What vehicle do you drive?

Lanx

Lanx

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Lambourne said:
Electric car market globally is poor right now, or maybe it's more accurate to say that it's back to more down to Earth levels. The supply chain issues seem to be gone and the spike in demand from oil price surging in 2022 is over as well.

Pretty interesting site that tracks new/used prices for all Teslas in all markets. 2020 cars were selling for more than new in mid 2022, prices have come down a ton.

tesla-info.com

2020 Model Y Long Range AWD Depreciation in US

2020 Tesla Model Y Long Range AWD values based on real depreciation curves in US
tesla-info.com tesla-info.com

View attachment 528941

Even over here where the market is much friendlier towards EVs prices have dropped way down. People were asking 55-60k+ for a 2018 Model S in 2022, already a 4-5 year old car with probably over 100k KM on it at that time. It was madness, same money would get you in a brand new BMW 5 series at the time. Not a particularly high spec one, but still. Premium car with factory warranty and all that.

View attachment 528943
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byd (the china tesla) is more of a laughing stock, fenders are falling off and theyre calling it a feature
 
Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

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I think some of the thing is perception. The S and X have been effectively seen and prices as lux cars - the Y and 3 are not - but still "thought of" in the same light.

I guess that is my shock, having only driven my Mach-E, and co workers S and X - the 3 was like, whoa...its an electric civic...not a small "S" as in a small lux car.

There is nothing "wrong" with it, and heck 35k a decent choice as its tech is still tesla tech that is well beyond anyone else.

Again, there would be no real EV market without Tesla and there was no "Tesla" without Musk. The dude made the brand even if he didnt start it.


Lucid I do not think is going to make it, or at least, not make it in the way they want- they may not go Fiksar and go under...but I do not see them flourishing into a full brand.

Rivian however, I think they will make it. It really hinges on how much they can get the R2 and R3 out there and really sell them. Just like Tesla, the X and S are not their $$, the Y and 3 are their sellers- they sell very few X and S overall... and Rivian, the R1's are just too expensive, they are super nice, but, they need the money maker.

If I had to just pick and R1T, F150 Lightning, or CyberTruck, it would be a R1T
 
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ToeMissile

ToeMissile

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Speaking of Tesla/cybertruck, these guys teamed up with Car & Driver and Engineering Explained:

 
Mizake

Mizake

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Siliconemelons said:
If I had to just pick and R1T, F150 Lightning, or CyberTruck, it would be a R1T
Click to expand...

I would pick the R1T also, it's not even close. I'm not a fan of the Cybertruck.

That being said, Cybertruck sales are double that of R1T. Which isn't saying much, because both sales figures are abyssmal. But Rivian really needs a car that they can produce at volume if they wish to survive. Will that be the R2 or R3? Maybe. They don't have much runway left, so it's kind of a race against time to get the new model out. If they run out of money before they can release the R2, they're in trouble. If the R2 only sells like the R1T, they're in trouble. They need the R2 to sell at least as well as Tesla's model X and S. Will they? Time will tell, but the EV market is getting more crowded all the time.

Again, I'm a big fan of the R1T, but I'm not going to buy into a company that may not exist in 5 years, or may get bought out by another bigger company and all my warranties, etc. may be altered. Plus who knows how expensive parts and repairs will be if the product line gets discontinued because the new owners find value in the technology but not necessarily the current product. Imagine if you bought a Fisker the first time around, or you were dumb enough to buy a FIsker the second time around.
 
Kobayashi

Kobayashi

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Lanx said:
byd (the china tesla) is more of a laughing stock, fenders are falling off and theyre calling it a feature
Click to expand...
Have a link? Sounds like something I'd enjoy laughing at. Only thing I saw from a google search sounded like a prototype vehicle.

Edit: grammar
 
RobXIII

RobXIII

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Siliconemelons said:
I think some of the thing is perception. The S and X have been effectively seen and prices as lux cars - the Y and 3 are not - but still "thought of" in the same light.

I guess that is my shock, having only driven my Mach-E, and co workers S and X - the 3 was like, whoa...its an electric civic...not a small "S" as in a small lux car.

There is nothing "wrong" with it, and heck 35k a decent choice as its tech is still tesla tech that is well beyond anyone else.

Again, there would be no real EV market without Tesla and there was no "Tesla" without Musk. The dude made the brand even if he didnt start it.


Lucid I do not think is going to make it, or at least, not make it in the way they want- they may not go Fiksar and go under...but I do not see them flourishing into a full brand.

Rivian however, I think they will make it. It really hinges on how much they can get the R2 and R3 out there and really sell them. Just like Tesla, the X and S are not their $$, the Y and 3 are their sellers- they sell very few X and S overall... and Rivian, the R1's are just too expensive, they are super nice, but, they need the money maker.

If I had to just pick and R1T, F150 Lightning, or CyberTruck, it would be a R1T
Click to expand...

People shit on Tesla because it's trendy. Every single friend and family that owns a tesla loves it, full stop. That said, if someone rear ends you, or something needs to be replaced you are in for a world of hurt on pricey parts, availability or both. Hertz gambled and lost with Tesla, because of the parts issue being amplified by how shitty people treat rentals.

Rivian probably won't go bankrupt.

Lucid probably will

Fisker is RIGHT out (insurance won't even cover these, there are zero spare parts).

tl;dr would buy a Tesla again, but only an S or X because I'm spoiled.
 
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Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

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My 3 is a hertz… its steering wheel is delaminating and its a 22, both people i knew that had a 3 and one a 3 and a Y their steering wheels delaminated in the first year or so.

My cousin had a 3 performance and traded it for a Tundra lol… he is an odd cat. He didn’t have his that long, 8 mo or so.
 
Burren

Burren

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Tholan said:
Love when people are talking shit on how tesla are shitty cars, while driving a shitty Peugeot with the same engine as my lawnmower. Most engines are shitty anyway, built by accountants in an excel sheet, the marketing team tag a few stupid name such as "blue tech" "EcoPowerDrive" etc. , and then people defends that. Those engines should be replaced by electric motors, so we can have some nice V6 or V8.
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Every single flat 6 is a masterpiece.
 
Cad

Cad

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Siliconemelons said:
My 3 is a hertz… its steering wheel is delaminating and its a 22, both people i knew that had a 3 and one a 3 and a Y their steering wheels delaminated in the first year or so.

My cousin had a 3 performance and traded it for a Tundra lol… he is an odd cat. He didn’t have his that long, 8 mo or so.
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I have a 2019 M3P and the steering wheel is fine? Certainly not delaminating or peeling anything. I've had it since new.
 
CaughtCross

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Siliconemelons said:
Rivian however, I think they will make it. It really hinges on how much they can get the R2 and R3 out there and really sell them. Just like Tesla, the X and S are not their $$, the Y and 3 are their sellers- they sell very few X and S overall... and Rivian, the R1's are just too expensive, they are super nice, but, they need the money maker.

If I had to just pick and R1T, F150 Lightning, or CyberTruck, it would be a R1T
Click to expand...

I dont see how Rivian makes it with losing money every time they sell a vehicle. With Tesla cutting prices and EV sales slowing there does not appear to be an easy path to profitability for them.

 
Burns

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Cad said:
I have a 2019 M3P and the steering wheel is fine? Certainly not delaminating or peeling anything. I've had it since new.
Click to expand...
Have you tried covering your hands in brake cleaner every time you get in the car and start driving?
 
Lambourne

Lambourne

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Most steering wheel damage comes from people wearing rings, particularly squarish ones with an edge on it. It's a soft surface, scraping a metal thing over it tens of thousands of times is going to wear it out.
 
Valderen

Valderen

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My biggest issue with Tesla is pretty minor and totally a personal thing but at the same time it’s a deal breaker for me and that’s the iPad thing, I’m old school and I like having information in front of me, and I like physical buttons for a lot of things. Other than that I don’t have issues with Tesla, not the best looking cars but not the ugliest either…uninspired would be my way to describe them. The tech is second to none though, every other ev is still playing catch up on this front.

EV is still some time away for me as I bought a new car 1 year ago, and EV was out of the question as my condo voted against installing chargers and I am not going to own an ev without being able to charge at home, and I’m not moving. :)

Going to enjoy my Genesis GV70 for another 5-6 years and EV market should be mature enough by then for me to make the switch and condo should have chargers by them, pretty sure it will be mandatory for them to have at least a few.
 
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Lambourne

Lambourne

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Tesla is idiosyncratic and while some of that is good, some of it is also questionable. Like the removal of wiper/turn signal stalks. It's really just a stupid choice because no one will buy the car specifically because it hasn't got a turn signal stalk, and thousands of potential customers will be annoyed by it to the point that they will go buy something else instead. Save $5 per car to lose thousands of sales, it's just stupid.

Thankfully it's getting some pushback from the European car safety regulator already (they've announced that they will start docking points on cars that do not have physical controls for wipers, blinkers etc) and I suspect the stalks will start reappearing on Teslas within a year or two.
 
Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

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Rivian losing money is the same as when Tesla did. It is a hard hump to get over.

Rivian is a better product than its ultra lux Lucid- they are often compared because they each kinda popped up at the same time.

Rivian has been opening new “centers” or whatever and production spun down on the 1s to start prep of the 2 so- them getting those going, and at volume will be a big turn.

Lucid just is treading water, anything other than their air is just a pipe dream, all they got out now is a blacked out version, yay.

If both lucid and Rivian died tomorrow and tesla could buy them, i see them buying Rivian in an instant, but lucid…not so much, the air and the s just overlap so much, while the R1T and 1S are very different from the X and cyber truck.

This is my hertz m3 steering wheel…
 

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Palum

Palum

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I saw my first Air in the wild yesterday. At least I think so, because it's pretty forgettable honestly. I'm sure it's nice inside or whatever but it's not anything that stands out, much like seeing an e class or something.
 
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