Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

alovingrobot said:

In theory it could be called a project management issue, given the examples of the Deep zones and their itemization. But mainly because the project management going into EA launch was 'we really need to get these zones in place, even if they're buggy and/or incomplete.' The focus was on the continuity of the world space for right or wrong, and standing Underdocks and AV up.

The designer working on Caves of Irem and Great Cavern Sea is more experienced than a lot of the other guys, so he's pretty fast (and can do both art/design). But between slamming the remaining zones in and focusing on trying to get the first pass on classes done, we weren't running all of the itemization through systems designers.

The issues that've popped up with some of the spawns, item balance, etc have all been really good for us internally, because it's led to us getting better auditing tooling in place, refreshing discussions about process, and helped the newer designers be more conscious of issues they may introduce.

With month 1 done (and the 20 patches that came with it), we're working on getting our processes less loosey-goosey.

I do expect everyone to do their job. But don't mistake that for not wanting (some degree of non-masturbatory) process, communication, auditing, testing, and working within frameworks we develop. 'Just, go make cool stuff' isn't the best framework and it bit us enough during Alpha/Beta. We've gotten better in these areas in the last 6 months, and I hope that'll continue to improve.

With that said, the work on running back through the classes (which I don't expect to be a 1-and-done thing), looking at foundation issues like TTK, how some of the stats are working, item distribution, etc... is all underway on the systems side.

Click to expand...

It's amazing all the thumbs up's this post is getting when he's basically saying "thanks for paying to test the broken shit we're throwing out."

Gravel said:

It's amazing all the thumbs up's this post is getting when he's basically saying "thanks for paying to test the broken shit we're throwing out."

Click to expand...

If you can point me to anyone else in the thread dropping hints about Tigole Troll Bitties I'll thumbs up them, too

Maybe I'm less cynical since I've only been fully 'exposed' to the project since EA, but I also have infinitely more patience and grace for an extremely small, effectively-all-volunteer team than I would one with hundreds (if not thousands) and a vomit-inducing budget.

I'm incredibly impressed and thankful that the pro-bono team has stuck together as long as it has, but at some point the -- I'm tired boss.jpeg -- is going to appear and people are going to NEED to get paid.

Do I have issues with the game? Absolutely. I don't think there's a single person who doesn't have many, but the game's bones and framework are there. Shawn has made it expressly clear that the game is not complete and won't be for a long time, but after 6 years of development the team needed their passion compensated or development would likely stall or slow down considerably.

Gravel, I might agree with you if the game had been advertised as complete or close, but that's never been the case. Every single one of us knew what we were subscribing to. My only hope is that our collective MMO-hearts don't get broken again.

P.S. Trent, you're still an asshole.

Gravel has been larping as ‘angry grandpa yelling at clouds’ meme for years on this forum. Shawn could deep throat him and he’d complain he isn’t cupping his balls.

it’s actually crazy they got this far without charging people anything , not sure how long you expect an indie team to go without funding when making a game that requires the resources of an mmo. So yea, we are paying for broken shit, not sure if that was an eye opener for anyone. Good faith only gets people so far of course, and the time it takes for the shine of exploration and mystery to wear off is different for everyone; but the pressure is definitely on to get the foundation and fundamentals where they need to be

My experience has been fairly limited, especially compared to some of the folks in this thread, but I will say I have never felt misled or deceived. I've maybe wish they were further along or it was more fleshed out but Im proud of what they've done and hope it receives enough support to give it a chance to see some degree of its final form.

Gravel said:

It's amazing all the thumbs up's this post is getting when he's basically saying "thanks for paying to test the broken shit we're throwing out."

Click to expand...

Well that's what we signed up for so yeah.

If we can provide positive feedback (they'd have to sift through the bullshitting) and it helps the game even better

No one here that signed up believed this to be a full game release. We all knew what we signed up for. If this was 1.0 I would be with you.

You have to click at least four different times with them telling you the game is EA, and shit is unfinished and may be broken. If you are playing and still bitching about it being EA, it's on you.

Araxen said:

You have to click at least four different times with them telling you the game is EA, and shit is unfinished and may be broken. If you are playing and still bitching about it being EA, it's on you.

Click to expand...

Is that how many times we have to reply to Gravel telling him that too

Sadly as a lvl38 shammy I didnt even make it to caves of irem or great cavern sea.
VoZ, once while grouping for dog corrupted drops. It plugged all the low mid pieces, was worth it but only once and I will not return. Too much running
KB and next zone was also a mixed bag, I knew I was going to die in that orc cave deep in with messy ress run but just have to try it once. True enough got wiped in that boat area and didnt feel a need to return. Poachers with that 6 wis bracer quest was worth it, but only one bracer. Too many death but I managed to ghetto dot pull the last knives by zone scumming and scram. That fucking town with a separate faction kos guards somewhere north is off-putting.
Am not sure about this massive land running but do feel KB could come somewhere right after glassflats instead of through VoZ. Its abit tiresome for non sow clerics to run around and I see them drop off quite abit as levels progress.

Never took a boat after reading experiences...bad feeling too.

So between alts and mains its
shaded dunes and dungeons, sgs, fallen pass, and the final 11 to 12 soloing levels at glass flats for my shammy with 140 wis to take a break for now. I feel the lvl30s onward is just a chore to play and heal but I didnt go broke as much and overcame spell prices But having to reserve many golds just was spells is abit mix for me and my time

Have fond memories of all especially the accessibility to groups at sgs but the crowd strangely cannot make it into that goblin castle just off that sgs zone which was a really cool place by itself when I invised explored. There is also visibly less grouping into glassflats as the gob camps in lower levels are mostly empty.now. Though worth mentioning good times ard lvl20 doing gobs group close to zone with a fire lite and sandstorm was pretty cool.

dont want to sidestep but for example, Pantheon's immediate zone after thronefast was very good. The verticality from skeles to gob caves and crypts above and human camp somewhere in between was memorable. But beyond that utter crap and things just died off at lvl18.

anyhoo will keep my 1 sub on for the good work, wish the devs the best in months to come.

alovingrobot said:

Sure Goblin has drawn a few goblin penises in the past, but if it makes you feel any better I just saw him giving feedback on the female troll that is in line with your area of focus.

Click to expand...