Palum
what Suineg set it to
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World of Warcraft: Current Year
- Thread starter hodj
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j00t
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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That's the debate, isn't it?
"We didn't design Argus for flying" is the reason. "Why not?" is the rebuttal. That's what is missing.
"We wanted it to be immersive" - bullshit
"We wanted it out faster" - ok
"You don't need it" - fuck off
j00t
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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those really aren't the reasons, those really aren't what theyve said.
what they have repeatedly said from the beginning is that it was a mistake. it DOES take us away from world. it DOES significantly reduce the amount of time it takes to go through content. it DOES trivialize a HUGE majority of content. we DON'T need it.
don't get me wrong, i love it. but like whoever it was that said it, 85% of my flying time is as a safe afk.
what they have repeatedly said from the beginning is that it was a mistake. it DOES take us away from world. it DOES significantly reduce the amount of time it takes to go through content. it DOES trivialize a HUGE majority of content. we DON'T need it.
don't get me wrong, i love it. but like whoever it was that said it, 85% of my flying time is as a safe afk.
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Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Flying takes us away from the world? Right... I'm no longer playing the game because I'm just flying around! K.
Flying significantly reduces the amount of time it takes to go through content? I was done with the new Argus content within 2 hours both weeks new content was released. Flying means shit all to lengthening content consumption in any meaningful way. The only time that matters is at the beginning of an expansion where there is actually a lot of content to consume.
Flying trivializes a huge majority of content? What the fuck is hard about running around on the ground? Flying is a convenience, it doesn't "trivialize" anything. Getting dazed while I run through shit doesn't make it hard, it just makes it annoying.
The justifications are deflections. There is no logic behind the reasoning. They want to deflect from the fact that there is nothing new to do for more than an hour or two no matter what and all it does it speed up dev time.
Flying significantly reduces the amount of time it takes to go through content? I was done with the new Argus content within 2 hours both weeks new content was released. Flying means shit all to lengthening content consumption in any meaningful way. The only time that matters is at the beginning of an expansion where there is actually a lot of content to consume.
Flying trivializes a huge majority of content? What the fuck is hard about running around on the ground? Flying is a convenience, it doesn't "trivialize" anything. Getting dazed while I run through shit doesn't make it hard, it just makes it annoying.
The justifications are deflections. There is no logic behind the reasoning. They want to deflect from the fact that there is nothing new to do for more than an hour or two no matter what and all it does it speed up dev time.
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lindz
#DDs
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Yup, I can see it now. Couldn't see them last night for some reason. Maybe it had to do with the character boost or who knows. But damn that was like 3/4 of a level for doing the invasions in a single zone.
McCheese
SW: Sean, CW: Crone, GW: Wizardhawk
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Flying doesn't take us out of the world. That's stupid. When I'm soaring around in the sky I feel amazing, especially with the massively increased view distance. It makes me feel like a hero and a bad ass, as it should.
Blizzard is stupid and anyone who works there and is reading this should feel bad.
Blizzard is stupid and anyone who works there and is reading this should feel bad.
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Zaphid
Trakanon Raider
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It makes it close to impossible to design challenging open world content, unless you stick it underground or put up some dismounting gimmick that will break half the time anyway. 'Member all those dangerous zones in vanilla ? Yeah, flying makes them pointless. Granted, that might be because most people had only 60% speed which made getting dazed much easier, but it does make the world trivial. It is great convenience that is fun to use, since everybody likes to go fast, but it makes it harder for designers to do their job. However, the designers need to respect players' time, making 10 seconds tasks take 20 seconds for no good reason is not it. That shit adds up fast.
Ukerric
Bearded Ape
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And that's pretty much why flying is "needed". I can understand why running thru Commonlands and Kithicor took time, but I was going to spend an hour or two at HHK.
Now, you're making me run round and round, up and down, until my objective. Which I kill, then run back 30s later. Ok, 2mn later because I had to wait for the repop.
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You say challenging... but do you mean jumping puzzles? Obviously you don't mean open-world fights...
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Haha so I'm in an invasion and my doorbell rings just as the final boss spawns. I go to answer it before I can hit him once and come back and obviously he's dead... and I can't loot. Tried zoning out and back in, relogging, etc, nope. Oh well I guess.
j00t
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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here's the thing. challenging is a subjective term. but if i'm a quest designer, i have to create a certain level of challenge. whether that's mob density, mob health, mob damage potential, whatever. if i'm creating that challenge with no flight ability involved, i can include distance traveled as part of that challenge. how far is it? what's the likelihood of the player running into an enemy mob? what's the likelihood of the player running into an elite mob? if the quest is just to "retrieve rune of superoverpoweredness, then all the player has to do is fly directly to it, land, pick it up, fly away. it absolutely trivializes that entire quest. if the player can't fly, they have to be a whole lot more tactical about their route, about what mobs they are able to kill and what they aren't. sure, of course we're all captains of our football team so we can play and jerk off at the same time, but WE are not the majority.
j00t
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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i THINK it doesn't matter if you hit him? i mean, i was healing and i didn't hit him. i don't think the corpse was lootable, i think it just spawns crap in your bag
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You keep bringing up stuff that is trivialized by class abilities and/or the current player level/ilevel... I don't think about paths or density as a rogue, ambush the quest mob, and kill everything that aggros. Range classes tap it from far away because these aren't chained. Random people in Argus literally do that all the time. I watch any tank class start an encounter with a rare (that has 100M+ hp) without a thought in the world.
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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My warlock can solo anything on Argus. Pretty sure my monk can too. Mobs aren't even a concern. I just run to my destination and kill anything that wasn't leashed. It's lazy design
Aaron
Goonsquad Officer
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Just got my first two legendaries within 5 minutes of each other tonight. First one dropped from the end boss (the water lady) of that Valor raid (LFR), the second came from the goodie box from finishing four world quests in Stormheim.
The thing is, I thought you could equip two legendaries, but for some reason I can only have one. Is there a quest or something you need to do to be able to equip two?
The thing is, I thought you could equip two legendaries, but for some reason I can only have one. Is there a quest or something you need to do to be able to equip two?
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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Rime
<Donor>
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With Order Halls, you can still make a nice chunk of change with an army of alts. I get an average of one gold Mission per character, per day. If you 200% it, that is 1500+600-1000 gold for doing nothing.
EDIT: This is, of course, half/quarter of what you could do with a well set up garrison. But still better than nothing.
EDIT: This is, of course, half/quarter of what you could do with a well set up garrison. But still better than nothing.
