Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

K

Kedwyn

Silver Squire
3,915
80
EQ punished failure far more than WoW. Otherwise, WoW was the game which required, in general, more "skill" to at least be at a high level (raiding PVP) where in EQ you could have a fucking keyboard turner cleric or even MT and still manage well enough.

Surely I can't be the only person to have seen "good or great" EQ players not make it or handle WoW dungeons / raiding well?
 
Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
11,557
7,865
Merlin_sl said:
Citation has several important purposes: to uphold intellectual honesty (or avoiding plagiarism), to attribute prior or unoriginal work and ideas to the correct sources, to allow the reader to determine independently whether the referenced material supports the author's argument in the claimed way, and to help the reader gauge the strength and validity of the material the author has used.

I read it. Ummmm,"EQ was so fucking easy"isn't really explaining how WOW was more difficult. In fact, not one comparison to WOW was even made. Try again?
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I have no desire to explain to you why zergable, broken, one dimensional, predictable, and spreadsheetable encounters are less difficult than ones that are dynamic and rely on not only individual player knowledge, but reaction time and situational awareness too. Go raid Innorruuk on p99, then Ragnaros on Emerald Dream. Then you'll know what I mean.

Also, arent you supposed to have me on ignore? Or was that just for flare?
 
Khane

Khane

Got something right about marriage
19,879
13,395
We've had this conversation ad nauseum, stop trying to bait people into the same conversation we've already had and you already know the answer to.
EDIT: That was in response to Merlin's questions.
 
V

vazdeline_sl

shitlord
105
1
Quaid_sl said:
I have no desire to explain to you why zergable, broken, one dimensional, predictable, and spreadsheetable encounters are less difficult than ones that are dynamic and rely on not only individual player knowledge, but reaction time and situational awareness too. Go raid Innorruuk on p99, then Ragnaros on Emerald Dream. Then you'll know what I mean.

Also, arent you supposed to have me on ignore? Or was that just for flare?
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Great explanation of wow
 
M

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
Quaid_sl said:
I have no desire to explain to you why zergable, broken, one dimensional, predictable, and spreadsheetable encounters are less difficult than ones that are dynamic and rely on not only individual player knowledge, but reaction time and situational awareness too. Go raid Innorruuk on p99, then Ragnaros on Emerald Dream. Then you'll know what I mean.

Also, arent you supposed to have me on ignore? Or was that just for flare?
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So your specifically referring to raiding? If you don't choose to explain, then refrain from making blanket statements and passing them off as fact without a single shred of proof.
 
Bruman

Bruman

Golden Squire
1,154
0
There's enough bullshit conversations in this thread; can we not have the age-old "which is more difficult: WoW or EQ?" one? It's a broken question from the start.

Who would win a fight? The death star or Unicron?
 
Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
11,557
7,865
Merlin_sl said:
So your specifically referring to raiding? If you don't choose to explain, then refrain from making blanket statements and passing them off as fact without a single shred of proof.
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Hahaha so when people were talking about the 'hardcore' crowd, you think they might be referring to the 'hardcore Sebilis pickup group' crowd? Of course we're talking about the raid game when discussions about 'hardcoreness' are being had.
 
Cinge

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,024
2,101
Have to be careful Quaid, people get really pissed off if they think you insulted their nostalgia.
 
M

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
Quaid_sl said:
Also, arent you supposed to have me on ignore? Or was that just for flare?
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At some point you must have stopped vomiting all over the keyboard because I did remove you from my ignore list. And don't get so defensive.I never played WOW.But its a bold statement to say WOW was more difficult than EQ. So I wanted you to cite examples. I was going off memory when WOW was released a large percentage of people were getting to max level in under a month. That doesn't sound like a game that is more difficult then Everquest.

Edit: Making raiding ridiculously difficult was a rather new mechanic that started at or near the POP era in EQ so original EQ raiding was not that difficult. I can only go by EQ2 because that's what I currently play, but the stupidity involved has been ramped up considerably in the last 5 years. I don't consider it skill based, just memorizing a different pattern so to speak. But again, I cannot speak for WOW, I have never played it.
 
Cinge

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,024
2,101
Merlin_sl said:
I was going off memory when WOW was released a large percentage of people were getting to max level in under a month. That doesn't sound like a game that is more difficult then Everquest.
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Uh, time does not equal difficulty.
 
K

Kedwyn

Silver Squire
3,915
80
So you're saying EQ is more hardcore or more difficult than some game you never played?

Why does this not surprise me?
 
A

Aeiouy_sl

shitlord
217
0
I know people will blame the ks but I have seen nothing to show me that there are legitimately 50k plus people old there who would want to pay and play and old school mmog.

Waxing nostalgic is one thing but blaming this all on the kick starter is off base. I just don't think the actual base of players who would pay, long term, for such an experience is much,much, much smaller than many of us expected.

A better ks page was not going to bring in 900% more donors. So as a proof of concept I think this does show the real playerbase for a mmogs a fraction of what many of us thought it was.

Nothing is impossible and my pledge remains but it seems unlikely this will get funded. The post mortem, though, will include a lot of people erroneously blaming it all on the ks.

In reality the game probably needed a more specific angle, like unchained had rvrvr combat. That is a timeless mechanic that can be sold to old and new players

Just telling people it is old school where you have a lot of time to channel surf while playing is not appealing to old or new players. Perhaps they should have focused specifically on slowed down combat with more meaningful choices. Pushed that above and beyond anything else. That can be sold to old and new players.

Just pushing old school experience is bad because it means nothing to new players and half of it is bad to old players.

If it does fail and they take another run at it I would focus almost entirely on how combat is different and better. How it is just non stop button mashing. How you have to prepare for encounters. How a group's synergy overcomes the individual parts.

I can't think of any other part of the game that will as strongly appeal to old and new players.

Having lots of large dungeons is good but it is hard to sell via images, text and video. Combat on the other hand is something you can sell.
 
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