Weight Loss Thread

Dandai

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I'm wondering if that 66% vs 6% number comes from belief in the EPOC. There was a metastudy about the research on that which it indicates it's nowhere near as powerful as some would have you believe:Effects of exercise intensity and duration on the excess post-exercise oxygen consumption. - PubMed - NCBI



Not to harp on it, but the 6% number just isn't real. Your fat to carb expenditure during exercise skews towards glycogen use at higher intensity, not fat use. Against, you will burn more calories per time spent at high intensity (including fat calories), but the ratio of fat to carb is more skewed towards carb.

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Your recent post reminded me I never went back to listen to the podcast again to confirm my understanding. You were right - the 6% vs. 66% was caloric burn, not fat burn. Their argument is that, "Yes, you will burn more fatduringlow intensity steady state cardio. However, high intensity interval training burns moreoverallfat due to the 66% increase in caloric burn." They don't explicitly mention the EPOC concept in their discussion, but I think they do imply its effects as they discuss a boost in mitochondrial production and oxidative activity caused by the HIIT.

Anyway, just wanted to let you know that I misunderstood what they were saying and you were right to question what I was saying. For me, the key point is that LISS works, but it's not optimal in any measure when compared to HIIT. I know HIIT isn't for everyone though, just like LISS isn't for me.
 

Dandai

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Just stick to your plan, it will work and it seems like you like it so why change something that will work for you? There's too much information out there, and it's hard to separate the chaff from the wheat. Sensory overload and all that.
I'm definitely sticking to my plan, regardless, but I like to be as informed as possible. If he provides something that seems logically and factually sound (and is more optimal than what I'm doing already), I'm sure it won't be too disruptive to try it out at a future date.
 

Vaclav

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Meh, might need to start catching up and frequenting here soon - I'm a short guy that was underweight for a long, long time - 5'2"/100-110 for most of my life. But in the last year, my weight has gone up about 50% - gaining about 5 lbs a month or so it seems.

120-130 is considered an "ideal" weight for my height so I'm not concerned with back to 100-110 range (I'm not some chick! Even though I kept a chick weight incidentally) - but definitely need to stop gaining and hopefully lose a few pounds. Sucks, and not working towards it yet - but I might start breezing over the majority and start to ask some questions. Likely start in earnest after the New Year - since my secondary insurance switch will cover a nutritionist and exercise program - which my current plan doesn't really. [the gym offers a Medicare client discount - that's it]
 

Tenks

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The best day to start is today. There will always be reasons to not start. Just get your ass in motion.
 

Dandai

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The best day to start is today. There will always be reasons to not start. Just get your ass in motion.
I'll second this. I had plenty of reasons [read: excuses] for not starting (I already ate like shit today so I'll start tomorrow, I need to plan my routine better - what will I do tomorrow?, my supplements won't be here until next week, etc).

When I finally started I felt so good and relieved that I was finally doing something. And because I felt the momentum of doing something I was further motivated to do the things I had been using as excuses to delay starting (planning, managing diet, etc).
 

Itlan

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You don't need a fucking nutritionist or weight program. Join a gym, stop eating bullshit, see results. It's that simple.

This MMO forum just promotes min/maxing.
 

Tenks

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We could all benefit from a life add-on which makes an alarm sound when you're about to eat garbage. Would make raiding The Pantry so much more convenient!
 

ubiquitrips

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Meh, might need to start catching up and frequenting here soon - I'm a short guy that was underweight for a long, long time - 5'2"/100-110 for most of my life. But in the last year, my weight has gone up about 50% - gaining about 5 lbs a month or so it seems.

120-130 is considered an "ideal" weight for my height so I'm not concerned with back to 100-110 range (I'm not some chick! Even though I kept a chick weight incidentally) - but definitely need to stop gaining and hopefully lose a few pounds. Sucks, and not working towards it yet - but I might start breezing over the majority and start to ask some questions. Likely start in earnest after the New Year - since my secondary insurance switch will cover a nutritionist and exercise program - which my current plan doesn't really. [the gym offers a Medicare client discount - that's it]
Firas Zahabi is a MMA Coach and overall introspective guy. I enjoyed this video on building habit, etc. for fitness.

How to Program your Mind for Fitness - The Power of Creating Momentum - Firas Zahabi - YouTube

Simple concepts, but could be helpful for getting things started.
 

Vaclav

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You don't need a fucking nutritionist or weight program. Join a gym, stop eating bullshit, see results. It's that simple.

This MMO forum just promotes min/maxing.
I've been doing a gym w/o any training for the past three years - clearly it's more than just that - and I'm eating "less bullshit" than I used to when I maintained my weight. It's clearly "not that simple". Shit man, in my 20's I'd literally eat like two packages of Oreo's + a gallon of milk in a sitting without ever putting on a pound. These days, I track calories, and I'm sitting around 1200-1800 calories of intake a day. (usually in 2 meals rather than 3 however - which I'm sure fucks with my metabolism a bit - but my stomach doesn't like me to eat for a few hours after I get up)

Hell, I've been eating like this for almost five years now - and only been in the gym for the past three. If I should've gained weight "from eating bullshit" I should've started packing on pounds years ago when I was inactive and eating like this and was afraid to exercise when my medical issues were severe. (We're talking basically homebound because I was afraid to move more than I had to those years... and note - that's the reason I've been in the gym for years, it's what helped get my neurologic shit under control) [my diet WAS different before that however - neurologic issues benefit from some focuses in eating]

What's that they say about assuming? Oh yea...
 

Tenks

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You said in your OP you're not working towards it yet which implies you're not going to the gym nor tracking calories. I also am having a tough time swallowing if you're hitting the gym in earnest 3 times a week and eating 1500 calories you're gaining weight.
 

Vaclav

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I'll second this. I had plenty of reasons [read: excuses] for not starting (I already ate like shit today so I'll start tomorrow, I need to plan my routine better - what will I do tomorrow?, my supplements won't be here until next week, etc).

When I finally started I felt so good and relieved that I was finally doing something. And because I felt the momentum of doing something I was further motivated to do the things I had been using as excuses to delay starting (planning, managing diet, etc).
Heh, I'd love to - but my miserliness can't justify spending $500 in payments or so for the same appointments that will run me $40 in copays in just a few weeks. I'm always of that mindset - but only thing I can think of a "today" thing I could justify is to buy a kayak to get some extra exercise with the canal we've got here on my property. [it's Central FL here, so there's only a couple weeks it's not weather for it from cold - and storm season is basically done I think] Rest of it deflates in cost so much in a few weeks that I can't justify starting early, especially since I'm in the midst of replacing my car.
 

Vaclav

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You said in your OP you're not working towards it yet which implies you're not going to the gym nor tracking calories. I also am having a tough time swallowing if you're hitting the gym in earnest 3 times a week and eating 1500 calories you're gaining weight.
With an actual plan targeted at it? I go to the gym to do basic movement exercises and strength - it's not cardio or anything designed for weightloss. It's strength/flexibility stuff, if normal people did them, I believe. [hard to explain neurologic stuff - it stops my limbs from randomly going limp as well - but hard to have a single punchy word for that]

I only go there to repeat my gym plan that was put together by PT to deal with neurologic symptoms.

And I do end up counting calories - because of the wife, we can count the number of meals we eat separate a month on a hand - just incidentally because we share all meals it's already done for me, besides tweaking it slightly for beverage/snack variation - but I barely have any snacks and tend to drink unsweetened tea so almost zip additional to account for.

What I meant by "working towards it" is I haven't changed anything since I've noticed the gain happening. I had my routine, which included both - clearly something needs to change - I've not made a change yet. I'm figuring 2 meals to 3 meals and adding some new types of exercise versus most of my current stuff which has stuff like "grab exercises" where I'm using this wacky machine that I can tell you only works my hand and wrist muscles for example. Pilates machine shit for my legs, etc. All really light impact stuff. [And due to my stupid genetics, I barely can sweat - so the normal "just go in, do cardio and build up a sweat" isn't something that works for me - without risking a stroke if I push myself too far]
 

Vaclav

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Whats your routine look like? Exercises/sets/reps/etc.
Varies a little bit since it's through PT and whatever they've got me scheduled for explicitly - but most of the time since the move, this PT has had my schedule with stretches in sets of 10-20, leg work on what I believe is a pilates machine (they usually set me up to go for 15 min on that I think? I just wait for the timer) - I lay full back and basically slide myself a little with my legs, there's a thing that's almost like a bikes pedals for my arms that again is timed - more like 5-10 min on that I think, and then the grippy hand things for reps of 10 usually around 4 times.

It's "gym" stuff put super light impact as I said - but again, I've gotta watch how active I get because I can't maintain my temperature by sweating. Thus why I need a pro behind me before I alter things. (Or pool work perhaps - but the PT I'm with for my gym work does not have a pool - after my insurance tweak becomes active in January I'll have access to a pool however... and no, my canal is not swimmable)
 

Sterling

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Yeah I don't see how you're gaining weight at 1500 calories a day with some amount of exercise unless you're like a 70 pound 5th grader. 1800ish calories is maintenance level at like 150 pounds as a sedentary person.
 

Vaclav

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Yeah I don't see how you're gaining weight at 1500 calories a day with some amount of exercise unless you're like a 70 pound 5th grader. 1800ish calories is maintenance level at like 150 pounds as a sedentary person.
Heh, I am 5'2" and very light boned, my "maintenance level" is probably the bare minimum that an adult man can be without being a midget. There's 5th graders bigger than me. [Hell, I think my niece was taller than me around then - but she's on track to be a 6' tall woman or damn near] But also keep in mind, I effectively eat 12 hrs and fast 12 hrs a day because of my 2 meals thing - isn't stuff like that supposed to screw with your metabolism so it stores more than normal?

I'd not be shocked if some of it is water weight - a dietary thing for me because of neurologic stuff includes much more sodium than a normal person, since sodium helps nerve function - I've been under instruction to keep to about 3x the normal recommendations. [Although that probably needs to be revised regardless - that advice is around 5-6 years old now, and I'm starting to have high BP, back then my BP was regularly dangerously low on top of the nerve issues - unfortunately this GP down here doesn't do diet suggestions AT ALL and just refers to a nutritionist, thus why I talk about getting one - its under GP suggestion to do so]

I also wonder, since my night seizures have been gone for the past 2 years or so - if that was effectively giving me extra exercise when I was having them. I used to have seizures almost every night during my sleep. (I was unaware of them, but the wife would always make it quite clear that they happened - we're not big people and would sleep on opposite sides of a King for that reason - she'd love snuggling when we were awake, but the minute we were ready to nod off we'd roll to opposite ends, and even then sometimes she'd show me a bruise or two in the morning from a really long flail =/) I imagine they would, and I guess that would be a "drop in exercise routine" technically around when the weight gain started if so. Weird to think about.

Was a little annoyed at people giving me a hard time at first, but between this and some other thoughts that have popped into my head because of the hassling - there's a few tweaks I think I'll try short term before I get someone to properly advise me on some absolutes.

My immediate plan (before getting professionals involved in January) thanks to you guys:
1) Work on adjusting my diet to 3 meals a day (including shrinking lunch/dinner to make up for the additional calories from breakfast)
2) Try to add some super light cardio into the gym mix. (treadmill is probably lowest impact to avoid the sweating worries while I don't have a pro to advise probably, right? Besides pool work at least - which isn't an option till Jan)
3) Look at buying some small dumbbells/leg weights/other stupid small shit for some additional light cardio at home.
4) Try tapering sodium levels in diet a bit, see if there's a better sweet spot I can find before a nutritionist gets involved. Honestly, while the amount I'm intaking does seem to help with nerve function a TON, I really shouldn't have more than I need to maintain nerve function. If I only need say 150% compared to someone it'll be better heartwise and maybe water weight wise if I get it down there. (I plan around 200% from nutrional information blurbs, then I eyeball some extra with salting my meats and such)
 

Khane

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Just so you know, regardless of anything else, nutritionists know exactly jack and shit about how the body works and what you should be eating. There is absolutely no accreditation and if you get 10 nutritionists in a room to talk about healthy eating habits you'll get 10 different opinions based on whatever mantra they were indoctrinated with.
 

Sterling

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At your height/weight maintenance level at light activity level is 2100 calories. The fasting thing isn't going to affect this like 30+ percent. Not trying to bash on you, but it seems like you're not counting calories accurately. Probably portion size or something. And it's good that you want to work on this.
 

Cad

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Vaclav you have actual medical problems dude, I doubt our bro advice will be very helpful for you. Most of the post in this thread are like "zomg I am 5'5 and 290lbs should I do starting strength and what should I eatz0rz???"

You have like significant medical issues I'd do exactly what your doctors say and discount what anyone in here says.