Just because your aim is beyond abysmal doesn't mean someone with even mediocre aim can't exploit the character
Overwatch
- Thread starter Caliane
- Start date
This WM vs AWP comparison is beyond bad. AWP is about making sure you hit the 1 shot you're given because you're scoped down a very narrow hallway or doorway slit. With WM you are pumping shots left and right because you have a 100 foot sight line onto the objective.
Croetec
Lord Nagafen Raider
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A million times this. It's apples and oranges, she doesn't need to be gutted but TTK needs to be tuned.
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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Tarisk
Pathetic Reaction Bot
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I'm ok with a widowmaker fire time nerf or reduce the sub 100% charge damage. Because I agree, it's a bit frustrating when Im sniped by one who never fires a single full charge shot. What I also hate though is that no one is calling for the Hanzo nerf when his arrows can headshot people when they weren't even near the target's head AND the charge doesnt affect the damage, only the distance of the arrow.
Hanzo has far more outplay capabilities than Widow for a variety of reasons. I don't disagree Hanzo rando headshots and scatters are frustrating but its not an apt comparison.
Morrow
Trakanon Raider
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Totally. Hanzo's kit isn't nearly as good as Widows. Hanzo's damage output is also really low. And he has to mostly be in midrange to do good work. Aside from the occasional BS scattershot that instantly kills you he's not really a problem. There's a reason he's at the bottom of the tier list. Sure, he can climb walls, but he has nowhere near the mobility of Widowmaker. Yes his arrow hit box is huge, but it sort of needs to be with it not being hitscan and it being an arched projectile. He'd be very boring to play for 90% of the playerbase if his arrow hitbox was super strict. 90% of people would never land shit. You don't see really good Hanzos singlehandedly deciding games unless your team is terrible. Whereas your team can be great and still get stomped against an amazing Widow unless you counter her with a better Widow. Once you get to level 50ish+ you don't think Hanzo is BS anymore. You go through an evolution. Which is what we've seen in the community where now people are finally coming to fact based conclusions about which heroes need work in either direction and why its pretty universally agreed upon by any experienced player that Widowmaker needs a nerf. Just as it's already been agreed and settled that McCree needs a nerf. Hanzo is fine.
Big Phoenix
Pronouns: zie/zhem/zer
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gauze
Molten Core Raider
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Two problems with that.. the headshot thing, that is the game. Hanzo isn't some special snowflake that benefits from extra large head boxes.. everyone does. The headshot hitboxes being larger, I think it's fine.. the game is comprised of mostly projectile based characters. If they were to 'remove' or 'fix' it, most all the projectile characters would be instantly outshined by characters who have instant attacks like that of Mcree, Tracer, Reaper, Widow, and 76.
The pull on your arrow does effect the damage, and its absolute ass at low-mid range to the point where its abysmal to use. Oddly enough, Hanzo needs buffs or people around him nerfed. I only suggest higher low to mid range crit damage. I think he'd be alright then and better purposed in the position he plays.
Blows my mind though that people can argue against Widow not being OP. I mean, i'm fully aware of 80% of the widows we encounter are absolute ass when playing her. Her ability in fights is absurdly strong in the right hands. I simply don't play her because shes way too fucking easy. It's not whether snipers are liked or not, or all the same. It's how this game works, and how she sits in it. She isn't an AWP, shes actually more to the essential if you combined both the AWP and Auto-Sniper into one and you happen to have a Widow. There is no real negative to her, her "counters" usually die before even getting to her. A counter to a champion shouldn't be the champion itself.
xzi
Mouthbreather
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It's not that WM is different from what makes something in an FPS overpowered - the AWP takes care of that pretty well. But a well positioned and a decent tap you can 1v1 an awper with an AK.
It's that in a game like CSGO or TF2 or any CoD clone, one player CAN dictate how an entire round plays out. You're able to make solo plays in those games in a competitive environment no matter what role you're playing (even support to some extent).
Overwatch is very clearly focused on cooperation and team play. Almost every hero has a counter and is stronger with other heroes, and with the exclusion of using ults. Go up against equally as skilled players and you are not going to make a solo play as any character against a team.Maybeyou'll get a Lucio by teleporting in behind as Reaper, but the rest of the team is going to instagib you. You're not wiping a team by yourself.
Until there's a Widowmaker who can shoot 5 times and kill 3 people within 5 secondsacross the map. AgoodWM can shut down an entire team by herself while no other character in the game can (again, not counting ults). She has great movement and escape capabilities to fuck off if someone jumps her. She has 200 HP which is what most mid/close range characters have while she can completely avoid beinginthe fight. She does not fit the narrative that the rest of the game sets, that you have to play together. That's all not counting ults, add in ults and now she can see somebody trying to flank her through walls, as can the rest of her team.
And maybe Blizzard did this on purpose, but she is clearly the strongest character in the game right now in most aspects and to pretend that she isn't is kind of obnoxious. She's not impossible to deal with - a reinhardt shield makes her useless if everyone piles behind it. But other than that her one true counter is another WM.
It's that in a game like CSGO or TF2 or any CoD clone, one player CAN dictate how an entire round plays out. You're able to make solo plays in those games in a competitive environment no matter what role you're playing (even support to some extent).
Overwatch is very clearly focused on cooperation and team play. Almost every hero has a counter and is stronger with other heroes, and with the exclusion of using ults. Go up against equally as skilled players and you are not going to make a solo play as any character against a team.Maybeyou'll get a Lucio by teleporting in behind as Reaper, but the rest of the team is going to instagib you. You're not wiping a team by yourself.
Until there's a Widowmaker who can shoot 5 times and kill 3 people within 5 secondsacross the map. AgoodWM can shut down an entire team by herself while no other character in the game can (again, not counting ults). She has great movement and escape capabilities to fuck off if someone jumps her. She has 200 HP which is what most mid/close range characters have while she can completely avoid beinginthe fight. She does not fit the narrative that the rest of the game sets, that you have to play together. That's all not counting ults, add in ults and now she can see somebody trying to flank her through walls, as can the rest of her team.
And maybe Blizzard did this on purpose, but she is clearly the strongest character in the game right now in most aspects and to pretend that she isn't is kind of obnoxious. She's not impossible to deal with - a reinhardt shield makes her useless if everyone piles behind it. But other than that her one true counter is another WM.
Palum
what Suineg set it to
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Regular FPS games don't have bullet damage falloff of twelve feet for every gun not used by widowmaker, so I can still dome your sniper ass just as easily when you play like shit.
spronk
FPS noob
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why isn't Winston considered a good WM counter? I've only played pub solo games, so whenever I get sniped by a WM I switch to Winston and chase her like a pedo after a child star, the leaps and high HP pool make WMs a joke for Winston. 2-3 easy kills later and the WM switches to reaper or mcree. Only times I've ever had a problem killing WMs as a Winston is if she is with another DPS, but thats fairly rare in pub games.
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He does okay, but there is a lot of maps that Widow is for sure going to be able to land a few shot on him on the way in and then can mow him down with machine gun or just hook away. He is pretty good at disrupting her though. I've definitely turned games around by switching to him vs a Widow that is shutting us down
Rafterman
Molten Core Raider
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Hanzo is just a shitty character that has no business in the game. He's not good, but they had to give him such ridiculous, hit half the screen every time you shoot, aim just to make him relevant and makes it makes it frustrating for anyone he kills. And they've backed themselves in a corner with him because they can't lessen his bullshit or he'd easily be the worst character in the game. So basically for anyone who hates Hanzo, just know that the reason he is so cheap is because that's the only way they could squeeze his stupid ass into the lineup. Basically, you are going to see him get ridiculous kills a lot and it's never going to change.
