Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

Pasteton said:

this sounds scary to say, but from a purely class design perspective I haven’t seen anything better than what nick did (ie copied from eq)

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I feel like class design during Nick's tenure was perfect. But I also feel like class design after Nick's tenure is perfect. So...

Anyone have any pve code invites?

fanaskin said:

CONTRADICTORY STATEMENTS

exp loss, corpse runs, no gate, all these things increase the range of possible emotions. the guy I was argueing with before whose name escapes me kept saying "enhances the experience" like you just add +1 to an experience and make it better. like no bitch, that's now how it works, without "danger", the range of possible emotional reactions is smaller, it's just the way human beings act sorry.

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I could've written a LOT more to clarify what I was talking about, but you clearly did not get what I was saying. I know it's a meme at this point, but what you're describing is 'immersion', and contrary to popular belief, 'immersion' is not a positive thing if the experience you are immersed in is frustration and misery. I agree, consequences and 'danger' DO create immersion, players will be more 'immersed' in the outcome of a big fight if the consequences of losing are losing a level and having to embark on a hellish corpse run. Here's the thing though, you can EASILY make dying a consequence to be feared without possibly having to spend possible hours before you can start playing the game again. Even something as simple as giving players the option of respawning at the nearest 'safe spot' instead of their bind would be a massive improvement in player experience without compromising ANY 'immersion'. The consequence is still there, you just get to respawn nearby with your group instead of scattered around the world as you figure out a way to get everyone back before you can even START your corpse retrieval. The only emotion being 'lost' is frustration, and if that's the only cost of a QoL mechanic, it should be a no-brainer. This is the absolute MINIMUM that can be changed from EQ, you can do a lot more before you begin losing 'immersion'.

I could go on and on, but the point is, when EQ was in development, the goal wasn't to create an elitist game that's 'NoT fOr EvEryOnE'. No, the goal was to appeal to anyone interested in an online DnD style fantasy experience, it would've never reached 400k subs and ruled the genre for years if it didn't.

fanaskin said:

better graphics actually don't matter because the human brain processes sharp edges better than smooth edges so low polygon art sticks out and is more memorable.

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The art still needs good stylization to take advantage of this, but MnM’s character designs are limited to amorphous blobs and noodle-armed stick figures. The game’s overall aesthetic is like a drab, lifeless cartoon mismatched with realistic environmental effects. Memorable for all the wrong reasons.

I'm really having fun with beta, but it needs more time to cook. The only bad move I think they can make at this point is entering EA too early and October might be pushing it.

The Wizard tears with the recent rework were priceless. Some of these idiots think they're already paying a sub.

As for Rogue it'll definitely be receiving a rework. Currently it's like a mashup of EQ/WOW but your entire kit is unlocked by 16. Pretty enjoyable on the class fantasy though. Hamming it up as a loot goblin, stealthing around dungeons, sniping named and occasionally stumbling across rotting treasure has scratched an itch.

uniqueuser said:

The art still needs good stylization to take advantage of this, but MnM’s character designs are limited to amorphous blobs and noodle-armed stick figures. The game’s overall aesthetic is like a drab, lifeless cartoon mismatched with realistic environmental effects. Memorable for all the wrong reasons.

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I don't fault you for not enjoying the style but this is just absolute nonsense. Lmao

fanaskin said:

I dunno, I like that I don't have to get to 20-30 to get your core spells, it's funny though fighters get their second to last skill at like 16 and their last skill (triple attack) at 50.

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I agree to an extent, but you unlock the kit by 16 and there is not a single skill you get after that. To your point, sounds like Fighters are in the same position.

rad said:

I agree to an extent, but you unlock the kit by 16 and there is not a single skill you get after that. To your point, sounds like Fighters are in the same position.

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They have said more things are coming or will be fleshed out through all levels of martial classes. Hopefully it is not just same skill more damage but we will see.

Rogues still have the whole poison system that can fill in for mechanics. It needs a whole work over though. Months ago I looked at trying to make the snare poison and it required specific drop from level 20+ Asps (not just any snake). From reading on the Discord, it's also a rare-ish drop, which makes it next to worthless for the vast majority of players.

I'm not sure what else could really fill in for rogues while still keeping it EQ like. It will be interesting to see what they can come up with.