Mist
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Student Loans and the SAVE plan
- Thread starter Sanrith Descartes
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Tmac
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What's interesting is that a lot of those quotes provide context. For example, in 2009 a couple bemoans not being able to find a contractor to work on their lakehouse. Well, guess what, the housing market just shit the bed, so it makes sense that you can't find a contractor.
In 2005 "an intense and demanding boss" has high turnover. He blames people not being willing to work anymore.
In 1999 Cecil gives some context and says "they all want to work in front of a computer", bc the dot come boom was in full swing.
In 2020 the person says, "They're making more money not working", which was during COVID and the government was pissing money from the sky, so people had a lot less incentive to work.
So, I mean, on one hand you're right that people historically blame an unwilingness to work. On the other hand this doesn't paint a clear picture bc the AMOUNT of people who don't want to work and the reasons WHY they don't want to work change. And while your list does a good job of providing evidence as to the why, it doesn't give a clear picture as to the amount.
Mist
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It unfurls when you click it. Each reply in the thread is a year with a snippet from an article for a given year. For over a hundred years.
Here is the unrolled version, but it loses the alt text, which contains the reference for each quote.
Thread by @paulisci on Thread Reader App
@paulisci: The Long History of Nobody Wants to Work Anymore 🧵 2002 2001 2000 1999 1998 1997 1996 1995 1994 1993
threadreaderapp.com
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Palum
what Suineg set it to
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I think you need to have an account to get that feature.It unfurls when you click it. Each reply in the thread is a year with a snippet from an article for a given year. For over a hundred years.
Here is the unrolled version, but it loses the alt text, which contains the reference for each quote.
Thread by @paulisci on Thread Reader App
@paulisci: The Long History of Nobody Wants to Work Anymore 🧵 2002 2001 2000 1999 1998 1997 1996 1995 1994 1993
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Mist
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The point is "nobody wants to work anymore" has been a cultural meme for a very long time. Every generation says it, every year, under good economic conditions and bad.
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Koushirou
Log Wizard
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Sadly, I was apparently already put on it. No gibbs for me.
Sanrith Descartes
Veteran of a thousand threadban wars
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So I am deferred until February while they finish my SAVE plan. So no payment this month and next month starts my first payment of $0.
Fucker
Log Wizard
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Mist is too stupid for context. He takes newspaper snippets that don't show anything like labor participation rate, or the fact that 7 million working age males have opted not to work at all....these people aren't counted in anything.
Since Mist doesn't have a real job and never has, he doesn't know any business owners and the very large problem they have finding people to work, and the people they do have aren't very productive, and keeping them long term (more than 6 months) is next to impossible. I know quite a few business owners. A good chunk of them have been doing it for decades, and ALL of them say the workers are lazier and less productive than they've ever been.
Mist
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Ambiturner
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Sanrith Descartes
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Borzak
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My personal opinion I think they are going to have a lot of issues that nobody ever hears about. I did not take out a student loan when I went to college. I pay taxes and rarely get a refund. The one year I did they garnered my tax return to pay off my student load which I never took. Umpteen calls and having my reprsenative look into it the load was for a college in a state I had never heen in. They got it "fixed" and someone used my name apparently. Few years later I was working for someone else and they garnered my wages again to for "my" student loan. More calls and another talk with my rep that got someone motivated to look into it. It's supposidly fixed now but who knows. Everyone I talked to seemed to think it was no big deal and happens often.
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Meta-analysis: On average, undergraduate students' intelligence is merely average
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and...
Big Ooof
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and 1950s when university education was the privilege of a few. Examination of more recent IQ data indicate that IQ of university students and university graduates dropped to the average of the general population. The decline in students' IQ is a necessary consequence of increasing educational attainment over the last 80 years. Today, graduating from university is more common than completing high school in the 1940s. Method. We conducted a meta-analysis of the mean IQ scores of college and university students samples tested with Wechsler Adult Intelligence Scale between 1939 and 2022. Results. The results show that the average IQ of undergraduate students today is a mere 102 IQ points and declined by approximately 0.2 IQ points per year. The students' IQ also varies substantially across universities and is correlated with the selectivity of universities (measured by average SAT scores of admitted students). Discussion. These findings have wide-ranging implications. First, universities and professors need to realize that students are no longer extraordinary but merely average, and have to adjust curricula and academic standards. Second, employers can no longer rely on applicants with university degrees to be more capable or smarter than those without degrees. Third, students need to realize that acceptance into university is no longer an invitation to join an elite group. Fourth, the myth of brilliant undergraduate students in scientific and popular literature needs to be dispelled. Fifth, estimating premorbid IQ based on educational attainment is vastly inaccurate, obsolete, not evidence based, and mere speculations. Sixth, obsolete IQ data or tests ought not to be used to make high-stakes decisions about individuals, for example, by clinical psychologists to opine about intelligence and cognitive abilities of their clients.
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Aldarion
Egg Nazi
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Its hilarious watching them correctly state the cause of the problem, then conclude that the solution is to just dumb everything down.Meta-analysis: On average, undergraduate students' intelligence is merely average
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and...www.frontiersin.org
Big Ooof
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and 1950s when university education was the privilege of a few. Examination of more recent IQ data indicate that IQ of university students and university graduates dropped to the average of the general population. The decline in students' IQ is a necessary consequence of increasing educational attainment over the last 80 years. Today, graduating from university is more common than completing high school in the 1940s. Method. We conducted a meta-analysis of the mean IQ scores of college and university students samples tested with Wechsler Adult Intelligence Scale between 1939 and 2022. Results. The results show that the average IQ of undergraduate students today is a mere 102 IQ points and declined by approximately 0.2 IQ points per year. The students' IQ also varies substantially across universities and is correlated with the selectivity of universities (measured by average SAT scores of admitted students). Discussion. These findings have wide-ranging implications. First, universities and professors need to realize that students are no longer extraordinary but merely average, and have to adjust curricula and academic standards. Second, employers can no longer rely on applicants with university degrees to be more capable or smarter than those without degrees. Third, students need to realize that acceptance into university is no longer an invitation to join an elite group. Fourth, the myth of brilliant undergraduate students in scientific and popular literature needs to be dispelled. Fifth, estimating premorbid IQ based on educational attainment is vastly inaccurate, obsolete, not evidence based, and mere speculations. Sixth, obsolete IQ data or tests ought not to be used to make high-stakes decisions about individuals, for example, by clinical psychologists to opine about intelligence and cognitive abilities of their clients.
We get what we deserve.
Sanrith Descartes
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Statically this makes perfect sense. Original population was wealthy white kids with educated parents. Now it's open to the poor kids with uneducated parents. Surprise, the average goes down as the population changed.
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Can we get the average IQ of undergrads separated out by major/race/parents income level? That should be amusing.Meta-analysis: On average, undergraduate students' intelligence is merely average
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and...
Big Ooof
Background. According to a widespread belief, the average IQ of university students is 115 to 130 IQ points, that is, substantially higher than the average IQ of the general population (M = 100, SD =15). We traced the origin of this belief to obsolete intelligence data collected in 1940s and 1950s when university education was the privilege of a few. Examination of more recent IQ data indicate that IQ of university students and university graduates dropped to the average of the general population. The decline in students' IQ is a necessary consequence of increasing educational attainment over the last 80 years. Today, graduating from university is more common than completing high school in the 1940s. Method. We conducted a meta-analysis of the mean IQ scores of college and university students samples tested with Wechsler Adult Intelligence Scale between 1939 and 2022. Results. The results show that the average IQ of undergraduate students today is a mere 102 IQ points and declined by approximately 0.2 IQ points per year. The students' IQ also varies substantially across universities and is correlated with the selectivity of universities (measured by average SAT scores of admitted students). Discussion. These findings have wide-ranging implications. First, universities and professors need to realize that students are no longer extraordinary but merely average, and have to adjust curricula and academic standards. Second, employers can no longer rely on applicants with university degrees to be more capable or smarter than those without degrees. Third, students need to realize that acceptance into university is no longer an invitation to join an elite group. Fourth, the myth of brilliant undergraduate students in scientific and popular literature needs to be dispelled. Fifth, estimating premorbid IQ based on educational attainment is vastly inaccurate, obsolete, not evidence based, and mere speculations. Sixth, obsolete IQ data or tests ought not to be used to make high-stakes decisions about individuals, for example, by clinical psychologists to opine about intelligence and cognitive abilities of their clients.
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Sanrith Descartes
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