Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Lets break down what B did to earn his 45k that crashed The Vision:

1. Told everyone "I'm Brad McQuaid"

Charlie Delicious_sl said:

Lets break down what B did to earn his 45k that crashed The Vision:

1. Told everyone "I'm Brad McQuaid"

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Ya, that's funny and all... But let's stop pretending there's no financial value in name recognition and brand equity. Unfortunately he's destroyed what little he had with this farce.

Quaid_sl said:

If it were a scam he wouldn't have gone through kickstarter in the first place. I believe he started out with good intentions, either through inspiration or desperation.

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He saw Star Citizen money and went "I can do that too, I'm a motherfucking gaming god".

Has this been linked already? Pantheon - State of the Game 7-9-2014:
https://www.pantheonrotf.com/blogs/1...he-game-7-9-14

At least it will be interesting to watch what they get done, how long it takes, if there is a playable game at the end and if its more fun than all the current MMOs

actually thats the same novel. nm

Quaid_sl said:

Ya, that's funny and all... But let's stop pretending there's no financial value in name recognition and brand equity. Unfortunately he's destroyed what little he had with this farce.

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Sure there is value in it, but that value was somewhat diminished after Vanguard. It'll help raise money but because Vanguard happened, anything done on this project that gives the average person a sniff of what happened in VG will make them run away. Brad's error was he assumed that most people either forgot or just didn't care anymore about what happened with his last project when the reality was all that happened in Pantheon during the KS reminded people exactly what happened with VG.

Whether the KS was a scam or not when it launched it was full of lies - I'm not quite sure how they went from saying the money was to pay for new team members and move forward to being back pay for a group of people doing next to nothing for six months without there being uproar over it. That's quite apart from the fact the team consisted of a half dozen devs and a single artist/coder.

Tauro_sl said:

Has this been linked already? Pantheon - State of the Game 7-9-2014:
https://www.pantheonrotf.com/blogs/1...he-game-7-9-14

At least it will be interesting to watch what they get done, how long it takes, if there is a playable game at the end and if its more fun than all the current MMOs

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My favorite quotes from that response. (out of context...sure...but makes for great drama)

"It so happened that I had a friend who had been working on a religious niche MMO for years"

" I am not returning to be the Pantheon evangelist at this time"

"And that is why I'm so crazy"

"pledge money to us sooner as opposed to later. "

" trust me"

Lol think he lurks?

Ceder_sl said:

Just a point of clarification: No one is going to pay taxes on Pantheon's KS(except for nominal listing fees which could be business expenditure written off I assume). It failed to fund so all pledges reverted back to the pledger as per KS's system. Donations were essentially paypal/private after the KS failed and still on going via McQuaid's website.

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your way off, Paypal's business accounts are hit by the IRS, and i can tell you that VRI had a business account with PayPal because that's the only way they could setup a recurring charge. so all the money that is brought in will be taxed. also I donated to the cause. my donation per Paypal was not to Brad McQuaid but to VRI. There was no option to select gift, which would render the money untaxable. the 60ish VRI got off me was taxable according to paypal. one of the many reasons why businesses have begun to shy away from Paypal.

Jimbolini_sl said:

My favorite quotes from that response. (out of context...sure...but makes for great drama)

"It so happened that I had a friend who had been working on a religious niche MMO for years"

" I am not returning to be the Pantheon evangelist at this time"

"And that is why I'm so crazy"

"pledge money to us sooner as opposed to later. "

" trust me"

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I liked these myself too and I'll address why:

"It so happened that I had a friend who had been working on a religious niche MMO for years using a volunteer only team".

He means a her religiously home schooled family. Its cute how even he recognizes how bad that looks and tries his his best to ameliorate that.

"She knew people who knew people and we now have a larger team than before, full of people with energy and a strong desire to be part of an MMO team and to do so with little to no compensation and to do so remotely."

Translation again being her bringing on the entirety of her family to brad's "team".

"I was skeptical at first, being accustomed to funded projects and a job site where we all met every morning and worked together and in person."

Well her family sits around the table at home in the morning but not brad so...yeah. Though it is funny that he makes this statement given how he was so adamant about it being a high priority to "have an office".

"Regardless, though, I am not returning to be the Pantheon evangelist at this time (which is the wrong time)."

Except that he in fact -is- evangelizing with the entire post and the other statements on mmorpg.

And just like a typical televangelist, he's employing misdirection, lying, and all other things that are apart of the 6 steps of typical confidence tricks. (Known as step 3 or the "Build up":Rousing and sustaining the interest of the target, introducing the scheme to them, rousing their ego, showing them the chance of success and filling them with so much anticipation and cupidity that their judgment is warped and their caution thrown away.)

"I am far too busy and involved both managing and working on the Pantheon project."

This contradicts not only the fact that he does drive-by shots of contact every few weeks or how he's shopping for a ceo but how he's given Laurene mainly the reigns of the project as well.

...

Next he spends most of the rest of the "evangelizing" misdirecting folks by discussing the "development" which is virtually as we all know just stock unity crap he's lego'd together like a toddler.

But really all of this was for the real point: The Sale's pitch:

"And I hope it also convinces many of you who may still be sitting on the fence to pledge money to us sooner as opposed to later. We need money to buy tools and plug-ins and servers and Unity licenses."

Yes... the toddler need more legos and is desperate for money for play-dough too.

And with regards to the license... that's because of what you did with the previous team. Of course it sort of also is a contradiction since he made it out that he had gotten such before.

"And then, even though the team is technically volunteers at this point, I do like to paypal them some $$ when I can."

Scale is different but that's about how the former team was treated, they just weren't volunteer. But the paypal point is also important to note because this goes back into somethings discussed yesterday in the thread concerning how Brad isn't using an incorporated payroll system that is part of the issue that he took money for himself previously and this misappropriated.

...

Then he evangelizes for multiple paragraphs more in continuing the confidence trick step of Build Up and repeating what he said before.

And the "faithful" seemed to eat it up like the cultists they are:

CanadinaXegony"As a gesture offaithin what you do..I have invested a tiny bit more as of yesterday. Keep up the good work, keepour faithin your skills and what you do going...you'll get there. Can't wait for alpha/beta wherever you are allowing people in to help out."

I found the irony in her use of faith in her wording more than once rather amusing. She gets booted as a mod and still comes back for more.


Brad McQuaid you're doing your darnedest to elevate "faith" based gaming and mainstream a new type of evangelism: Gamevanglism. You're no Jim Baker, but you'll certainly fall as hard as he did.

symbelmyne_sl said:

your way off, Paypal's business accounts are hit by the IRS, and i can tell you that VRI had a business account with PayPal because that's the only way they could setup a recurring charge. so all the money that is brought in will be taxed. also I donated to the cause. my donation per Paypal was not to Brad McQuaid but to VRI. There was no option to select gift, which would render the money untaxable. the 60ish VRI got off me was taxable according to paypal. one of the many reasons why businesses have begun to shy away from Paypal.

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Again let's clarify what you were saying originally. You were addressing that theKickstarterwas going to be taxed.

I showed you that to be false because the kickstarter-failed-.

To further make it clear: when a kickstarter fails, no money is collected from pledgers:

Backer Questions Kickstarter
When is my card charged?

If the project you're backing is successfully funded, your card will be charged when the project reaches its funding deadline. If the project does not reach its funding goal, your card is never charged.

None.

Not one cent. So again nothing to be taxed beyond any fees Brad incurred from listing the KS etc.

At no point was I stating that the subsequent paypal/private donations directly to Pantheon via their website-after the failed kickstarter-were not going to be subect to taxation. They, including your faithful pledge, rightfully should be taxed(whether Brad does that properly or not though is another story ).

Ceder_sl said:

Again let's clarify what you were saying originally. You were addressing that theKickstarterwas going to be taxed.

I showed you that to be false because the kickstarter-failed-.

Ceder you are correct about the failed KS. i should have clarified. The money we are all talking about is the money that was pocked from the website. anything that was paid to VRI via paypal is and was taxable. now i guess the question remains...can the missing money be accounted for as tax?Understanding IRS 6050W

To further make it clear: when a kickstarter fails, no money is collected from pledgers:

Backer Questions Kickstarter
When is my card charged?

If the project you're backing is successfully funded, your card will be charged when the project reaches its funding deadline. If the project does not reach its funding goal, your card is never charged.

None.

Not one cent. So again nothing to be taxed beyond any fees Brad incurred from listing the KS etc.

At no point was I stating that the subsequent paypal/private donations directly to Pantheon via their website-after the failed kickstarter-were not going to be subect to taxation. They, including your faithful pledge, rightfully should be taxed(whether Brad does that properly or not though is another story ).

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you are correct in regards to the failed kickstarter. however my point does revolve around any/all monies generated by the project. The question i have: is it possible that the missing money= tax money? i'll bet that number= your lost money.Understanding IRS 6050W

of course Brad and his team could be completely inept in running a business, and may have not accounted for taxes. what was the corporate tax rate in California? They are a C-Corp 8.84 %What are the tax rates for corporations? | California Franchise Tax Board.

symbelmyne_sl said:

you are correct in regards to the failed kickstarter. however my point does revolve around any/all monies generated by the project. The question i have: is it possible that the missing money= tax money? i'll bet that number= your lost money.Understanding IRS 6050W

of course Brad and his team could be completely inept in running a business, and may have not accounted for taxes. what was the corporate tax rate in California? They are a C-Corp 8.84 %What are the tax rates for corporations? | California Franchise Tax Board.

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Brad was the only one will access to the accounts. No one else on the team would be on the hook for anything more than Brad paid them. If the IRS goes after VRI, only Brad will face the heat of it.

Brad inept at running a business? Are you kidding me? He had official reimbursement forms that needed to be submitted to get paid. To the HR department, no doubt. That's pretty darned impressive and professional if you ask me!

My issue with money, the theft aside, is Brad's lifestyle is too expensive for us to support and get a game from. He proved that with the 45k. The guy has 2 houses. That 345k(worth over 600k now) vacation house and the 1.2million dollar mansion. He has 2 houses he needs to maintain. The guy has around 2 millions dollars in property at this point. I don't begrudge him for that, but it's a huge burden on him and it lead to his terrible decision to take the 45k. I can only imagine what the yearly upkeep is on both of those properties?


That's why I said before we can't afford Brad. He's too expensive!

and at no point is there any way of keeping brad from stealing every penny that comes into the paypal account for his summer trip to aruba. its so stupid. brad says, 'my bills were stacking up and i had lots of debt so i paid myself all the money in the kitty.' yeah no shit you did and there is no reason why you wont be doing that again. fuck that noise

symbelmyne_sl said:

you are correct in regards to the failed kickstarter. however my point does revolve around any/all monies generated by the project. The question i have: is it possible that the missing money= tax money? i'll bet that number= your lost money.Understanding IRS 6050W

of course Brad and his team could be completely inept in running a business, and may have not accounted for taxes. what was the corporate tax rate in California? They are a C-Corp 8.84 %What are the tax rates for corporations? | California Franchise Tax Board.

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Your point has seemingly floated more than once from the emphasis on the KS to now this, which is fine, though a bit confusing.

Supposedly, Brad incorporated the company at the start of April. Website pledges to it thus would not face taxation, by my understanding, until the next tax year assessment would it not?

So this "missing money" point seeming to be made (Remember its primarily accounted for via the admitting by Brad of his taking it(though he has changed the explanation for it multiple times(advanced pay vs back pay as being taken for taxation -wouldn't- be relevant.

Or are you trying to make yet a different point that Im may not be seeing?