Siliconemelons
Ssraeszha Raider
- 15,530
- 25,145
That is with infravision and yesterday or so, after the patch.
- 1
Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO
- Thread starter Flobee
- Start date
That is with infravision and yesterday or so, after the patch.
Araxen
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 11,448
- 8,934
Don't give them ideas. lol70% racial xp penalty for ultravision classes!
The whole darkness thing sounds cool on paper, but in practice it makes for an unfun gameplay experience. What's the point of making zones a large fraction of the races can't see. Going top side with the deep races just makes the game look bad. It's a puzzling decision.
I was going to play Shaman, but they just aren't as fun as EQ Shamans. I'm thinking Wiz or Elem right now. Who knows maybe Bard.
Kithani
Vyemm Raider
- 2,632
- 3,744
Let’s be real though, when people whine about MnM Shaman what they really mean is “I loved Shaman in EQ because it was an OP top 3 class and it isn’t here” lol
- 4
- 1
Hekotat
FoH nuclear response team
- 13,435
- 14,021
Some were saying the light sources for Ultravision hadn't been added to areas yet. Unsure how true that is, but would make more sense.
Grabbit Allworth
Confirmed J6 Insurrectionist
- 2,160
- 8,517
I still don't have a single minute played in this game (waiting for release), but I do watch each of Shawn's vods. That said, a fair number of the design decisions seem to follow the same way I used to approach running my D&D campaigns. Which doesn't surprise me at all given how heavily influenced Shawn is by D&D.
Anyway, a number of my ideas and systems made incredible sense (almost infallible) in theory, but they were completely dogshit (or just aggravating) in practice.
There are some things that make a huge amount of 'sense' in games like this, but they simply can't be implemented without being unbalanced, overly-abrasive, or a complete waste of time.
Unfortunately, I think those mistakes have to be experienced/witnessed first-hand to be fully understood. Let's just hope that they're quick to fix those mistakes when they become obvious.
P.S.
I don't watch the vods live, but I do regularly see a chatter named Cinexa and I know it's a reach, but is anyone familiar enough with that person to know her guild EQ history? I was guilded with a Cinexa in TR.
Anyway, a number of my ideas and systems made incredible sense (almost infallible) in theory, but they were completely dogshit (or just aggravating) in practice.
There are some things that make a huge amount of 'sense' in games like this, but they simply can't be implemented without being unbalanced, overly-abrasive, or a complete waste of time.
Unfortunately, I think those mistakes have to be experienced/witnessed first-hand to be fully understood. Let's just hope that they're quick to fix those mistakes when they become obvious.
P.S.
I don't watch the vods live, but I do regularly see a chatter named Cinexa and I know it's a reach, but is anyone familiar enough with that person to know her guild EQ history? I was guilded with a Cinexa in TR.
Last edited:
Kithani
Vyemm Raider
- 2,632
- 3,744
Yeah but did you have a discord full of people wacking you off and claiming every idea you had was perfect and anyone that didn’t have fun should just “go play Candyland”
- 1
Grabbit Allworth
Confirmed J6 Insurrectionist
- 2,160
- 8,517
To be fair, I'm not in the Discord channel and my only exposure to the game comes from here and the vods, but there does seems to be a large amount ass-kissing for the MnM team, but there's also a lot of people calling them complete retards.
Impossible situation, really.
Araxen
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 11,448
- 8,934
That's the reward for getting a million tells in raids for buffs. I also believe every class should have something overpowered about them. It makes them more fun to play.
- 2
- 2
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
- 40,094
- 20,009
I think the game has a good chance but they need to stop designing themselves into a corner with this hardcore shit like the darkness.
It's the one piece of the game I think is just completely unfun
Kithani
Vyemm Raider
- 2,632
- 3,744
Grabbit Allworth
Confirmed J6 Insurrectionist
- 2,160
- 8,517
Despite not having played the game, I find the buff duration issue irritating.
I understand their perspective insofar that they're trying to promote a world where players need to regularly interact with each other. Furthermore, I imagine that they don't want the issue that EQ has where you have a huge pile of people in PoK that come in, get 3h+ buffs and then fuck off to solo.
However, with EQ, the root of the issue is not the buff duration. It's the mercs and power of buffs that eliminate the need to group. At least until much, much later in the game. Of course, boxing is also a major factor, but that's a completely different, massive can of worms.
I don't have any idea how powerful buffs are in MnM, but as long as they don't enable soloing for an hour+, their duration should not be a pain point.
Having to recast buffs over and over is just irritating. I think 99.99999999% players would choose a longer duration buff even if it required a costly, vendor-bought (or maybe tradeskilled) component.
I understand their perspective insofar that they're trying to promote a world where players need to regularly interact with each other. Furthermore, I imagine that they don't want the issue that EQ has where you have a huge pile of people in PoK that come in, get 3h+ buffs and then fuck off to solo.
However, with EQ, the root of the issue is not the buff duration. It's the mercs and power of buffs that eliminate the need to group. At least until much, much later in the game. Of course, boxing is also a major factor, but that's a completely different, massive can of worms.
I don't have any idea how powerful buffs are in MnM, but as long as they don't enable soloing for an hour+, their duration should not be a pain point.
Having to recast buffs over and over is just irritating. I think 99.99999999% players would choose a longer duration buff even if it required a costly, vendor-bought (or maybe tradeskilled) component.
Kithani
Vyemm Raider
- 2,632
- 3,744
I think they’ll cave on buffs long term but keep SoW shorter duration. It seems like a bandaid meant to fix SoW and they just kinda rolled with all the buffs while they were at it.
That really was the problem where SoW enables just way different gameplay for 1hr
I also hate the buff gameplay especially in a game without spellsets to swap multiple spells with fewer button clicks
That really was the problem where SoW enables just way different gameplay for 1hr
I also hate the buff gameplay especially in a game without spellsets to swap multiple spells with fewer button clicks
- 1
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
- 40,094
- 20,009
Agree they could chill with SoW but the rest... Ugh
There are some OP buffs like the dude that tossed me the +25 damage thorn at level 3 and I just ran through a growing everything on sight and they died on swing
There are some OP buffs like the dude that tossed me the +25 damage thorn at level 3 and I just ran through a growing everything on sight and they died on swing
Siliconemelons
Ssraeszha Raider
- 15,530
- 25,145
And here is the problem.
This game is way too fast to be "D&D" EQ was as close as we can get to that... and not moving around 1 square at a time makes most "D&D" things broken.
Class stuff is class stuff and can be adjusted and should be as that is the point - but you have to take into account the people PLAYING these classes, and the attitude thus far has not been a good one. Like EQ the devs are obviously not fans of, nor play hybrid / knights
Kirun
Buzzfeed Editor
- 21,957
- 19,401
This was only an issue because you did one of two things -
Made a buff too powerful so that everybody felt forced to have it. Or you designed a class whose only purpose is to buff, so when you give said class 3 hour durations, that's all they'll use the class for.
Solution? Design better buffs and design better classes. Don't punish players with tedious bullshit only there to force interaction you can't create naturally.
Gravel
Mr. Poopybutthole
- 48,163
- 174,730
Just curious, but are the cities for the deep races ass? If everyone is playing deep races, why bother with NH at all anymore?