Celebrindal
Golden Squire
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- 11
The Big Bad Console Thread - Sway your Station with an Xboner !
- Thread starter Xexx
- Start date
Soygen
The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One
- 28,326
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I'm no apologist, but this is unfortunately the wave of the future. Pretty soon we'll be downloading all of our games(I'm already doing it far more often than buying physical media), so just by virtue of that evolution, the whole 'borrowing' and 'second-hand market' are going to go by the wayside. Internet is fast becoming a required utility like electricity and running water. Having to be connected in some form will be the norm.
I wonder how long it will take to hack the Xbone.
I wonder how long it will take to hack the Xbone.
Quineloe
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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even the mainstream media is hitting back on this issue. and i know Someone is going to sue.
given a choice for gaming this gen, for a system that i just want to play GAMES on- even if my cable goes out for a week cuz an idiot ripped up the line, it is going to be either the U or the PS4 since Sony has said that you never have to log into the internet to play a single player game-unless sony implements a similar system.
hey anyone think this issue is one of the reasons why EA went from "unprecidented partnership" with Nintendo to basically ignoring it because upon hearing the DRM request on reselling etc, Nintendo said...not on our system, we will not implement this. i have read an article -forget where- i clicked on a link @neogaf to read it- that says that it is the publishers that are pushing for the DRM setup microsoft is implementing on used games etc.
If i pick up a new system this fall for my kids, unless sony does the same as MS in this style of issue- OR microsoft changes their mind- i'll be getting the PS4 to go along side the wiiU we already have (and which gets played ~20hrs a week- Monster Hunter, AC4, Blops2, your shape Fitness (i've dropped 8lbs so far using it). so far we have ~15 games for the wiiu- waiting on new good games.
given a choice for gaming this gen, for a system that i just want to play GAMES on- even if my cable goes out for a week cuz an idiot ripped up the line, it is going to be either the U or the PS4 since Sony has said that you never have to log into the internet to play a single player game-unless sony implements a similar system.
hey anyone think this issue is one of the reasons why EA went from "unprecidented partnership" with Nintendo to basically ignoring it because upon hearing the DRM request on reselling etc, Nintendo said...not on our system, we will not implement this. i have read an article -forget where- i clicked on a link @neogaf to read it- that says that it is the publishers that are pushing for the DRM setup microsoft is implementing on used games etc.
If i pick up a new system this fall for my kids, unless sony does the same as MS in this style of issue- OR microsoft changes their mind- i'll be getting the PS4 to go along side the wiiU we already have (and which gets played ~20hrs a week- Monster Hunter, AC4, Blops2, your shape Fitness (i've dropped 8lbs so far using it). so far we have ~15 games for the wiiu- waiting on new good games.
Oh, there's no doubt this is being driven by the publishers. They're basically doing the same thing the RIAA and MPAA would like to do but the options for playing movies and music are far to varied for them to get anywhere with it. The game publishers only have to convince one or at most a few big companies in order to get their way.
Flipmode
EQOA Refugee
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Last I checked, even XBL doesn't host servers for most online games. The players do. It's my bandwidth. So what are they charging me for again? Especially since the PC players get this stuff free. And games do depreciate in value.
Honestly, I can't think of anything which depreciates faster than games. They typically lose 2/3 of their value within a few months. Obviously, the used game market plays a part in this (how much I don't know but I tend to think it's relatively small and it's really due to the yearly release schedule for most games) which is probably a large reason why they want to kill it so badly.
Xarpolis
Life's a Dream
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- 15,645
I would say used market is pretty bad for suppliers. Especially in a world where power gamers exist in mass.
Say 100k people buy a game the day it's released, but 25k turn around and sell it to Gamestop or the like 2-3 days later. Suddenly that's 25k "used" games that are available at a slight price drop. They're still the exact same product in identical condition. The only difference is that you don't have to peel the plastic wrap and sticker from around the outside of the game's case. And you can get it at a slight discount at the same time? That's a potential 25k games that will be purchased as "used" even though they were only played once for a day or two, and that's cutting into the game developers revenue. Especially considering how much money games cost to produce these days, they need every bit of revenue they can get their hands on. It's logical, but the used community doesn't like it.
Say 100k people buy a game the day it's released, but 25k turn around and sell it to Gamestop or the like 2-3 days later. Suddenly that's 25k "used" games that are available at a slight price drop. They're still the exact same product in identical condition. The only difference is that you don't have to peel the plastic wrap and sticker from around the outside of the game's case. And you can get it at a slight discount at the same time? That's a potential 25k games that will be purchased as "used" even though they were only played once for a day or two, and that's cutting into the game developers revenue. Especially considering how much money games cost to produce these days, they need every bit of revenue they can get their hands on. It's logical, but the used community doesn't like it.
What do you think those people who trade their games in spend their credit on? Games, of course.
RE: Development costs. Instead of writing a small essay here, here's a link to Rob Fahey's excellent essay about the poor state of the AAA games industry -http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...ess-innovation
Vaclav
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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I don't do many shooters - and I loathe MP shooters largely - but for the few I've done on PS3 there's absolutely a standard lobby system that allows and prioritizes friends. The only ones that I can think of that I tried that doesn't was Bioshock 2's terrible multiplayer - but that pairs exclusively randomly on PC as well.
right of first sale doctrine however= doesn't MATTER.
100k people buy a Movie DVD--25k people watch the movie and 2 days later sell said movie to a "retailer" for them to sell used at a discount because it is used.
does the Publisher of the movie get ANY revenue from the used movie sale? no
a publisher publishes a book - printed- 100k people buy the book, 25k decide they do not like the book and sell said book to a used book seller- does the publisher get any revenue from the resale of the used book? no
you buy a 50" plasma TV but after a few months there is this Sweet deal on a 60" plasma for less money than you paid for the 50" you sell the plasma tv you have to a used electronics store. does the manufacturer get ANY money from that store when it resells it? NO
why does a console game disk DIFFER from those items listed above? just how the publisher terms ownership of the product,
if say Paramount decided that dvd disks are licenced products, you do not own the product ON the disk and they have the right to recind the ability of you to play the movie on a dvd player at your friends house...that you legally cannot resell the disk to someone else to use, that you cannot lend the disk to someone else without them paying for the "rights" to use the "license" on their player.
how fast would paramount get slapped with lawsuits and people enmasse protesting that decision they made?
it's the SAME issue that MS is bringing up right now. unless this changes, no way in hell am i buying the x-bone.
100k people buy a Movie DVD--25k people watch the movie and 2 days later sell said movie to a "retailer" for them to sell used at a discount because it is used.
does the Publisher of the movie get ANY revenue from the used movie sale? no
a publisher publishes a book - printed- 100k people buy the book, 25k decide they do not like the book and sell said book to a used book seller- does the publisher get any revenue from the resale of the used book? no
you buy a 50" plasma TV but after a few months there is this Sweet deal on a 60" plasma for less money than you paid for the 50" you sell the plasma tv you have to a used electronics store. does the manufacturer get ANY money from that store when it resells it? NO
why does a console game disk DIFFER from those items listed above? just how the publisher terms ownership of the product,
if say Paramount decided that dvd disks are licenced products, you do not own the product ON the disk and they have the right to recind the ability of you to play the movie on a dvd player at your friends house...that you legally cannot resell the disk to someone else to use, that you cannot lend the disk to someone else without them paying for the "rights" to use the "license" on their player.
how fast would paramount get slapped with lawsuits and people enmasse protesting that decision they made?
it's the SAME issue that MS is bringing up right now. unless this changes, no way in hell am i buying the x-bone.
Saladus
Bronze Knight of the Realm
- 271
- 11
http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comme...nitoring_this/
TL,DR - Microsoft has many employees who are hard at work downvoting any negative submissions about Xbox One on reddit, while also trying to lay on praise in comments.
TL,DR - Microsoft has many employees who are hard at work downvoting any negative submissions about Xbox One on reddit, while also trying to lay on praise in comments.
I don't understand how is it that hard for these publishers to get it right. To fix the used game problem, they need to provide better incentives for people to move over to buying games digitally, and handle disc and digital versions differently.
Disc: Works as it is now. Use disc-based security to avert piracy.
Digital: In addition to all the benefits it currently has (no disc switching, no worrying over lost/scratched discs, etc), it needs to provide more value and incentives for customers to move over from discs:
-Preload games and unlock at midnight.There is a huge crowd that waits in line midnight on release date for AAA games. Preloading games is a good incentive, and maybe even go one step further and unlock games an hour or two before midnight.
-Game ownership. The console makers need to provide a legal-binding statement that they will provide a patch to turn off DRM at console's end of life, so those game collectors among us will feel safe investing in this system.
-No time-limit offline mode. The 24-hour check-in will work only against customers. Those who want to circumvent it will always find a way (see: piracy on every system ever released.)
- Bonus:One time game transfer. This idea from MS is good, although not really necessary because none of the current digital media on other platforms provide it. Although they need to get rid of the stupid clause of needing a publisher's permission to do so. Maybe make it only doable after owning a game for 2 months.
The next generation of gamers is already accustomed to how DRM works due to iOS and Android, but they need to bridge the perceived-value gap between $5 and $60-70 games by adding values to it. But somehow in MS's proposed system, they have made it worse than the current Steam/iOS/Android platforms.
Disc: Works as it is now. Use disc-based security to avert piracy.
Digital: In addition to all the benefits it currently has (no disc switching, no worrying over lost/scratched discs, etc), it needs to provide more value and incentives for customers to move over from discs:
-Preload games and unlock at midnight.There is a huge crowd that waits in line midnight on release date for AAA games. Preloading games is a good incentive, and maybe even go one step further and unlock games an hour or two before midnight.
-Game ownership. The console makers need to provide a legal-binding statement that they will provide a patch to turn off DRM at console's end of life, so those game collectors among us will feel safe investing in this system.
-No time-limit offline mode. The 24-hour check-in will work only against customers. Those who want to circumvent it will always find a way (see: piracy on every system ever released.)
- Bonus:One time game transfer. This idea from MS is good, although not really necessary because none of the current digital media on other platforms provide it. Although they need to get rid of the stupid clause of needing a publisher's permission to do so. Maybe make it only doable after owning a game for 2 months.
The next generation of gamers is already accustomed to how DRM works due to iOS and Android, but they need to bridge the perceived-value gap between $5 and $60-70 games by adding values to it. But somehow in MS's proposed system, they have made it worse than the current Steam/iOS/Android platforms.
Steam handles it fine and it will be a positive thing if the MS marketplace handles it like Steam with deeply discounted games available after their release. The problem is so far Xbox Live Marketplace really hasn't shown the sales in the same manner as steam has.
It's great for consumers, but IMO devaluing your product is bad for the long term health of the industry. Adding more values is the proper solution.
Furry
WoW Office
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meStevo
I think your wife's a bigfoot gus.
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