The Astronomy Thread

Loser Araysar

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I want to say that doesn't sound right, but I don't know enough about stars to correct you.

Behemoth star to begin with that is now at the end of its life cycle? So we can expect Canis Majoris to go supernova sometime within the next million years or so?
 

fucker_sl

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How? Is it just a bunch of bullshit space and not dense?
pretty much yes. VY Canis Majoris is the largest known start by its volume, thousands of times larger, but its mass is calculated to be only between 15 and 35 times the Sun. Except for its core, it's made of ionized gas, so it has a very low density

I want to say that doesn't sound right, but I don't know enough about stars to correct you.

Behemoth star to begin with that is now at the end of its life cycle? So we can expect Canis Majoris to go supernova sometime within the next million years or so?
yes, giant red stars are the end stage of the life of star not different from our Sun.

now, i suppose you know how stars are born......nebules and stellar dust gather together with gravity. Once a stellar object reachs a certain mass the gravitation force and pressure it will start a thermonuclear reaction inside the core.

the process involve Hydrogen being converted into Helium though nuclear fusion (hydrogen is the first, most abundant element, and require the least energy to start the process)

when hydrogen is consumed, the star starts to convert helium into Carbon. This, change the Star's size and appearence, turning it gradually from a hot yellow main sequence star to a cooler red star

now, stars like the sun, once their helium is consumed will "slow down", lose their outer layer of gas and become a white dwarf

Stars with at least 10 times the mass of the sun instead will start to fuse Helium into Carbon. More massive stars will continue this process, converting Carbon into Oxygen, then Neon, then Iron depending on how massive the star is. This process will repeat itself, changing the characteristic of the star, until it will reach the stage when Iron is created

Untill then infact, the structure of the star is kept in equilibrium between the force of gravity, attempting to "queeze" the star, and the pressure of the nuclear fusion reaction of its core, that tries to push everything appart

What happends when Iron starts to be made? everything collapse. Why ? because the Neon>Iron fusion reaction has a different characteristic.....it ABSORB energy. So, from a situation where gravity is counterbalanced by the star's internal nuclear push we come to a situation where this counterbalance disappear.

the result is a sudden core collapse. All the inner shells of the core just break down on themself. The result is a sudden compression of energy of massive scale. Energy that bounce back out, creating the stellar event we call Supernova. The Supernova explosion will cause, in the spam of very short time, the nuclear fusion of even heavier elements. All these elements will be scatered across the galaxy when the outer laiyers of the star are blown away by the explosion. Elements that will form the next generation of stars and planets. That's why elements heavier than Helium exist in the universe. Stars forge them and spread them around. As Neil Degrasse Tyson say: we are litterally stardust

depending on how massive the star was, the core will turn itself into a Neutron Star, or even a Black Hole

So, yes, Canis Majoris will explode into a Supernova. Infact, there is major discussions about the magnitude of energy that Canis Majoris will have when it will explode. That's why it won't even explode into a Supernova, it will explode into a Hypernova

of course this is a very simplied explanation. The process and events in it are way way way more complex

The Hypernova of VY Canis Majoris
 

Szlia

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the result is asuddencore collapse. [...] The result is asuddencompression of energy of massive scale. [...]The Supernova explosion will cause, in the spam ofvery short time, the nuclear fusion of even heavier elements.
Are we talking in cosmological terms or in everyday life terms? How sudden and how short a time?
 

fucker_sl

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Are we talking in cosmological terms or in everyday life terms? How sudden and how short a time?
i edited and added a link to a video where it says that the core collapse at dozen of thousands km/second

that's pretty sudden to me :p

and about the creation of heavier elements, i'll quote wiki

Through a process that is not completely understood, some of the gravitational potential energy released by this core collapse is converted into a Type Ib, Type Ic, or Type II supernova. It is known that the core collapse produces a massive surge of neutrinos, as observed with supernova SN 1987A. The extremely energetic neutrinos fragment some nuclei; some of their energy is consumed in releasing nucleons, including neutrons, and some of their energy is transformed into heat and kinetic energy, thus augmenting the shock wave started by rebound of some of the infalling material from the collapse of the core. Electron capture in very dense parts of the infalling matter may produce additional neutrons. Because some of the rebounding matter is bombarded by the neutrons, some of its nuclei capture them, creating a spectrum of heavier-than-iron material including the radioactive elements up to (and likely beyond) uranium.[17] Although non-exploding red giants can produce significant quantities of elements heavier than iron using neutrons released in side reactions of earlier nuclear reactions, the abundance of elements heavier than iron (and in particular, of certain isotopes of elements that have multiple stable or long-lived isotopes) produced in such reactions is quite different from that produced in a supernova. Neither abundance alone matches that found in the Solar System, so both supernovae and ejection of elements from red giants are required to explain the observed abundance of heavy elements and isotopes thereof
As i said, i gave you a very basic explanation before. Way more complex stuff goes on beyond the simple "squeeze" process
 

Loser Araysar

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Are we talking in cosmological terms or in everyday life terms? How sudden and how short a time?
it literally happens in minutes/seconds

as soon as iron is created, its game over, super nova happens right away


oh and there are several stars bigger than VY Canis Majoris, even by volume.
 

Tuco

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pretty much yes. VY Canis Majoris is the largest known start by its volume, thousands of times larger, but its mass is calculated to be only between 15 and 35 times the Sun. Except for its core, it's made of ionized gas, so it has a very low density



yes, giant red stars are the end stage of the life of star not different from our Sun.

now, i suppose you know how stars are born......nebules and stellar dust gather together with gravity. Once a stellar object reachs a certain mass the gravitation force and pressure it will start a thermonuclear reaction inside the core.

the process involve Hydrogen being converted into Helium though nuclear fusion (hydrogen is the first, most abundant element, and require the least energy to start the process)

when hydrogen is consumed, the star starts to convert helium into Carbon. This, change the Star's size and appearence, turning it gradually from a hot yellow main sequence star to a cooler red star

now, stars like the sun, once their helium is consumed will "slow down", lose their outer layer of gas and become a white dwarf

Stars with at least 10 times the mass of the sun instead will start to fuse Helium into Carbon. More massive stars will continue this process, converting Carbon into Oxygen, then Neon, then Iron depending on how massive the star is. This process will repeat itself, changing the characteristic of the star, until it will reach the stage when Iron is created

Untill then infact, the structure of the star is kept in equilibrium between the force of gravity, attempting to "queeze" the star, and the pressure of the nuclear fusion reaction of its core, that tries to push everything appart

What happends when Iron starts to be made? everything collapse. Why ? because the Neon>Iron fusion reaction has a different characteristic.....it ABSORB energy. So, from a situation where gravity is counterbalanced by the star's internal nuclear push we come to a situation where this counterbalance disappear.

the result is a sudden core collapse. All the inner shells of the core just break down on themself. The result is a sudden compression of energy of massive scale. Energy that bounce back out, creating the stellar event we call Supernova. The Supernova explosion will cause, in the spam of very short time, the nuclear fusion of even heavier elements. All these elements will be scatered across the galaxy when the outer laiyers of the star are blown away by the explosion. Elements that will form the next generation of stars and planets. That's why elements heavier than Helium exist in the universe. Stars forge them and spread them around. As Neil Degrasse Tyson say: we are litterally stardust

depending on how massive the star was, the core will turn itself into a Neutron Star, or even a Black Hole

So, yes, Canis Majoris will explode into a Supernova. Infact, there is major discussions about the magnitude of energy that Canis Majoris will have when it will explode. That's why it won't even explode into a Supernova, it will explode into a Hypernova

of course this is a very simplied explanation. The process and events in it are way way way more complex

The Hypernova of VY Canis Majoris
I recently found out about that fact of our universe and it's so cool that the generation of heavy matter is a function of clouds of bullshit->stars->supernovas. In terms of awe I have for the process I put that up there with gravity and life.
 

ShakyJake

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it literally happens in minutes/seconds

as soon as iron is created, its game over, super nova happens right away
What's also amazing is how a massive star will spend millions of years burning hydrogen into helium. But each step up the elemental ladder the burn process gets shorter. Once a star hits silicon it will burn it's entire silicon store in a matter of hours.
 

Tripamang

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Neutron star mergers are another candidate for making large quantities of heavier elements. It's also speculated to happen when a neutron star starts eating/siphoning off material from a companion star, restarting short lived but intense fusion. I can't find the original new scientist article but apparently the distribution of some of the heavy elements cannot be explained by super novas alone.

Making heavy elements by colliding neutron stars | Ars Technica
 

Julian The Apostate

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So I had a thought today. When electrons were discovered we had no idea of all the endless possibilities that electrons could and would eventually be used for. What if at some point we discover the source of dark energy and dark matter and we discover we can tap into these sub-atomic particles(or whatever they happen to be) and are able to manipulate them in ways that we can not even fathom at this point. Maybe discover some hitherto unknown layer of phycsics and bam!! Space travel is possible with dark energy propulsion or some shit.
 

fucker_sl

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I recently found out about that fact of our universe and it's so cool that the generation of heavy matter is a function of clouds of bullshit->stars->supernovas. In terms of awe I have for the process I put that up there with gravity and life.
the past 15 years have been fantastic for cosmic discoveries. We have so much more vast knowledge. Instruments like Hubble have comepletely changed our prospective of the cosmos. I really cant fucking wait for the WEBB telescope to go into orbit. i want the motherfucking WEBB's version of the Ultra Deep Field

The area of space in the picture is about 1/30 of the moon view from earth, and every single point/smudge of light in that picture is an entire galaxy. There are more than 10 thousands galaxies in there. Go figure how fucking big is the cosmos

universe_hubble.jpg

We are observing objects and events that simply boggle our current knowledge and tells us there is so fucking more to learn. Quasar for example have turned from simple proto-stars in young galaxies to cosmic objects we can't fucking understand

particle physics thanks to the LHC have tested and confirmed over a hundred theories with experimental proof, discovere a dozen of new particles, and top of all the existence of the Higgs

the more i follow this stuff, the more i wonder if in my lifetime we will see some groundbreaking discovery on the magnitude of Relativity and/or Quantum Physics that will change everything
 

Loser Araysar

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Quasars and magnetars are some insane shit
 

iannis

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That is the great hope about dark energy, isn't it? Dark matter is just a fudge factor and when we understand dark energy better the %age of the other will probably taper down into more reasonable ranges.

I remember watching a lecture series with a nobel physicist who was putting forward the equations of how dark energy is even possible given our current understanding of reality. 99% of the math parts were over my head, but it was gripping stuff anyway.