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yup. we do camera mandatory 1 hour team standup every morning. 1 30 minute 1 on 1 with leader per week. thats about it. if i suck it will show.
IT/Software career thread: Invert binary trees for dollars.
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Phazael
Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
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I turn my camera on for key meetings that have been scheduled in advance and I even dress up for them to a degree, hoping the zoomers get the fucking hint about professionalism. They tried that shit on us both at DHS and at my current gig. The DHS one got killed in the crib for anyone in a tech role because A) we were all contractors and B) it was unsecure video surveillance of people directly working with sensitive systems and information. They stopped doing it with the admin people because Teams sucks and it was killing our entire site's bandwidth, which we also warned the gov slugs about ahead of time. At my present gig, the tech people just flatly said no across the board and someone clever brought up that it was discriminatory if the same standard was not applied to everyone, including the executive leadership, so our legal team put the kibosh on that fairly quickly.
If you cannot tell who is working and who is fucking around, then you are a failure at the most basic management role. This kind of shit is literally management wanting to not have to do their fucking jobs or hoping to leverage RTO so they can walk around the cube farms full of peasants like they are actually contributing something.
If you cannot tell who is working and who is fucking around, then you are a failure at the most basic management role. This kind of shit is literally management wanting to not have to do their fucking jobs or hoping to leverage RTO so they can walk around the cube farms full of peasants like they are actually contributing something.
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Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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Yeah I mean any good manager knows how to figure out how much work someone is putting in. Even for someone like me who doesn't do very many commits but is constantly working supporting the program. They could easily ask anyone on the program and know n
Haus
I am Big Balls!
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There is a regional VP of sales I deal with on some calls where he has his bi-weekly status/forecasting calls. And at some point he is usually going to call on individual account managers to give an update on their pipeline, etc. Normal sales stuff. Now, he usually runs long and doesn't have enough time to call out each AM.
What he does? He starts calling people by name to give their updates, and I noticed... he always starts with all the people who don't have their cameras on. heh So he get's through most of them, and has to say "Well, the rest of you guys just update salesforce for me today, will ya?" and most/all of the people who had cameras on get to avoid in person updates.
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LiquidDeath
Magnus Deadlift the Fucktiger
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If replacing US IT workers with Indians for 80% savings is such a magical, wonderful thing for companies then why were none of these companies founded in India then or now? Why aren't fully Indian IT companies storming the global market?
Weird.
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Rezz
Mr. Poopybutthole
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It's actually for exactly the reason that was laid out by you and Kirun.
Generally speaking, your average indian tech person is doing it to get out of abject poverty. There's a reason why the overwhelming majority of programmers that come out of India are Java guys - it's the quickest way they can get to being a "software engineer" and afford shoes for their children. The vast majority learn just Java and enough understanding to follow guidelines on setting up VSCode to kind of be an assembly line worker for coding. It also means that they on average don't do tons of extracurricular work in coding, and once they land a position they try and keep just that position for as long as they can. And this isn't a huge knock on those types of workers; they in many cases are literally living in huts or super cramped subsidized housing.
The upper echelon of the caste system actually takes computer science to some degree, and the reason they aren't starting super cheap ass companies of just Indians to rule every software subindustry is that they know this about India. There's a reason that many US tech companies have indians spread throughout management but they are almost always 'Americanized' indians, or indians that studied here and generally start their companies here in the US - Money. The rupee translation is ridiculous, and the smarter/better educated/trained folks know this. So they start or work for US companies and try to actually live in the US so they can make all the moneyhats. The assembly line indians? Live in India and make the fraction that is the primary reason that western/1st world nations use them as cheap tech labor. It's why Iphones are made in china and they don't just import poor chinese people here to make iphones locally. They'd have to pay them US money vs. paying them China money.
Being the world leader in <insert sub industry of tech here> but making Indian wages is just a bad decision, and the indians capable of starting competitive companies know this.
I forget the exact parameters (it's been a few years) but you can tell someone's caste position by their name. If you go through your lists of indian based programmers, you're going to see people who actually know what they are doing typically have shorter total names, while your assembly line indian coders have like twenty consonants or something.
It's not that india only produces bad coders/etc, it's that the entire reason that western companies hire them is that they can get "good enough" assembly line coders from there to basically fling at tasks while better trained/educated/smarter people direct the herd. So the indians based in india that most people are working with on average are these assembly line coders. The good ones try to get to the west so they can make western wages.
Generally speaking, your average indian tech person is doing it to get out of abject poverty. There's a reason why the overwhelming majority of programmers that come out of India are Java guys - it's the quickest way they can get to being a "software engineer" and afford shoes for their children. The vast majority learn just Java and enough understanding to follow guidelines on setting up VSCode to kind of be an assembly line worker for coding. It also means that they on average don't do tons of extracurricular work in coding, and once they land a position they try and keep just that position for as long as they can. And this isn't a huge knock on those types of workers; they in many cases are literally living in huts or super cramped subsidized housing.
The upper echelon of the caste system actually takes computer science to some degree, and the reason they aren't starting super cheap ass companies of just Indians to rule every software subindustry is that they know this about India. There's a reason that many US tech companies have indians spread throughout management but they are almost always 'Americanized' indians, or indians that studied here and generally start their companies here in the US - Money. The rupee translation is ridiculous, and the smarter/better educated/trained folks know this. So they start or work for US companies and try to actually live in the US so they can make all the moneyhats. The assembly line indians? Live in India and make the fraction that is the primary reason that western/1st world nations use them as cheap tech labor. It's why Iphones are made in china and they don't just import poor chinese people here to make iphones locally. They'd have to pay them US money vs. paying them China money.
Being the world leader in <insert sub industry of tech here> but making Indian wages is just a bad decision, and the indians capable of starting competitive companies know this.
I forget the exact parameters (it's been a few years) but you can tell someone's caste position by their name. If you go through your lists of indian based programmers, you're going to see people who actually know what they are doing typically have shorter total names, while your assembly line indian coders have like twenty consonants or something.
It's not that india only produces bad coders/etc, it's that the entire reason that western companies hire them is that they can get "good enough" assembly line coders from there to basically fling at tasks while better trained/educated/smarter people direct the herd. So the indians based in india that most people are working with on average are these assembly line coders. The good ones try to get to the west so they can make western wages.
Kirun
Buzzfeed Editor
- 20,149
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Huh? TCS is literally the WORLD'S largest IT services firm by market cap. There's also Infosys, which is another massive IT firm they own.
LiquidDeath
Magnus Deadlift the Fucktiger
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Lol, Infosys is a visa-abusing shit hole with the 255th largest market cap in the world and TCS, the IP thieving H1B abusing, 110th largest market cap?
I said why aren't Indian companies dominating? These two may originate in India but only make money by abusing visas in the US. Why oh why can't they just make money in India providing that world class, number 1 IT service? It is so confusing.
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ToeMissile
Pronouns: zie/zhem/zer
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Don’t forget HCL. Though I know of them mostly for more admin/ops type stuff. When I was at Xerox pretty much everything but sales was offshored.
Kirun
Buzzfeed Editor
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Amongst IT service firms? Damn, that's a lot of IT firms.
Why waste time on a shithole like India when it seems to me like they're dominating America pretty well? Otherwise, you guys wouldn't be bitching about all the H1B abuse, shoddy workmanship, etc. if they weren't generating so much competition.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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It isn't H1B or sponsorships anymore bud. But I guess you are too far up your own ass to actually look around and evaluate what is happening.
It's American companies buying office space in Latin America and India and laying off large portions of their American workforce and "nearshoring" (fucking lol what a term) to Latin America or offshoring to India with FTEs. They honestly believe AI will fill any knowledge or experience gaps.
This is not the same thing as what has happened in the past in the tech industry. This is quite different.
It's American companies buying office space in Latin America and India and laying off large portions of their American workforce and "nearshoring" (fucking lol what a term) to Latin America or offshoring to India with FTEs. They honestly believe AI will fill any knowledge or experience gaps.
This is not the same thing as what has happened in the past in the tech industry. This is quite different.
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TJT
Mr. Poopybutthole
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This is the broader problem. Especially right now. The suits truly believe and are heavily investing in the idea that AI agents and the like take a retard and make him into what was a chad programmer 15 years ago immediately. Doing exactly the Vibe Coding memes that we all laugh at but are very very real.
We are at the point where businesses are gleefully walking into the trap not realizing it even is one. These AIs are SAAS products at their core. For everyone not in the know here the way this works for a company like say, Salesforce, is you get your first bit free. Then you get a really good sweetheart deal for a few years.
Once your business is utterly dependent on this service to operate they close the trap and raise prices on you to just the amount you can bear without deciding its better to invest in something else. Which often translates to a sweetheart deal with some other service and maybe you rotate around.
This is what AI is. The up and coming generation of tech people are going to be utterly dependent on AI to do any task at all. Now the streetshitters you saved all that money on come with an additional $30k a year in AI costs just to do the baseline stuff you hired them for. This will apply to the Gen Z devs too.
This is happening right now. We are all in on Cursor and are monitoring our spend. The average engineer is running up $1k a month in Cursor AI costs across the organization.
I hope you can see how much of a shitshow this is about to be.
We are at the point where businesses are gleefully walking into the trap not realizing it even is one. These AIs are SAAS products at their core. For everyone not in the know here the way this works for a company like say, Salesforce, is you get your first bit free. Then you get a really good sweetheart deal for a few years.
Once your business is utterly dependent on this service to operate they close the trap and raise prices on you to just the amount you can bear without deciding its better to invest in something else. Which often translates to a sweetheart deal with some other service and maybe you rotate around.
This is what AI is. The up and coming generation of tech people are going to be utterly dependent on AI to do any task at all. Now the streetshitters you saved all that money on come with an additional $30k a year in AI costs just to do the baseline stuff you hired them for. This will apply to the Gen Z devs too.
This is happening right now. We are all in on Cursor and are monitoring our spend. The average engineer is running up $1k a month in Cursor AI costs across the organization.
I hope you can see how much of a shitshow this is about to be.
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LiquidDeath
Magnus Deadlift the Fucktiger
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Are you secretly an Indian faggot? You sure go hard in the paint for them.
Regardless, it isn't about a single or even a few thousand competent, even brilliant H1B workers that are "Americanized". It is that we get chain-migrated extended families who don't have our values, don't care about them, and expect us to deal with their disgusting bullshit values. That isn't even talking about bringing caste issues into our country unnecessarily and completely ignoring the fact that they are profligate cheaters in everything they can possibly cheat at.
And triple lol at "generating competition". They are simply providing slave wage, H1B bodies that are cheaper than Americans only because of globalist cunt politicians providing kickback incentives for companies like motherfucking Infosys to bring them in and fill chairs. Every single person on this board in IT has a myriad of stories about how under qualified, underperforming Indians are kept around, even promoted, due to blatant nepotism and cost-saving strategies.
They are third world assholes that need to return to the third world and stop shitting up both our company culture and our communities, especially since not a single one can learn to fucking mow their lawn correctly or consistently. Simping for "intelligent" third world clowns that, as a people, can't pull in their trash cans for 3 days after it is collected is bitch-made.
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stupidmonkey
Not Smrt
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Yep. We are now at the do you want 1 American dev or 2 Mexican for your teams. So basically now I have no choice but to hire "near shore". All started going downhill once the CFO became the new CEO.
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LiquidDeath
Magnus Deadlift the Fucktiger
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My company has had one there for a decade. The workers are fine, better than Indians, but management will never understand that you can't replace the type of work that white Americans do by paying brown people less and teaching them English. They still don't come from the culture of innovation and calculated rule-breaking necessary to mimic our success.
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Kirun
Buzzfeed Editor
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Cool. We agree.
The original statements by me were to shed light on why management are making these propositions and decisions - not whether or not I agree with the practice of H1B.
Regardless, you're admitting yourself they are "takin' 'er 'jerbs", right? So, they are definitely "generating competition". They may not be doing it via competence and skillset, but they are absolutely out competing you from a wage standpoint. The same exact thing happened to the construction industry in this country 30-40 years ago. Wage pressure is a significant thing for a business and one of the main things any "meddling" manager is going to look at when weighing options on who to hire/fire.
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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I look at it less of them taking our jobs, but actually making us look better and providing job security.
The engineers we have from Bangalore are abysmal engineers. I don't even know if I'd classify them as engineers.
The engineers we have from Bangalore are abysmal engineers. I don't even know if I'd classify them as engineers.