Rogosh
Lord Nagafen Raider
- 894
- 230
Yeah just shows how rather unhardcore I am now. I would rather watch game of thrones etc on sunday vs. raiding.
World of Warcraft: Current Year
- Thread starter hodj
- Start date
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
- 37,961
- 14,508
It doesn't even matter anyways, every mythic guild I've ever heard of right now is bleeding members and constantly recruiting undergeared people. The day is mostly irrelevant. Get warm bodies in there before the guild breaks up
SorrowsEnd
Trakanon Raider
- 1,469
- 797
Blizzard needs to realize the Mythic model is killing high end raiding.
Remove the silly same server restriction and allow 10-30 man flex like normal and heroic.
Remove the silly same server restriction and allow 10-30 man flex like normal and heroic.
- 3,389
- 141
Honestly, we'd be in a better spot too had they not done that dumb iLVL increase. I know at least for us in a night where we're forced to pug a mythic tank, we would certainly have a much easier time outgearing the mythic HM fights rather than wiping to the point of frustration in BRF.
Xexx
Vyemm Raider
- 7,469
- 1,663
Same, as soon as we started our Mythic kills it seems ppl just started dropping left and right. TBH Mythic isnt very fun, its not entirely hard but i cant say its an enjoyable experience in any sense. I suppose if youre racing then it has some excitement but if youre just doing typical progression its like whatever.
Koushirou
Log Wizard
- 4,959
- 12,569
The same server restriction needs to go, definitely. Making it flex however is bad idea. The whole reason they set mythic to 20man and only 20man is so that the tuning can be done more properly. You would not get the same experience and consistent difficulty with a flex model. Not until they're confident tightly tuning flex so that its difficulty isn't changing with varying numbers of people. A very basic example is a mechanic that forces the raid to spread. If both a 10man and 30man raid handle this mechanic in the same size room, it will be trivial for one group and more difficult for the other, relatively.
Actually its Sub or Combat these days. Sub is best when you're role is to max single target dps. Combat shines for the multi-target fights.
Tarisk
Pathetic Reaction Bot
- 1,568
- 370
Honestly, I enjoy Mythic when Heroic was on farm on week one. There's no challenge whatsoever to heroic, so Mythic is the only real option. What I dislike is the difficulty gap between the two is so extreme that on some fights, even any MINOR mistakes costs severely. As a hunter for example, have to make sure I misdirect all the pack beasts to keep them clumped on the tank so they can be dropped fast by aoe. I get focused on making sure I see the pack coming and not miss the MD, he sometimes likes to time a pin down at the same time. and I may just look away for a second and that's when I'm the one targeted. It costs the raid a ridiculous amount of raid DPS to break me out of it that could have been much better spent on the boss and adds both. And up until mythic, i was never once hit by pin down.
That's just a little example. Later ones may be Thogar where the trains come at random/faster, new trains, etc. And ranged has to be sure to be away from melee except in rare situations when you're dancing between two trains almost near the doors. Time it wrong in most cases and you can drop a prototype grenade on the melee which does a stupid amount of damage, or the train hits the ranged trying to prevent not having that happen due to said bad timing. Can also be caused by tank positioning being off a few yards.
I think the more mechanics (that are sometimes just awesome) part of mythic makes it fun. The extreme jump in damage and change to margin of error is what kills that fun. There should be a middle ground somewhere.
Whatever they did back in WoTLK with difficulty with ToTC(not zone design)/ICC was good up through Cata(foh raiding kinda went away with MOP so no opinion on that). The hard modes were challenging and took some time to learn, but were a lot more forgiving.
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I think the flex model is way too good that it makes mythic locked in 20 man complete shit in this day and age. I understand the balance issue, but the current model is the lazy route from the devs. It feels like Heroic is right on the money for balance. Why not working hard to make this work for mythic instead of you know, more patches of new garrison shit made by interns?
Proof is in the numbers, guilds are crumbling, even top end guilds that came from a 10 man environment. Mythic guilds across the board are bleeding people like I've never seen before. I can count how many nights we've had 18 or 19 on, or less people during the holidays, and mythic is a no go. Coming from a 10 man raiding guild that cleared all of SOO heroic before it was trivial, the logistics of keeping a 20 man mythic ready roster (so 25 or so) in a game that offers nothing for players outside of raid is a complete nightmare.
Proof is in the numbers, guilds are crumbling, even top end guilds that came from a 10 man environment. Mythic guilds across the board are bleeding people like I've never seen before. I can count how many nights we've had 18 or 19 on, or less people during the holidays, and mythic is a no go. Coming from a 10 man raiding guild that cleared all of SOO heroic before it was trivial, the logistics of keeping a 20 man mythic ready roster (so 25 or so) in a game that offers nothing for players outside of raid is a complete nightmare.
Rime
<Donor>
- 2,638
- 1,613
This right here.
I like the flex system, but feel that Mythic as a whole is a complete failure of an experiment and hope it is squashed/changed in the next expansion.
I enjoy the difficulty of the fights, but keeping that many people interested when there is next to nothing to do outside of logging on for raids makes it an exercise in futility, particularly on a small/low population server.
Gorehack
Lord Nagafen Raider
- 1,534
- 40
Completely agree. I am for final bosses being difficult, but if your shit leading up to that final boss is murdering the morale of your end game playerbase...you're doing something wrong with tuning.
Dandai
<WoW Guild Officer>
- 5,908
- 4,483
I'm torn on this. My immediate reaction is "mythic content isn't targetting a wide audience," but it seems like there's quite a few of you (who are presumably the target audience for mythic raiding) saying that the difficulty as a whole isn't fun. Personally, I'm fine with mythic the way it is now. Guilds are always going to churn, and the highest churn will be during vacation times when people step away and reevaluate their priorities.
I stopped mythic raiding with the guild I co-created because the other leader was a piece of shit. I gave a classy exit and wished them well. When the next raid came up a week later, dudebro proves how much of a piece of shit he is by telling the raid leader he and his girlfriend were playing FF14 now and wouldn't be raiding any more... 15 minutes prior to raid start. When word got back to me a couple weeks later I tried to get back in but they had scooped up some top tier people to replace us (I would've played ret and they got a ret that ranks 97+ percentile in every fight GG).
To make a long story short, I want to be raiding mythic, but nobody else on my server raids during agreeable times. I guess I'm just gonna have to server transfer.
I stopped mythic raiding with the guild I co-created because the other leader was a piece of shit. I gave a classy exit and wished them well. When the next raid came up a week later, dudebro proves how much of a piece of shit he is by telling the raid leader he and his girlfriend were playing FF14 now and wouldn't be raiding any more... 15 minutes prior to raid start. When word got back to me a couple weeks later I tried to get back in but they had scooped up some top tier people to replace us (I would've played ret and they got a ret that ranks 97+ percentile in every fight GG).
To make a long story short, I want to be raiding mythic, but nobody else on my server raids during agreeable times. I guess I'm just gonna have to server transfer.
- 3,389
- 141
I think properly tuned flex Mythic would probably be better than the static group size. Even if it wasn't 10-30. Make it 18-22 and tune for that. Just give us the ability to roll out on a night where one guy can't make it or a couple guys from the bench are online with nothing to do. That's a much better option than needing 20 people to coordinate schedules with a few others that aren't actually on the roster that are ok with subbing. There really isn't a ton of give here at all.
I'd be content with just allowing cross server Mythic only though, which has no balance concerns just makes pugging a couple no show spots infinitely easier.
I'd be content with just allowing cross server Mythic only though, which has no balance concerns just makes pugging a couple no show spots infinitely easier.
Kuro
Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
- 8,407
- 21,416
Going from 10 (no bench) to 20 (+bench) and the attendant rise of drama queens/trying to find 13-15 good players that didn't have horrendous personalities killed my guild. Flex Mythic would have been much appreciated.
Going from server first guild to "can't even enter the difficulty mode this week because we keep having mini-social-collapses triggered by new members which puts us below the required #" sucked pretty hard, and managed to get half of the old raid core to quit the game, which further increased the attendance issues, since the old Raid Core were the folks that never missed a night (thus the no bench for the 10m).
Doesn't help that there seems to be an abundance of competent Melee players, and low-caps on the # of them you can bring to each fight without fucking yourself, which makes recruiting a pain.
Going from server first guild to "can't even enter the difficulty mode this week because we keep having mini-social-collapses triggered by new members which puts us below the required #" sucked pretty hard, and managed to get half of the old raid core to quit the game, which further increased the attendance issues, since the old Raid Core were the folks that never missed a night (thus the no bench for the 10m).
Doesn't help that there seems to be an abundance of competent Melee players, and low-caps on the # of them you can bring to each fight without fucking yourself, which makes recruiting a pain.
- 5,445
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Kreugen
Vyemm Raider
- 6,599
- 793
Heroic Blackhand progression night again, fuck yeah! So fucking hyped!
(holy fuck stop missing your mark / hitting mines / getting punted off the side / bombing each other / letting the hunter who is both kiting every siege and doing your top damage die slowly to impale in p3 when not even slagged and all his massive cooldowns that can practically solo the phase are running / hey another 5% Fuck You / how the fuck do people die in phase 1 / etc)
Of course, if we do kill him, we'll essentially be done because lol @ getting back to a 20 man in this churn.
The sad thing is at this point I'm only playing so I can still have a guild when new content is released because I know if I stop playing the cycle will just repeat again in a few months because I have so few social outlets that I can't stay away. And every other MMO is shit, I've tried that road.
(holy fuck stop missing your mark / hitting mines / getting punted off the side / bombing each other / letting the hunter who is both kiting every siege and doing your top damage die slowly to impale in p3 when not even slagged and all his massive cooldowns that can practically solo the phase are running / hey another 5% Fuck You / how the fuck do people die in phase 1 / etc)
Of course, if we do kill him, we'll essentially be done because lol @ getting back to a 20 man in this churn.
The sad thing is at this point I'm only playing so I can still have a guild when new content is released because I know if I stop playing the cycle will just repeat again in a few months because I have so few social outlets that I can't stay away. And every other MMO is shit, I've tried that road.
Sabbat
Trakanon Raider
- 1,834
- 760
We put down Heroic Blackhand for the first time tonight. We're close to getting the 20 for Mythic, but we've got a few carries.
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
SorrowsEnd
Trakanon Raider
- 1,469
- 797
I have been guild hopping every few weeks/months as they slowly explode due to issues with mythic raids and keeping the good raiders happy.
Current group is like hey you can be the new main tank. You know all the fights on mythic as a tank perfectly right after doing them once as a dps the week before? We are going 8/10M tonight and you better handle all mechanics flawlessly.
Ummmmm....NOPE!