Starfield - Fallout fallout that isn't ES6

rhinohelix

rhinohelix

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Caliane said:
might and magic was the original pioneer on "open world".

Dungeon crawls. but with towns and overworlds. might look small today, but this was pretty crazy back then.
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Might and Magic Book One - Maps! - Blogging Games

A collection of maps from Might and Magic Book One, made by myself, including a full overworld map.
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Then the ultima series.
By ultima 5,6,7 they would fit every definition of an open world.

Ultima 9. REVILED. yet... name an earlier 3d Open world game. I can't think of one.
Everyone focuses on how bad it is.. but, I really think Ultima 9 might be the first 3d open world game.
1999

Morrowind was not until 2002.



I am doubtful mods can fix Starfield. Too much of whats wrong is fundamental.
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That's a great point, and I didn't consider it only because the 3D graphics but absolutely agree M&M3 and even the Ultimas, I started with Ultima 3 and then went back (or tried to) to the earlier ones on my Apple IIe.

I will need more space to full deploy my maxima mea culpa.

Daggerfall may be one of the biggest games of all time.
 
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General Antony

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If you really don't like the base game i don't think the mod will change that much. It reskins the quests and items to fit a star wars story set in like 9 or 5 bby. It also rebalances combat to be a lot less forgiving at least at the start.

Fundamentally the gameplay is still the same though. Same POIs filled with the same number of enemies in the same spawn points. Weak reasons to go explore and no reason to engage in base building for resource extraction.
 
Cybsled

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Looks like the game isn't dead - large base patch that seems to overhaul some stuff and another story DLC (which you get automatically if you bought the premium version)

 
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Furry

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How big of a whale is Dr.Retarded Dr.Retarded if they are still updating this shit? Did he write them a blank check?
 
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Wombat

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So "2.0" is:

Slight updates to the super powers, which were so meaningless no one cares about them.
A free roam mode _if_ you found the base mechanics interesting enough to want to play more of (which was the whole problem).
A more elaborate version of faction ambushes.

I have a hard time believing that's going to win anyone back that was underwhelmed by "1.0".
 
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Valderen

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It feels to me that those that already enjoy the game are going to like it since it looks like decent stuff, but I feel it doesn't nothing to bring back those who didn't like it.
 
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Dr.Retarded

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Furry said:
How big of a whale is Dr.Retarded Dr.Retarded if they are still updating this shit? Did he write them a blank check?
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I never got the deluxe edition, but I did pick up the dlc on sale after getting my new pc. Did a ng+ with mods earlier this year. There's a deal called Watchtower on the creations store for 10 bucks and it was basically like a whole other dlc. It actually lets you make a fleet of ships, and you getting some pretty big space battles. We're talking like 20 or 30 ships warping him to fight you. You get your butt kicked pretty quick if you're not rigging up other ships with additional crew. They all so good orbital bombardments and stuff for ground engagements because you now have to fight giant giant mechs in some POIs.

Was really well done by some modding studio, professionally voice acted, and a pretty good story with some epic battles.

I'll definitely check out the new stuff once it's all out for another playthrough. I still enjoy the game, and the new stuff looks decent enough especially with some of the mods out there.
 
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Utnayan

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Until they fix the horrendous exploration of procedurally generated planets that all have the two same random bases with nothing to gain from them, this is a nothing burger.

The biggest mistake of Starfield (And one they should have known 20 years ago) is exploration matters when there is hand crafted content and stories/items/mysteries to uncover. When you plaster 1,000 planets with the same damn two random bases on them over and over again with nothing there except different resources for building, it's pointless.

The lack of common sense when they went this route is astounding.
 
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Vorph

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Utnayan said:
Until they fix the horrendous exploration of procedurally generated planets that all have the two same random bases with nothing to gain from them, this is a nothing burger.

The biggest mistake of Starfield (And one they should have known 20 years ago) is exploration matters when there is hand crafted content and stories/items/mysteries to uncover. When you plaster 1,000 planets with the same damn two random bases on them over and over again with nothing there except different resources for building, it's pointless.

The lack of common sense when they went this route is astounding.
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I'd still put the biggest mistake as being the way they wrote the "story" to accommodate NG+. I could overlook the copy-paste/procedural generation aspects of the universe if there was at least an interesting story to experience, but the entire narrative is garbage because of it being so deeply intwined with the NG+ system. I would have just ignored the parts of the game that weren't hand-crafted as soon as they got boring, but the hand-crafted parts actually managed to be worse somehow.
 
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rhinohelix

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Vorph said:
I'd still put the biggest mistake as being the way they wrote the "story" to accommodate NG+. I could overlook the copy-paste/procedural generation aspects of the universe if there was at least an interesting story to experience, but the entire narrative is garbage because of it being so deeply intwined with the NG+ system. I would have just ignored the parts of the game that weren't hand-crafted as soon as they got boring, but the hand-crafted parts actually managed to be worse somehow.
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+++THIS. The whole world is broken and garbage based upon the narrative choices they made leading up to NG+. The Starfield world doesn't advance past that point in history. Way to go, Todd. You spent 10 years and sold your company only to end up with a stupid game full of gay and woke BS. ES 6 is never coming out.
 
DickTrickle

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Valderen said:
It feels to me that those that already enjoy the game are going to like it since it looks like decent stuff, but I feel it doesn't nothing to bring back those who didn't like it.
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Which is exactly what Howard said. It's not meant to be a 2.0 reboot.

They did say they were going to add more POIs and rebalance them so you get less repeats, which is one of the things I hated most, but I can't really see myself going back to play unless I go mod heavy. The quest and stories in this game were, to me, by far the worst out of any of Bethesda's stuff.
 
Tuco

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I could only play Starfield if they basically redid everything and with a different team. The game design at a high level, sci-fi adventure + exploration + procedural + space combat is extremely appealing to me, but the team missed nearly every mark starting with the setting.

My ideal game I posted after I finished playing it still holds true.

Tuco said:
So much about the Starfield setting doesn't make much sense.

Starfield's setting is like, "Yeah a huge exodus happened, then a couple of wars, but it's pretty quiet now and nothing is really going on I guess??? Anyway, every planet has a bunch of human ruins or whatever.

I'd have rather had a setting where:

* Grav drive research progresses, and when it's commercially feasible a massive increase of sloppy ass Grav Drives create some massive event similar to the Black Mesa Incident Black Mesa Incident occurs which effectively spawns an infinite number of universes all connected to that event. It also kills Earth. This is now the only entry point to the Starborn. This event also does *something* to unlock Grav Drive's full potential, taking it from a research project requiring a super computer on the moon to something you can put on a space ship.
* A massive Earth exodus happens along with a land rush where billions of people are basically fleeing earth and going to other stars for literally the first time, finding out that many inhabitable planets exist.
* The player is "the chosen one" and is the only person who can travel at FTL speed to unexplored areas. Or something. The player can choose to assist a handful of different, competing factions in their land rush goals. Each of these large quests cause some randomly generated outposts to appear in areas aligned to the quest. These faction quest lines are the primary driver of exploration and expansion of the nearby stars, and effectively progress the timeline.
* Instead of there being a bunch of unrealistic human ruins scattered across the star systems, there are instead ruins of intelligent species of different types and semi-intelligent lifeforms that form colonies you explore. A whole new technology erupts that deals with xeno biology and xenotech integration into space ships, arms, suits, buildings etc. The buildings / equipment on Mars become dusty old looking buildings where as the buildings in the final time skip are a fusion of xenotech and human engineering
* The main quest is still basically the same, you find and explore specific alien ruins and find the same magic artifacts that give you super powers. Collect all the artifacts in this timeline either by exploring these ruins or killing Starborn for them and you can portal back to a new universe at the time of the originating event.
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Only thing it misses that I only inferred is the game should take place over ~40-300 years of rapid stellar expansion (Depending on if xenotech prolongs life or the player goes into stasis between missions, or light speed travel, who cares) with each chapter separated by some ~5-10 years where content is procedurally generated and effectively unique. The team that built Starfield is not capable of doing this well.
 
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Cybsled

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Doesn't need to be Dune lol

All they needed to do was lean into the multiverse shit early, shrink the scope of the game in terms of systems, and have the player jump to different realities that have meaningful changes beyond the "everything is the same except your intro to Constellation"
 
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Vorph

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Cybsled said:
All they needed to do was lean into completely axe the multiverse shit and write a story that wasn't utter garbage
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FTFY

If people want to play NG+, let them. They didn't need to explain its existence and there was certainly no need to write the whole narrative around it. It's even more retarded when you remember that the large majority of people who buy games never finish them once, let alone give a single fuck about NG+. Not to mention that the NG+ version of the main story is better the second time so the actual "correct" way to play the game is to rush through NG as fast as possible without doing a single extra thing other than making sure to find the small handful of S-tier starborn powers. Any time spent on side quests, companion stuff, base building, etc. is completely wasted.

At least with Free Lanes I wouldn't also feel compelled to just use a console script to advance straight to NG+10. They're fixing the tedious shit with upgrading powers to rank 10, and all you miss out on by being in NG+1 instead of +10 is the starborn ship/armor (meh).
 
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Dr.Retarded

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I don't know why I enjoy the game as much as I do. Modding made my last playthrough a world of a difference. I just enjoy it because it's kind of easy going, I like the music when it kicks up, I like building spaceships, and watchtower fleet thing was pretty cool. The expansion for snake people faction was okay but it was definitely more of a crafted world that you guys are talking about where their specific points of interest and it that's a pretty good job of showing what they should have done with specific planets. Maybe they could have done one of those in each system, and it would have been great.

I don't know for some reason the game just clicked with me, and yeah the new game plus stuff isn't stupendous but I just like it. Everybody jizzes about Skyrim, but it's a pretty goddamn boring game.

I mean some of you play other retarded games over and over to farm gear for whatever pointless deal, and whatever, if it's fun it's fun.

I think the games in a better place than it was when it came out and it might be something that I revisit every couple of years because it's got some good bones, and I just like it.
 
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Vorph

Vorph

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Starfield is definitely a game I want to like, but it just ends up disappointing me every time I've given it another chance. Especially Shattered Space. Should have been a cool bit of handcrafted content, but it ended up being the most "Skyrim in space" part of the game by far. I'll never understand why they insisted on putting so much space magic into the game instead of just going with standard sci-fi. They never even got something as simple as spacesuits right, from a realism standpoint.

I'll probably still fire it up one last time when Free Lanes/Terran Armada launches though. Mostly because Bethesda finally did one thing right and added the paid part of the update to the existing Premium edition. I do want to check out the updates to ship building though. Last time I played it (Shattered Space launch) barely anything had changed and there was basically only one "best" ship you could build, and you still had to deal with all the bullshit with ladder/door placement. I'm curious to see if adding stairs and whatever new habs/components come with the Terran ships will actually change anything.

Definitely going to setup a savegame for it using console scripts though. I will never not hate how they make you lose a companion in NG no matter what you do, and since I already know how the whole story goes, playing NG+ from the start is the only option imo. It seems like Free Lanes will make anything beyond NG+1 unimportant (especially since the starborn ship and armor are far less desirable when you'll be able to take some stuff with you from one NG to the next) if you don't care about seeing the 'weird' universe variants--which pretty much all suck and will just make you want to finish that cycle as fast as possible anyway.
 
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