The Big Bad Console Thread - Sway your Station with an Xboner !

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Booting Microsoft from E3? Yeah, that'll happen
If they're being antiethical to the intent to E3, they should be - the city is the one that runs it, no?

I know when similar has occurred at Pharma conventions that are equivalent that Pfizer and some others have been booted for a few years.
 

Kedwyn

Silver Squire
3,915
80
Bets on how bad this fucks over microsoft this spring?
The ball is in Sony's court. I wouldn't count on them not fucking up this wet dream. I mean it should be obvious what needs to be done to win. They have the ball, no one is in front of them and the end zone is in sight. Just don't trip over your untied shoe lace.
 

Lithose

Buzzfeed Editor
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I would say used market is pretty bad for suppliers. Especially in a world where power gamers exist in mass.

Say 100k people buy a game the day it's released, but 25k turn around and sell it to Gamestop or the like 2-3 days later. Suddenly that's 25k "used" games that are available at a slight price drop. They're still the exact same product in identical condition. The only difference is that you don't have to peel the plastic wrap and sticker from around the outside of the game's case. And you can get it at a slight discount at the same time? That's a potential 25k games that will be purchased as "used" even though they were only played once for a day or two, and that's cutting into the game developers revenue. Especially considering how much money games cost to produce these days, they need every bit of revenue they can get their hands on. It's logical, but the used community doesn't like it.
Every product goes through this, well, almost all of them..Books, Movies, TV Shows and durables are all as good as new for normal usage (Note: Not collecting ect--but then neither are games).

The fact is the entertainment industry is growing, rapidly. It's rising far faster in terms of market share than normal GDP growth. (So it's growing on it's own, not just because there are more people.)

rrr_img_29171.jpg

Are production and marketing costs growing? Yeah, but the main culprit with this "not enough profit" isn't the fact that the profit isn't there (As seen in the picture, it is) and it's not the fact that production is exceeding profit potential (It isn't, the market would not continue to grow otherwise.)--It's that this entire market is in a really fucked up position from a capital and distribution perspective. They are using outmoded methods of capital procurement, which essentially still requires a publisher to give the okay to an investment vehicle, which rapes profits margins while giving pretty negligible benefits considering the diversity of media.

In other words, marketing has less control over media thanks to the internet, your DVR and on demand. So each dollar spent has less effect. So these guys are less effective at actually making a game successful (Due to field diversity, easy of communication thanks to places like Rerolled and facebook and other things, a game being GOOD drives the largest part of marketing--word of mouth.) However rich old guys at the banks don't know and frankly don't give a fuck what makes a game successful. They care about their money, the return, time and risk. And to assess this they rely on experts "in the industry" that have the highest reliable profit potential--and those experts are larger publishers.

Many, very well paid, analysts give this investment method the nod. Why? Because once upon a time these people (Publishers) wereneededto deliver games to you. Moving physical products without the internet tended to suck, actually. And without message boards, youtube, facebook and everything else, hearing about whether something was good or bad came only from reviews (Which could be bought and were) or from the TV. Frankly, in yesteryear a game could blow but if it was marketed right it could still be a success (Especially if it tied itself to things nerds enjoy, like Mountain Dew!) So these "middle men" are pretty entrenched and they operate as the gate keeper between the money and developers.

These gate keepers collect a pretty huge toll--spend a huge amount of less and less effective marketing (Which they combine with other products to help their buddies make money--every gamer needs Doritos!) and lastly, they give the developer (You know, the actual person making the game) small advances to deliver a product (By far the least important thing, even the name is more important). Then they take their flops, and their successes, bundle them together, and work some magic to continue convincing the banks that they are the only method with which to invest in developers that doesn't carry inordinate risk. (Love you, Hollywood.) So they can continue to get fat, while their actual job becomes less and less effective thanks to free flowing information. (Which they are desperately trying to stop with really shitty legislative practices.)

The fact is, game studios aren't heading the way of the dinosaur.Publishersare. And they are like a cancer trying to fuck the every last dime out of the industry before they are put to rest for good. But they will continually point to production, pirating and second hand sales to detract from their continued marginalization. And the sad part is, their accounting and numbers games are very good--as good as Hollywoods and the record industry. So they can hide their inefficiency and stay in control of the only thing that's important--capital.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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That fits my gut on things, especially with Kinect being packaged with XBone and Eye not being packaged with PS4.

I would hope the contract version of the XBone is cheaper than $300 w/ 2 years at $15/mo though - closer to $250 would be a reasonable gouge for the contract ($110 of gouge)
 

Breakarms_sl

shitlord
80
0
I would say used market is pretty bad for suppliers. Especially in a world where power gamers exist in mass.

Say 100k people buy a game the day it's released, but 25k turn around and sell it to Gamestop or the like 2-3 days later. Suddenly that's 25k "used" games that are available at a slight price drop. They're still the exact same product in identical condition. The only difference is that you don't have to peel the plastic wrap and sticker from around the outside of the game's case. And you can get it at a slight discount at the same time? That's a potential 25k games that will be purchased as "used" even though they were only played once for a day or two, and that's cutting into the game developers revenue. Especially considering how much money games cost to produce these days, they need every bit of revenue they can get their hands on. It's logical, but the used community doesn't like it.
You people amaze me. THIS IS EVERY OTHER MARKET ON THE PLANET. It's like you stupid newbies think that video games invented the used-sale concept. You are ignorant fools and playing into the sad music that the fat bastards at the top of Activision and EA are spewing. Here's a clue: Game publishers who drive this are not poor. They are rich beyond belief because they hoard so much of the money you spend on games. This is the music industry all over again. If the greedy cocksuckers at RIAA could have, they would have banned used CD shops in the 90's and 2000's. This industry doesn't need a clampdown on used games, it needs people running it that aren't in it for the money and that's exactly what we have right now in the only companies that really matter for major titles (Publishers). Bethesda, you're next to fall btw.
 

Chillz

Bronze Knight of the Realm
133
3
What's with all that spoon-feeding crap and regulations coming from American coorporations these days? All the nannyism we are expected to put up with these days is pissing me off. These companies expect buyers to abide all their rules and regulations for zero benefit. I buy a game, but it's not mine, i am only buying a licence to play it? I have to identify myself via several ways in order to play a friggen video game or watch a movie while i get monitored about my preferences so i get even spoon fed more about shit that may fancy me. The future is grrrrreat.

I really hope there are enough free minded consumers left who may, or may not vote with their wallet. My expectations are low however, since games like Sim City, Diablo3 etc are all best sellers. As will be the Xbone, i have no doubt about that.
 

Furry

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I dont think publishing is dying, just the old style of publishing is dying. Old school publishers really were people that fucked people in the ass. New style publishers (Lookin at steam) provide a service on top of delivering games. They basically create a unification that allows you to much more simply manage your games, a convenient shop. I could go into all the pluses that steam offers, but thats been iterated on many times before in this thread.

Microsoft looks at companies like steam, or apple and their app store and simply doesnt get it. They look at all the models of their business model they like, and all the parts of their competitors that they like, and their trying to slap together something that is basically Microsoft #1 fuck all else. They simply have no concept of balance. Steam is far from perfect, but I am pursonally willing to put up with the things I consider negative because steam is so damn convenient in other ways. I dont have to worry about where my discs are, where my games are, what patches or patchers to use. I just click download and fucking go. I can cloud save if I choose to, but I dont have to. I can standardize controls between games automatically or some settings, but I don't have to. I can log on and play online for various reasons, but I dont HAVE to. That makes all of them conveniences, but if any one of them turned into a "HAVE TO" it would become a pretty big damn inconvenience. When a publisher can offer these services it provides a real benefit to the players of the game, a network for both pushed and word of mouth advertising, and the publisher is providing something useful in doing so.

Publishing is becoming a service based industry, because the customer is directly interacting with the publisher in the world of the future. Valve has it right and is making decisions based on this fact. Microsoft just hasn't woken up to the idea, and they are making decision based on how to fuck the most money out of the most people, because thats been the more traditional publishing approach.
 

DMK_sl

shitlord
1,600
0
I just fucken hate the PS controller otherwise I'd seriously consider jumping ship from Xbox after all this bullshit was released. I honestly can't understand how people find the ps controller comfortable. The sticks are way to close together, long play sessions my thumbs are fucked not to mention I'm constantly slipping of the things.

It blows my mind that people like them they are made for tiny Asian hands or some shit. When I put an Xbox controller in my hand it feels perfect. Hopefully a 3rd party makes an Xbox controller for the PS.
 

Wombat

Trakanon Raider
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Valve has it right and is making decisions based on this fact. Microsoft just hasn't woken up to the idea
Err, what in God's name are you talking about? Aside from the much shorter call-in, MS' policies are those of Steam or better. About the only point you can complain about, vs. Steam, is the difficulty for indie games to show up on the platform.

Let's be clear here: Steam gets away with a lot because of one reason: Steam Deals. If the games weren't so cheap, people would be much more upset with their policies. I suspect the Xbox One will be a view into an alternate universe where Steam game stayed $60 forever and died on the vine.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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I feel the opposite myself, XBox always felt like a steering wheel to me - but I don't have monster hands. There has never been a shortage of 3rd party controllers regardless though.
 

Zaphid

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Err, what in God's name are you talking about? Aside from the much shorter call-in, MS' policies are those of Steam or better. About the only point you can complain about, vs. Steam, is the difficulty for indie games to show up on the platform.

Let's be clear here: Steam gets away with a lot because of one reason: Steam Deals. If the games weren't so cheap, people would be much more upset with their policies. I suspect the Xbox One will be a view into an alternate universe where Steam game stayed $60 forever and died on the vine.
Dedicated servers, mod support, online retailers fighting for customers. There's also a lot of old titles, but gog.com has them beat on that one, because some of those barely work on Steam without extensive modding and GoG has that already included. You can also trade stuff for games, I think my TF2 inventory would fetch a few dollars.
 

jooka

marco esquandolas
<Bronze Donator>
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Err, what in God's name are you talking about? Aside from the much shorter call-in, MS' policies are those of Steam or better. About the only point you can complain about, vs. Steam, is the difficulty for indie games to show up on the platform.

Let's be clear here: Steam gets away with a lot because of one reason: Steam Deals. If the games weren't so cheap, people would be much more upset with their policies. I suspect the Xbox One will be a view into an alternate universe where Steam game stayed $60 forever and died on the vine.
exactly what policies are you talking about? I use steam on and off depending where I am and what laptop I am currently using. ON or OFF line.

EDIT you clearly do not shit about steam.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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exactly what policies are you talking about? I use steam on and off depending where I am and what laptop I am currently using. ON or OFF line.

EDIT you clearly do not shit about steam.
And apparently he's missed that Steam is apparently looking into how to do a practical means to "trade games" within their system as well for the EU at the very least if not for full world once they'd have it in place. Supposedly it's something they want to resolve before the SteamBox or whatever it ends up being called releases.
 

Xexx

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I just fucken hate the PS controller otherwise I'd seriously consider jumping ship from Xbox after all this bullshit was released. I honestly can't understand how people find the ps controller comfortable. The sticks are way to close together, long play sessions my thumbs are fucked not to mention I'm constantly slipping of the things.

It blows my mind that people like them they are made for tiny Asian hands or some shit. When I put an Xbox controller in my hand it feels perfect. Hopefully a 3rd party makes an Xbox controller for the PS.
I would support such a thing. I'm 6'3 and the PS controller was fine when i was playing ps1 and younger but man i just dont like the controller anymore.
 

Antarius

Lord Nagafen Raider
1,828
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Even if they do, I doubt anyone here can really be influenced, since we are some of the most jaded gamers on the planet after all. "Anything you announce is shit until you prove otherwise" is good rule to live by (and cheap!).

Makes me wonder how much of reddit is being abused by PR though, especially in the more frequented parts.
I don't listen to anyone one this forum with a join date beyond 2004, fucking 05'ers