Soccer 2012-2013 3.0

Jait

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Munich is just dominating Dortmund right now, not sure what that has to do with ManU/RM next week though
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Because I could see them beating ManU or Barca before they meet in a later round. Assuming they even get past Madrid (they should).
 

Asshat Brando

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Not really following how everybody is assuming ManU will progress past Madrid so confidently. If Madrid plays like they did yesterday then you would have to favor Madrid.
 

PKS

N00b
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Passenger, I'm curious. Does Barca rotate their first 11 much? Seems every so often I check their progress, the team sheets identical to the last I saw.
 

Asshat Brando

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How can you expect Real to play the same way?

Two completely different styles of football.
If you've only seen 2 Barca games then I'm guessing you haven't seen more than 2 RM games this year. Regardless of whether they have the ball a lot or not they excel at counter attacking aggressively at speed, they actually struggle more this year against the weaker teams who don't become stretched if you look at their league results. ManU will attack especially since it's at OT, I would expect the superior midfield players to win a lot of balls and launch counters which will expose Evra and Rafael pretty badly.
 

Passenger_sl

shitlord
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For important games (CDR elimination games, UCL games of importance, La Liga against top teams like Atl?tico, Real, Malaga) the lineup has basically been the same. Messi/Pedro/Iniesta up front - Xavi/Cesc/Busquets in the mid - Alba/Puyol/Pique/Alves/Valdes in the back. This was considered the all around best possible lineup that Barca could field.

There has been some rotation, especially against the lower end teams, to try and get Xavi/Puyol/Iniesta some rest. Mascherano has played quite a lot of games even though he isn't considered 100% of the time for the toughest of games, Adriano prior to his injury at the end of 2012 was playing insane (probably at top 3 in the team level). In addition Sanchez/Song/Villa are in the mid teens for starts and mid twenties for appearances.

In general there has been quite a decent amount of rotation especially against lower end teams. Usually 2-3 people out of the above top 11 would be swapped and rest. I wouldn't blame the play from the last week or two on fatigue. Last season I chalked up the Spring collapse 100% to injuries and fatigue because the team was falling apart. This season has been virtually injury free (knock on wood) apart from Tito being out.

I just think the current top 11 has been ineffective against top teams and is figured out. They play a pretty predictable style, that if it doesn't click 100% it is easy to figure out. Messi tends to be the only person in the box against these teams. Pedro tends to be the all around work horse dragging players out of positions. Cesc tends to push Iniesta into the mid which breaks his left wing position that he has been playing this season and adds more people to the middle cluttering it like crazy especially against teams that play to fill the middle. Also this breaks down the wing play. This team currently needs a real striker like Villa (completely baffled why he hasn't played against top teams) to add penetration into the box. He is also a outside the box shot threat that no one else on the team is. MVP was such a ridiculous front line from 2010/2011 that it should be tried this season. It would send Cesc to the bench and regardless of how good he has been personally, I think the negative effect that it has on Iniesta and general midfield clutter, the drop to bench is needed at least to try it out.

On the defensive end, as good as Alba has been and Alves has been getting better, I am still not settled on the double wingback play. This season has been by far the poorest in defense. Puyol is old and slow, as shown by Di Maria/C.Ronaldo, Pique has never been quick and usually his strength was positioning/technique. Adriano when he plays is exactly like Alba/Alves. Mascherano when he takes over for Puyol has been okay but he is still not a quick defender. Against pace filled teams we literally have nothing. In previous seasons, even though Abidal has been 30+ for a while, he was usually easily our best defender. He is quick, his positioning is rock solid, and he wasn't as offensive minded as Alba that he let his left side open. I really hope Abidal gets to start/sub in soon. He was given the green light to play last week but he hasn't been included on the bench yet.

TL;DR - Overall rotation is there, toughest games usually have the same exact 11.


If you've only seen 2 Barca games then I'm guessing you haven't seen more than 2 RM games this year. Regardless of whether they have the ball a lot or not they excel at counter attacking aggressively at speed, they actually struggle more this year against the weaker teams who don't become stretched if you look at their league results.
The funny part about RM this season has been that they struggled when they dominated the game in possession and were given the ball. In those situations they have been absolutely clueless as to what to do and were unable to create chances. They would usually hover around the middle of the pitch for the entire game and just look flat. On the other hand when RM wasn't the dominant possessor of the ball, they have been absolutely ruthless, it seems it would require them to be less creative and think less about what to do, they would just grab the ball on the break and batter the opposing net.

I am with you on RM progressing against Man Utd. I think they are clicking at the right time of the season and the fact that they were so dominant against Barca in addition to the league being lost, they will field a fairly relaxed 11 for the 2nd La Liga clasico this Saturday. This will allow maximum rest against Man Utd.
 

darkseid_sl

shitlord
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If you've only seen 2 Barca games then I'm guessing you haven't seen more than 2 RM games this year. Regardless of whether they have the ball a lot or not they excel at counter attacking aggressively at speed, they actually struggle more this year against the weaker teams who don't become stretched if you look at their league results. ManU will attack especially since it's at OT, I would expect the superior midfield players to win a lot of balls and launch counters which will expose Evra and Rafael pretty badly.
Real Madrid are good on the counter, so it would just be stupid to play attacking football against them. And, unless Jones starts fucking up all of the sudden, he shouldn't have a problem in keeping Ronaldo quiet again.
 

Neki

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Chelsea going into full meltdown mode again

Rafa criticised the board and the fans in a post match interview yesterday and basically confirmed that he would be leaving in the summer or maybe sooner?Rafael Benitez: Chelsea interim manager angrily confirms exit

Would be funny to see Chelsea sacking their 'temp manager' for another temp manager while looking for a full time manager... jeez, what a clusterfuck
 

PKS

N00b
324
0
For important games (CDR elimination games, UCL games of importance, La Liga against top teams like Atl?tico, Real, Malaga) the lineup has basically been the same. Messi/Pedro/Iniesta up front - Xavi/Cesc/Busquets in the mid - Alba/Puyol/Pique/Alves/Valdes in the back. This was considered the all around best possible lineup that Barca could field.

TL;DR - Overall rotation is there, toughest games usually have the same exact 11.
Seems about right. At least they rotate fairly often then, I was thinking they might be overworked at this point. Actually having said that, I notice still that Messi plays almost twice a week, week in week out, full 90 minute games. Surely, no matter the talent, this can be too much? His goal stats alone prove how reliant they are on him, but at the risk of a breaking point? Isn't that a bit similar with what happened with Owen at Liverpool Ossoi?

I see it in contrast with regards to United, as I would struggle to name what the 'first 11' is, and it's been that way for quite a few seasons now. That itself indicates the first 11 isn't strong on paper if they aren't self picking themselves, but the bench potential, large squad and man management by SAF really displays its strengths week in week out, each season. If City miss even just Kompany, people are already worried. Same with them always losing points during the African cup.
 

Asshat Brando

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Real Madrid are good on the counter, so it would just be stupid to play attacking football against them. And, unless Jones starts fucking up all of the sudden, he shouldn't have a problem in keeping Ronaldo quiet again.
ManU sit back at home? Only a couple more days until the game but I would be pretty surprised. Jones not getting sent off would be the bonus assuming he's healthy by the game, pretty sure I read they were not expecting him to make it back by then.
 

Springbok

Karen
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Chelsea going into full meltdown mode again

Rafa criticised the board and the fans in a post match interview yesterday and basically confirmed that he would be leaving in the summer or maybe sooner?Rafael Benitez: Chelsea interim manager angrily confirms exit

Would be funny to see Chelsea sacking their 'temp manager' for another temp manager while looking for a full time manager... jeez, what a clusterfuck
It was a really strange postgame, no doubt. I actually liked what he said and how he said it. Chelshit fans are the trashiest, most uneducated donkeys around and Rafa was doomed from the start. I never thought they should have sacked RDM, but thats just me. When you've got a lockerroom being led by John Terry and Cashley, you're always fighting an uphill battle. Fuck those idiots.
 

Neki

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Notice how Chelsea fans basically blame their managers for everything and do not direct their frustrations at the owner? They know that if Abramovich pulls out of Chelsea, they are swimming up shitcreek because nevermind a paddle, they wouldn't be able to afford the canoe to paddle in
 

Passenger_sl

shitlord
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Actually having said that, I notice still that Messi plays almost twice a week, week in week out, full 90 minute games. Surely, no matter the talent, this can be too much? His goal stats alone prove how reliant they are on him, but at the risk of a breaking point?
Messi has said time and time again that he plays much better without rest. With that said, I think we are running into the same issues as last Spring in regards to him in that we are putting too much dependence on him. Apart from Messi, Barca doesn't have a 2nd consistent goal scorer. They desperately need someone like Villa but for whatever reason Tito/Roura hasn't started him. If you look back to 2010-2011, that team is generally considered the pinnacle of Barca and possibly the best assembled club team. They had Messi on 50+ goals, Villa on 20+ goals, and Pedro on 20+ goals. With a split as even as this, you couldn't take players out of the game and expect no goal scorers.
 

wanand

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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. Chelshit fans are the trashiest, most uneducated donkeys around
No no that is West Ham fans and their "West Ham way of play" bollocks, and "We won the the World Cup".

But I suspect most of this forum don't know much outside of Liverpool, Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal, and Man city now days I guess
 

darkseid_sl

shitlord
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Chelsea got a lot of glory hunters after they started buying players left and right. There are even many fans who only support them because of Torres, just as they did when Torres was playing for Liverpool.
 

wanand

Bronze Knight of the Realm
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All of the top four have glory hunters it comes as part of success. Most Man Utd fans could not tell you about the clubs history without hitting Google first, same goes for Arsenal , Chelsea, and soon Man City if they carry on with the success. Liverpool used to be in the same boat in the 80's.

Personally I hate the modern football fan, they only know what Sky tell them and have dragged the life and soul out of most football stadiums and most of these Modern football fans follow Chelsea, Arsenal, Man Utd and to a lesser extent Liverpool and Man City

As for West ham fans they are just deluded twats who think west ham should be playing the best football in the country as that is what the club is meant to do, and despite the fact that if Big Sam was not in charge they would still be in the championship, but they want him out as he don't play the "West Ham way" that got them relegated.

The club are also hypocrites when it comes to Bobby Moore, they kicked the poor fella out of the ground because he never had a ticket. A club legend and they kicked him out, he never went back into the ground after that. They never idolized him when he was alive. He also was depserite to leave West Ham and join spurs, twice he tried to do and at one point meant he would have missed out playing in the 66 world cup but Alf Ramsey stepped in. Now they see they can make money from the guys name they are all over him.
 

Neki

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I've been a Spurs fan for over 20 years

Sometimes I wished I was a glory hunter /sigh
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Asshat Brando

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Sturridge out again and we're playing at the DW were I don't think LFC has won in like 4 years.........