said:

There is no shortage of people who would love to take a paycheck and sit in the corner, never outputting one ounce of usable work. I had those folks in my other job but they never made it, never got to the top.

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Just like athletics where a runner trains daily, you need to work to be become better. And with this industry, there should never be a shortage of things one could learn. A 2d artist can learn 3d skills, a quest designer can learn level design, etc. The combination of art, programming, and math is what makes game design unique. I can"t fathom how, if one part of it appeals to them, they could feel content with just doing what they"re told to do.

With that in mind, this quote pisses me off quite a bit. As someone who is trying tooth and nail to break into this industry (the last application I filled out was for a company in Norway!), these people are discouraging companies from taking a chance. I"m sure they"re all saying in the interview that they"ll work hard, but they might not even know what that means (it involves Saturday, Sunday, and lots of caffeine). And as a result, you see companies require 1 year of experience for their QA department.

darksensei said:

.... And as a result, you see companies require 1 year of experience for their QA department.

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It is too bad though that the one year of experience doesn"t seem to require them to have been working in QA from what I have seen of the games that have come out in the last couple of years.

Hey Curt, somewhat off-topic, but as an executive/owner of a game development company, I"m interested what your opinion is on this:

Play This Thing! | Game Reviews | Free Games | Independent Games | Game Culture

Mike Capps, head of Epic, and a former member of the board of directors of the International Game Developers Association, during the IGDA Leadership Forum in late 08, spoke at a panel entitled Studio Heads on the Hot Seat, in which, among other things, he claimed that working 60+ hours was expected at Epic, that they purposefully hired people they anticipated would work those kinds of hours, that this had nothing to do with exploitation of talent by management but was instead a part of "corporate culture," and implied that the idea that people would work a mere 40 hours was kind of absurd.

Now, of course, the idea that a studio head, which Capps is, would have such notions is highly plausible; but he was, at the time, a board member of the IGDA, an organization the ostensible purpose of which is to support game developers. Not, you know, to support management dickheads.

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There"s been a lot of back-and-forth going on for the last few days in the development community about this. Any thoughts?

And "that" is why I lost all interest in working in game development. 60 hour weeks for a wage that is probably lower than most people in a similar professional position earn in 40 or 45. Not to mention that the industry is very hard to break into, and even if you "do" break in, your chances of landing a job working on a game that interests you instead of making Generic Sports Game or Generic WW2 FPS 5 is even lower.

Honestly, the gaming industry just comes off as a horrible, horrible place to work, and you have to wonder if this translates into a lot of talented artists/designers/programmers going into other fields of work which offer much better income and work environment. On the flip side, it almost guarantees that everyone who works on a game does so because they"re passionate about gaming, but I think passion by itself only goes so far.

Azrayne said:

And "that" is why I lost all interest in working in game development. 60 hour weeks for a wage that is probably lower than most people in a similar professional position earn in 40 or 45.

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Well, one of the major points is that most developers are salaried and don"t get paid for anything past 40 hours a week. Working a shitload of overtime is one thing; working a shitload of overtime and not getting compensated for it is something completely different.

Lonin said:

Hey Curt, somewhat off-topic, but as an executive/owner of a game development company, I"m interested what your opinion is on this:

Play This Thing! | Game Reviews | Free Games | Independent Games | Game Culture



There"s been a lot of back-and-forth going on for the last few days in the development community about this. Any thoughts?

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Thoughts? Ya, I couldn"t disagree more. You can create a multi-billion dollar company and not ruin peoples lives in the process. It"s been done before, it"s being done now, and it will be done again.

There is also a difference, imo, between being "at work" 40-60 hours a week, and being in a place where you "work" but aren"t looking at the clock 2 hours before lunch, and 2 hours before the day ends.

Every ounce of the above falls on management and leadership. Create the culture, create the environment to let super talented people maximize their talents, have leadership and management that defends that culture, your people, their families and lives and then get the hell out of the way and let them make stuff.

Management and perhaps especially technical management (or maybe that"s just the part I know best) often get trapped by a need to show concrete efforts on their own part. It"s tough to justify your position and salary when all you can show is happy productive staff with little paper trail between your own efforts and that success. It drives many a manager crazy as well.

I know that sounds and is ridiculous but in many organizations you end up in cover-your-ass mode from the start. Sadly, the best way to do so often is to be a bad manager with a lots of documentation about every single thing you are doing, even if you know it is the wrong way to get results.Thatis most often the difficulty in transition from small to big.

Ngruk said:

People name drop on me, dismissing the fact that I lockered next to Cal Ripken. I played with Dale Murphy, Jeff Bagwell, Eddie Murray, Randy Johnson...

I don"t look at this as a "welcome".

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No disrespect to any of those people, but I live in the UK and I"ve never heard a single one of them. (I"m in no way playing down their reputations - I"m sure they are hugely respected people who have achieved a lot).

I never heard of Curt Schilling the sports legend, I learned about Curt Schilling from researching GMG, then 38S, and from how you talk about your ethos and your company here. I like you and respect you - a lot - but that"s all about your personality and character, the way you and your company approach business and other people and the way you all will accept nothing except striving to do and be be the best.


It reminds me of when I left Uni (at 31 - I"d done 9 years in the Army!) - I had a number of jobs offers including a Project Manager position at Government Communications HQ (kind of spy HQ - not sure if there is a US equivalent), Arthur Anderson, KPMG and others. I read a few books on the history of IBM and they struck a chord - in the same way 38S did. I remember thinking when I started at IBM it was like "coming home" because of the culture and tradition of excellence they had been built upon (hey, they"ve changed, but lets not go there). That"s the way I feel about 38S and Curt Schilling. That"s not blowing BS , that"s the way I talk about 38S not just here but on numerous other forums. That"s how I know that games that come out of 38S are going to kick ass.


Not sure if I am communicating what I am trying to say well at all - what I"m trying to get at is the "welcome" wasn"t in any way putting down the foundations or ethos of 38S or any of your achievements in the past or "the now". It was a light hearted appreciation that not only are 38S doing a great job, but that you"re also at a place to decide on the future of other established organizations and games. It was purely about being in a position to consider bidding on BGH.

Ngruk said:

Thoughts? Ya, I couldn"t disagree more. You can create a multi-billion dollar company and not ruin peoples lives in the process. It"s been done before, it"s being done now, and it will be done again.

There is also a difference, imo, between being "at work" 40-60 hours a week, and being in a place where you "work" but aren"t looking at the clock 2 hours before lunch, and 2 hours before the day ends.

Every ounce of the above falls on management and leadership. Create the culture, create the environment to let super talented people maximize their talents, have leadership and management that defends that culture, your people, their families and lives and then get the hell out of the way and let them make stuff.

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Well said. The only thing I would add is, once you"ve empowered the staff and got out of their way, ensure everyone has a personal development plan that includes external, formal education. For some this will be formal study of things they are already doing or starting to do, for others it opens up the possibility of cross training (eg programmers and artists into project management) to those who have the ability and the desire. You"ll initially think your staff don"t have the man hours to do that, but, if the right people are doing the right qualifications, their skills and productivity will rapidly increase and pay back the half day a week of missed work, and then some. THIS is what is missing from the entire industry. You will fail if you don"t do this, by your high standards - you might still be the best out there, but you won"t become half of what you could be, without it. You are failing your staff and your company if you don"t nurture them and develop them beyond their present abilities.


Now having said all that, I have some REAL sport to go watch - Liverpool are at home to Blackburn today and I have about 90 minutes to get ready and get there

Lonin said:

There"s been a lot of back-and-forth going on for the last few days in the development community about this. Any thoughts?

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The usual. Anyone who expects "many" people to be productive and creative working 80 hours a week is someone with lots of delusions in human nature.

While there are people who can work obscene amounts of time and be significantly productive, those people are exceptions.

In 99% of the case, you will improve productivity by replacing one person working 80 hours by 2 persons working 40 hours. The real point is, as always, that it costs more. If you are squeezed by the bottom line, then you need to drive people to 80 hours. But that"sif. Expecting it as normal is a strong indicator of management failure.

There"s also a very large corpus of indicators that tell us that, as time spent and stress rises, mistakes rise. Working 80 hours under in crunch time, you make far more mistakes than you would otherwise - mistakes that will have to be caught, and fixed (again, barring exceptional - and rare - individuals). There are outfits in which mistakes are the primary cost of software. The successful programming methods there kick you out of the workplace - litterally - when it"s time. Because the little bit of productivity you might squeeze by working until 9pm is more than offset by the hours spent fixing the errors you probably added between 5 and 9.

Ukerric said:

The successful programming methods there kick you out of the workplace - litterally - when it"s time.

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There needs to be more of this in the industry, too. I"m a retired software engineer. Loved the work, would put in 60 or more hours a week simply because it waslife.

But, that was not a good thing. I didn"t reach a Lazlo level of crack, but I did end up a bit broken.

Take care of your people.

In my opinion, having worked a few IT jobs which required overtime if work was there and needed to be done; It can"t be stressed enough to take care of your people.

At one job, we were expected to put in up to 85 hours a week if work was there. Having a contract with a defense contractor which had 300k+ employees meant there was ALWAYS work there. This job took care of me; I didn"t mind spending 12 hour days, and then a few hours on the weekend.

Yeah, we put in a ton of hours, and got paid very well given the overtime. But it was the little things; We were given ample people for big jobs, we were provided with free, cold water all the time. We were provided with free coffee. We were provided with a free lunch a month (WELL catered; not just a $10 gift card to Mickie D"s) if we had the work done. We were provided with free juice as well; Sodas were available for weekend/after 7pm work); Our breaks weren"t metered; they didn"t give a damn as long as a day"s work got done in a day. We were also given up to 10 hours a month of formal training for job related tasks that was optional; and this was paid time. We were given vouchers for certifications, and they paid a good chunk of student loans if you could manage to fit classes into the schedule (I think they allowed you to not work overtime during class time; I worked this job just after graduation, so I don"t know).

They metered our jobs; made sure no job was charged longer than was supposed to be. In fact, the average job was done in 50% of the time that the contract stated it would be; and we got 2x the work done. The contract just kept throwing job after job after job at us.



On the contrary; I was working a job where they capped you at 60 hours a week. This job was rigid on hours, providing zero flexibility on working around a class schedule (I got off at 4; had class at 5 30 minutes away in traffic; by all means it SHOULD have worked); If I was assigned overtime, my classes be damned as far as they were concerned. It was also stated work was flexible around class schedules in the offer letter; You were simply expected to be able to flex with classes some. They metered my breaks to an extremity. If my break was at 2, and I took it at 2:05 you can bet there would be an e-mail waiting for me when I got back reprimanding me; I generally took less than the given time for breaks too. I hated that job with a passion.


So yeah, take care of your people and I can tell you they will put in the work.

Also; its a good idea to try and stop people from working destructive hours, even if it costs you a day or so in the schedule.