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Vanguard and EQ1 have pretty horrible cash shops (don't know about EQ2). But they were pasted onto sub games and they are still evolving. Better than they use to be but still just a way to force people to sub. DCUO and PS2 have much better cash shops, especially PS2 since it was built to be F2P...

15 minutes? Like I said, you obviously have never played any of it. If you don't like the content that's one thing, but to have never played it and then call it nonexistent is really sad. Don't even understand what you are trying to accomplish here unless it's just to troll us. Everybody who...

You are only listing the permanent zones and dungeons. You conveniently don't list all the temporary content that comes too. And the jumping puzzles etc. (I can guarantee you didn't do the Halloween jumping puzzle in 30 min). Much of the content is holiday / special events that also had dungeons...

If you actually played the game then you would understand what is going on. I'm not going to list it, frankly it's just too much to look up. Really, it's a ton. Every 3 or 4 weeks their has been new content in the form of temporary or permanent updates. Almost all of them included new dungeons...

Come on. Draegan understood what I meant and so did you. If you want to call me out for bad wording then fine, my bad.

Wrong again. You really need to pay attention the game you are trashing. They produce and release more content than any other mmo. I have given up trying to keep up with it there is so much. It's already been more than an expansions' worth if you played it all. And their bug fixes have been very...

/shrug DAoC is still available to play. It still has subs and hasn't resorted to F2P. Yes, it is also very long in the tooth, but nobody has yet made a game better for it's kind of PvP. And as good as EvE is, I still prefer DAoC's combat and action. Recent mmos (GW2), and upcoming mmos...

DAoC is still up and running. It is one of the most respected PvP mmorpg's ever made.

That is the main reason why open world mmo PvP almost always fails. Levels and gear trump skill in most mmo pvp and it encourages the worst kind of human behavior. That isn't an issue in instanced battlegrounds, since the game forces players of similar gear and levels together. But in open world...

I'm curious UT, in what way do you win if you give GW2's cash shop money? The only thing I ever spent cash on was an extra character slot at release. Ever since then I have converted my extra gold into gems and bought extra bank space. If there is an item in the cash shop I should be getting so...

Bah, I was hooked like a f'ing idiot fish and watched that.

It was a pve server, we just didnt' have any interference from GM's because it was consensual FFA. Trains and all. The rotations never worked so the GM's gave up trying to police us. But as you say, even that refutes qwerty's post.

You never played on a FFA server. There isn't a script ever written that compares to the tactics of another guild trying to steal your raid boss (or visa versa).

Heh. The harshness that EQ put on melee for certain things was one of it charms imo. I was stuck in a Velious dragon dungeon wing for 3 days once because I crashed during the raid and was stuck at the foot of the named, with nobody able to get to me. It's been a long time so not sure why I was...

It wasn't as bad as you think. Even back then my career kept me very busy, and my girlfriend (fiance at the time) also made demands. After reaching max level, most of my time in game was raiding. We did have a 5 night a week mandatory raid schedule but I logged on 10 minutes before and logged...

Lol, true. But I still want to compete with other guilds to fight for the right to kill the best mob. It's much more fun then dealing with the craptastic scripted AI that has always been, and always will be, a snoozefest. If it were my game, I would separate top end raid mobs into 3 types of...

Yes.

Yes, technically it is. It has numerous advantages that are better than the instanced dungeon lobby game usually associated with the term. But there are a lot of problems too. It is a great way to even out the populations in lower level zones when a game is first released. Aion did this but...

He is mistaken, you can't buy any stat gear from the cash shop. And you can't buy any of the best gear with gold converted from gems.You have to grind for it.And even the best gear that you grind for has pathetically small stat differences compared to the cheap and easy gear. You don't need...

I'm not going to get into it, it's not that important. If you understand what I'm talking about then great. My original point was that quality matters in games as much as basic design. I just used WoW to illustrate that point. I was also refuting the notion that todays kids are somehow...

Nobody thinks EQ is like UO. So the evolution has nothing to do with it. The Blizzard devs blatantly copied much of EQ's basic design. Hats off to them, it worked.

Have them play a bunch of other mmos, then drop them into EQ (up to PoP). Most players will see the similarities in a very short time.

Well if you don't see it, it's not that big a deal. It's not gonna change the taste of my Cheerios.

You are focused too much on minor details. I'm talking about the over feel of the games and the basic design elements. Of course there are differences, otherwise WoW wouldn't have become the hit it is. But if you look at WoW from a design perspective you can see everything the devs ripped...

Vanilla WoW 4 or 5 years ago was my point of reference (just before WotLK). It felt more like EQ than any other mmo I've ever played, and I've played a ton of them. Even Vanguard didn't give me that same sense of deja vu. WoW's expansions took it in another direction, and I have no idea what WoW...

No, he's correct. If you overlook the graphics and just focus on the basic gameplay. Vanilla WoW was very much a EQ clone (with WarHammer's lore). I was late to WoW, after leaving EQ I played a bunch of mmo's before trying WoW. And my very first impression (after throwing up over the...

Yep. That about covers it. You can't buy the best gear with gold, since you still have to grind dungeons and other things for it. But you can buy gear almost as good. Pretty standard cash shop. And I understand your point. You just haven't taken your argument to it's logical conclusion is my...

GW2's shop does not sell any gear that has stats. XP pots are just another way to eliminate grind, so is buying gold. It's all the same in the end, time = money. Since you have taken the extreme position already then you need to be against XP pots too.

Yeah. Well good luck with that. Like I said the vast majority of players are fine with xp pots and buying gold from the company that makes the game. That isn't going to change, no matter what you do or say.

UT if you call GW2's cash shop P2W then you are calling ALL cash shops P2W. It's that simple. And then you have to expand your argument to include all F2P games and some sub games. Since most sub games have cash shops now that offer xp pots. Even WoW will soon. In some sense most cash shops...

People don't change. Calling the kid's "different" does make you all sound old though. The basic desires we all have are part of human nature. If EQ Classic was redone with modern graphics and some basic updates (ui, etc), it's success or failure would be determined by how well it was done...

I found the AoC vids to be boring and cheesy. Which is true of most gameplay videos. WoW is another great example of crappy video gameplay needing hands on to judge. You can't get the feel of how reactive and smooth WoW is without playing it. I don't like WoW much but I have to admit the...

Not at all, judge whatever you want. But judging a game based on a crappy video of the starting area is not a very good idea. AoC comes to mind. Videos of the starting area in AoC sucked but actually playing it was fun. It was the rest of the game that was so lacking at launch. That is why I...

It's a poor video mainly because the guy who did it mostly showed the least interesting things about an mmo, character creation and the first 3 minutes of the starting area. Yawn. Plus its recorded with a ton of compression at very low quality. Show me something outside of the starting area...

I agree with much of the rest of your post but this is false. Star Trek Online is doing very well. EaB was interesting but had very short term appeal for me. And I loved EQ. Forgot all the reasons I gave up on the game, it's been a long time. But I do remember getting bored with it fairly...

I was playing Earth and Beyond just before EvE released. Everyone in EaB talked constantly about moving to EvE. And once it was released everyone pretty much did. EaB shut down not long after that. EaB was a PvE focused mmo that really wasn't done that well. A lot of people don't remember but...

It's a shame that the combat is so over the top with hotbar bloat. I prefer EQ but there are some fun aspects to EQ2. A lot of it was with things like housing. Not sure why but I actually enjoyed EQ2's version of housing, which in other games I couldn't care less about. Exploring the zones...

He's feeling bad and asking for help. I don't have a problem with it. It's not like it happens every day, and he isn't a new poster. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt and hold the cynicism for once.

I can see that. GW1's cosmetic gear was the point of the endgame and almost all of it was acquired in game. I liked that model better than GW2's gear progression model, even if the stat increases are minimal. GW2's cosmetic gear isn't as appealing as GW1's imo, so I tend to not care as much...

Well, none of the items in the store have stats. All the GW2 store does is eliminate some of the grind by having xp boosts and allowing you to convert gems to gold. Which is a pretty basic offering in almost all cash shops. Using gold can eliminate some of the grind for the some of the best...