Weight Loss Thread

Dashel · Jul 30, 2013

The Quest bars are $$$ yeah, like 2 bucks each which is a lot. But fuck it I'm paying for the convenience. Nutritionally they are impressive on paper. 20g protein, a ton of fiber. Taste good to me, for a protein bar. I ordered a couple of boxes. I already eat a ton of eggs and chicken, i need something to switch things up.

arkktheseaotter_sl · Jul 30, 2013

Denaut_sl said:
Ark, your contention (along with the links you posted) seems to be that a person?s general size, weight, and body composition are unrelated to hormones and entirely dependent on Calories in/Calories out. This is totally, patently, and demonstrably false.

To continue along this line of reasoning is to ignore vast quantities of knowledge about many aspects of biology including the existence of the entiresympathetic nervous systemwhich uses hormones to govern a person?s energy expenditure at a completely unconscious level.

It ignores the existence ofZucker Rats, a rat with a genetic flaw in itsleptinwhosefood intake does not fully their overall body composition(Link1 Link2). This is not even remotely new information, and has been known since the 90s.

Your disparagement of hormones as ?magic? ignores how incredibly powerful they are for signaling in biological organisms. Hormones are largely responsible for creatingsexual differentiationin humans, they can ?magically? turn males into females.

Furthermore you also ignore themost well known ?magic? hormone of all,Anabolic steroids, which have an unbelievably clear and very measurable effect on a human?s body composition and how it processes food.

There plenty of nonsense out there (I again refer tonutritionism), but you were the one who decided to resort to personal attacks, at which point you clearly signaled the conversation was over. I responded in kind.

I am not familiar with Alan Argon, but I am with Lyle McDonald (I own, have read, and use several of his books), I will assume they line up philosophically. Lyle at least is an excellent technician at treating the symptom that is excess accumulation of adipose tissue, but this does nothing to address the root cause of theunderlying disease. They deal with already eager, curious, and especially motivated individuals offering great advice to help them get resultsbut this does absolutely nothing to obesity as a public health issue and population level disease.

If you want to be an adult, and have an actual conversation I am more than willing to do that. If you instead want to spew hate and be an all-around asshat (which is why I avoid the lifting thread like the plague) then I?ll just add you to my ignore list. I have few qualms about that as it exists for a reason.

Just add me to the ignore list, we're on totally different pages. At the end of the day I'm not trying to change peoples minds, even if I tell them something is wrong or dumb or inefficient. If you are happy with your body and goals and whatever you do, have at it. I really don't care enough to even respond to this any more than I already am, heh.

arkktheseaotter_sl · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
Largely because I am over one month in and it is working. There is no motivation like progress.

There is also a comfort level with these programs. I had done Atkins around 15 years ago to get some weight down after high school. I am able to eat what I want (more or less) without counting calories or really putting much thought into it at all. I am also able to get some results before attempting exercise (first DDP Yoga session was yesterday!).

Please believe, I understand other methods would work, but why mess with a good thing?

Honestly at your weight you could be eating 1 piece of pizza 3x per day and you would still lose weight, rapidly.

One thing I never get with people on these weird keto diets is if you insist on that, why they don't do something like Ultimate Diet 2.0. It's very low carb, and it is all structured around a carb load one day a week where you can eat 1000-1200g of carbs and you will still lose weight. I've done it, it works, and it isn't gimmicky(ie the coffee). You just deplete tue-fri, load sat, taper down sunday and monday. Jesus just thinking about all that food on one day gives me a boner.

arkktheseaotter_sl · Jul 30, 2013

Ossoi_sl said:
You obviously, seeing as you're still banging that drum. And as for swear it's working, I've dropped 2 belt holes and am buying 30" waist trousers again instead of 34".. I don't need to swear anything

You also seem remarkably concerned about Ubiqs progress and methodology.

You never post about your own weight loss, so presumably your sole raison d'etre in this thread is to criticise other people. GO AWAY!

I fuck with you because you are a caricature, and you make it really easy.

I don't post about my own weight loss because I'm not trying to lose weight =P and if I was, I wouldn't post about it because this isn't my journal. It's a weight loss thread, discussing shit even to the degree that Denaut takes it, but it isn't "log your daily food intake and bodyfat levels or get out thread."

When I start dieting I will PM you directly so you will be the first to know.

Denaut · Jul 30, 2013

arkktheseaotter_sl said:
Just add me to the ignore list, we're on totally different pages. At the end of the day I'm not trying to change peoples minds, even if I tell them something is wrong or dumb or inefficient. If you are happy with your body and goals and whatever you do, have at it. I really don't care enough to even respond to this any more than I already am, heh.

Fair enough, no need to ignore you, we can agree to disagree. I do happen to agree strongly with you when you say "if you are happy with your body and goals and whatever you do, have at it." I also think, like you, 90% of what is out there is nonsense. To be fair I did react to your goading and I shouldn't have, for that I apologize.

Denaut · Jul 30, 2013

arkktheseaotter_sl said:
Honestly at your weight you could be eating 1 piece of pizza 3x per day and you would still lose weight, rapidly.

One thing I never get with people on these weird keto diets is if you insist on that, why they don't do something like Ultimate Diet 2.0. It's very low carb, and it is all structured around a carb load one day a week where you can eat 1000-1200g of carbs and you will still lose weight. I've done it, it works, and it isn't gimmicky(ie the coffee). You just deplete tue-fri, load sat, taper down sunday and monday. Jesus just thinking about all that food on one day gives me a boner.

In what is probably seems like a massive about face, I second this recommendation. I have Lyle's book and it is sets out a very good sustainable plan along with other excellent tips. Worth dropping the coin on if you are inclined to do so. I actually recommend buying the ebook along with the physical copy (if you go that route) because it is spiral bound and wears poorly through a couple of reads or if you lend it out a lot like I do.

Edited:Link to the Ultimate Diet 2.0

arkktheseaotter_sl · Jul 30, 2013

Denaut_sl said:
Fair enough, no need to ignore you, we can agree to disagree. I do happen to agree strongly with you when you say "if you are happy with your body and goals and whatever you do, have at it." I also think, like you, 90% of what is out there is nonsense. To be fair I did react to your goading and I shouldn't have, for that I apologize.

You don't need to apologize for anything, my feathers aren't ever ruffled online. You look at things a lot differently in the sense of the obesity epidemic and the root of it, when I really don't care. I'm not fat, my fiance isn't fat, my dogs aren't fat, and I don't have kids. I can't control anything other than that.

Cad · Jul 30, 2013

You just need to make it part of your life to play a sport, go to the gym, hike, whatever, be active. Be more active, eat less bullshit. /thread

ubiquitrips · Jul 30, 2013

arkktheseaotter_sl said:
Honestly at your weight you could be eating 1 piece of pizza 3x per day and you would still lose weight, rapidly.

One thing I never get with people on these weird keto diets is if you insist on that, why they don't do something like Ultimate Diet 2.0. It's very low carb, and it is all structured around a carb load one day a week where you can eat 1000-1200g of carbs and you will still lose weight. I've done it, it works, and it isn't gimmicky(ie the coffee). You just deplete tue-fri, load sat, taper down sunday and monday. Jesus just thinking about all that food on one day gives me a boner.

Well, the first reason I haven't done it is that I haven't heard about it until right now. I will give it a look over. The current plan I am on has a 'carb day' but it isn't that high. I would be talking 100 - 200g for carbs on that day. Is the reason this one is more ok the fact that it has that carb day?

They recommend already being 12-15% body fat to begin this in the brief synopsis, that doesn't so much matter I take it? Well, matter as much as the current plan anyway.

Denaut · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
Well, the first reason I haven't done it is that I haven't heard about it until right now. I will give it a look over. The current plan I am on has a 'carb day' but it isn't that high. I would be talking 100 - 200g for carbs on that day. Is the reason this one is more ok the fact that it has that carb day?

They recommend already being 12-15% body fat to begin this in the brief synopsis, that doesn't so much matter I take it? Well, matter as much as the current plan anyway.

Bah, my bad, I meant his other bookThe Rapid Fat Loss Handbookwhich covers where you are now.

ubiquitrips · Jul 30, 2013

Denaut_sl said:
Bah, my bad, I meant his other bookThe Rapid Fat Loss Handbookwhich covers where you are now.

You guys are killing me, what makes this ok now?

On average, caloric intakes on this diet will come out to between 400 to 1200 calories per day coming almost exclusively from protein. For those of you familiar with ketogenic (low- carbohydrate, high-fat) diets, a PSMF is essentially a ketogenic diet without the dietary fat. Obviously, this will represent a fairly large caloric deficit; how large depending on your starting body weight and activity levels.

Dashel · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
They recommend already being 12-15% body fat to begin this in the brief synopsis, that doesn't so much matter I take it? Well, matter as much as the current plan anyway.

It matters, UD2 is not a good call right now for you imo. Also wanted to say dont over analyze things. Keep doing what your doing and eat good food. I'd say eat a bit more but again, dont over analyze. Find foods that are good for you and that you enjoy eating.

arkktheseaotter_sl · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
Well, the first reason I haven't done it is that I haven't heard about it until right now. I will give it a look over. The current plan I am on has a 'carb day' but it isn't that high. I would be talking 100 - 200g for carbs on that day. Is the reason this one is more ok the fact that it has that carb day?

They recommend already being 12-15% body fat to begin this in the brief synopsis, that doesn't so much matter I take it? Well, matter as much as the current plan anyway.

It isn't really "more ok" in any sense, I still don't think you need a keto diet. But if someone were to do keto and is diligent enough to follow a strict plan, because it's pretty in depth, it works period, and carb loading has been studied and also works, period.

For some people as long as they don't overdue it, a day of carb loading is motivation to make it through 3 and a half days of draining yourself, and it isn't really like you are killing yourself we are talking like 1500 calories or so. It's just using tricks kind of and the massive calorie intake one day a week is offset by the fact that you are totally depleted and it doesn't get stored as fat. A day like this according to Dr. Lustig would probably have you floating away like Dudley Dursley's aunt in the Prisoner of Azkaban, but hey it is what it is. Read up on it before you buy it, because it's very detailed and if you do it wrong it's kinda pointless. To me though as far as keto goes it's tried and true and isn't that bad. I've done it personally, I've also done Palumbo's(totally idiot guru) version like 7 years ago, and that also works.

Denaut · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
You guys are killing me, what makes this ok now?

On average, caloric intakes on this diet will come out to between 400 to 1200 calories per day coming almost exclusively from protein. For those of you familiar with ketogenic (low- carbohydrate, high-fat) diets, a PSMF is essentially a ketogenic diet without the dietary fat. Obviously, this will represent a fairly large caloric deficit; how large depending on your starting body weight and activity levels.

There is more to it than that, including cycling on and off the fast and different recommendations/techniques for larger people. The basic idea is if you are going to do a Keto diet (which I also don't think is necessary), then there are right and wrong ways to do it. Both books cover it but the latter is keto combined with a fast which works extremely quickly.

Gravel · Jul 30, 2013

Ubiquitrips_sl said:
You guys are killing me, what makes this ok now?

On average, caloric intakes on this diet will come out to between 400 to 1200 calories per day coming almost exclusively from protein. For those of you familiar with ketogenic (low- carbohydrate, high-fat) diets, a PSMF is essentially a ketogenic diet without the dietary fat. Obviously, this will represent a fairly large caloric deficit; how large depending on your starting body weight and activity levels.

It's not ok. It's retarded. If your only goal is fat loss, it'll work great. But that's thinking short term. If you really want to lose weight andkeepit off long term, you really need to consider what your diet is doing to your body long term. Eating 400 calories is absolutely going to cause you to lose weight. But you're going to end up healthier if you lose 1-2 pounds per week on something less extreme.

ubiquitrips · Jul 30, 2013

Elurin_sl said:
It's not ok. It's retarded. If your only goal is fat loss, it'll work great. But that's thinking short term. If you really want to lose weight andkeepit off long term, you really need to consider what your diet is doing to your body long term. Eating 400 calories is absolutely going to cause you to lose weight. But you're going to end up healthier if you lose 1-2 pounds per week on something less extreme.

That is what I was thinking. Overall I am happy with the weight loss so far. I would like to shoot for the 2-4 lbs per week and just watch that taper down as I lose the initial baggage.

Also, I do appreciate the input from everyone. Even if I don't go with anyone's specific ideas in particular, I do like being able to tap the collective experiences of everyone and hearing about things (Ultimate Diet, etc.) that I wouldn't have necessarily found otherwise.

McCheese · Jul 30, 2013

No truly overweight person who decides to get in shape ever does it "perfectly" in the beginning. For anyone who has been overweight for any extended length of time, it takes some experimentation and trial-and-error to figure out what works for you, your body, and your lifestyle. As long as you don't quit, continually try to educate yourself, are willing to listen to your body, look at your results (or lack thereof) and make adjustments, you'll eventually reach your goal.

spronk · Jul 30, 2013

Cad_sl said:
You just need to make it part of your life to play a sport, go to the gym, hike, whatever, be active. Be more active, eat less bullshit. /thread

you need to check your thin privilege at the door, mister and respect the fat acceptance movement

http://thisisthinprivilege.tumblr.com/

Eorkern · Jul 30, 2013

Poor fat people ! it's not their fault !

Gravel · Jul 30, 2013

I don't even...

Thin privilege is being able to post a photo of your body, full clothed, without having a fat fetish blog reblog it to a blog that is almost entirely pornography of fat women. Typically the blog is full of fat naked women mixed with other women such as myself who were simply posting an outfit photo. I can't post a photo of my clothes without someone being creepy and it's not fair. It's gross and I should be allowed to post my body without it being used as a fetish!

Wow, I should've kept reading. The one right after that is basically someone bitching about something, a thin person saying "that happens to skinny people too!" and then being told that no, in fact, just because it happens to skinny people it's still thin privlege because we hate you. Or something. I couldn't wade through the bullshit to figure out exactly why it's different somehow (oppression? yeah, fat oppression).

Weight Loss Thread

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