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I question how realistic this scenario is in today's industry. Seriously, if the dev team hasn't taken the time up front to do their due diligence and vette the best, most optimal long term revenue model for their MMO, then that game is a piece of shit and one you don't want to be playing anyway.

From the VR website FAQ at Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen - Game - FAQs PAYMENT MODEL 15.0 What is Pantheon's revenue model? Will the game be Pay to Play, Free to Play, Freemium, or What? We are considering either using the traditional subscription based model or a model where the player buys the...

I'd argue that if you're designing a cash shop just to sell vanity pets, that's a seriously low return feature that will still warrant dev time that could be spent elsewhere. The payoff just won't be there to make it worthwhile. Maybe I'm wrong and the majority of the players out there love...

I should've been more clear. I'm fine with cosmetics, just not through a cash shop. Just make everything a drop in-game and make them tradeable so as to help create player economy using in-game currency, not RL currency. That's the model to use for a game like this.

Great example here. Take that same classic EQ scenario but imagine if Verant/Sony had a cash shop and one of the items available for purchase was a cosmetic skin that added flames to your sword. Tell me you wouldn't be pissed knowing that it cheapened your accomplishment of finishing the Paly...

So many things in this post I personally disagree with but only highlighting a few. For starters, stepping outside the genre negates any debate already. Secondly, a cash shop ruins the game because of the very mindset you just stated, not in spite of it. Getting shit quicker through a cash...

One can make this argument either way. I'm not suggesting the payment model is the sole reason people decide which games to play but it does certainly have an affect on the way said games are designed, which ultimately does influence that same decision. For example, if I'm looking for a new MMO...

From what I've read and heard, this sounds very close to what the VR team is planning for Pantheon.

I don't disagree. The AA tree design has been done numerous times in other games and as stated, in almost every iteration that I saw, it created it's own share of balancing problems. Besides, that system seems to go against the overall design of original EQ to begin with (i.e., each class being...

I always felt this probably had a lot to do with how quickly skills, spells, abilities were mudflated between classic and Velious. As we all know, Brad and team had no idea that they would be laying the groundwork back then for a 20+ year game but by the time they released Velious, we already...

I always had similar thoughts regarding the AA system. Design the system to truly be a tree that allowed path specialization, not to simply obtain all of them over time. The possibilities seemed intriguing but I also saw significant balancing issues with that route as well. For example, let's...

Hell, it will be good to log into an MMO and actually have reasons just to chat with people again.

Partly why their mantra of situational use items has me intrigued. There is a lot of potential there to design items in a way that makes sense While forcing the player to make choices. I'm still expecting something fairly rudimentary from them in this area but like I said, the potential is there.

Totally agree. Timesinks and grinding are the name of the game with a design such as this. Grinding on grays is shit but as long as the grind is actually meaningful beyond the intended item, such as XP gain and/or the possibility of other loot upgrades while keying, then I'm perfectly fine with...

It will be interesting to see how the VR team handles the "end game" for Pantheon. I know they say the game will be focused on the group game with a sprinkle of solo + raid content, but that's easy to say when everyone is still level 1. At some point, the majority of players will be max level...

He did utilize FD to split some mobs IIRC, but it's hard to tell exactly how the mobs behaved. And while he may be bad, I'll give him a bit of a pass due to the circumstances of simultaneously trying to conduct a stream while playing. This is exactly what I'm referring to in my previous...

Good grief! Been playing this game for less than a year and the community is absolutely fucking terrible. So many players who seemingly log in on a daily basis just to shit on the game and/or Trion. I don't get it. If you hate the fucking game, why log in and play. The game has its issues and...

But will they truly be unsanitized or will the dev team impose restrictions on them in some way, shape, or form in an effort to create balance? I have no doubt that things like Feign Death splitting or quad-kiting will be in-game (we already know the former is from the last stream). I suppose...

I just went through this myself not too long ago. The 60-65 game is indeed awful. My best advice is to grind through the storyline and quest hubs in Plane of Water (if you can stomach it) while mixing in the IAs. Once you hit 66, immediately head to the new expansion areas.

It's hard to imagine the Pantheon thread reaching a new low but I think you guys have done it. Congrats gents, manginas and furries.

I may be wrong but I felt the reason we never saw much end game content pushed out after the launch was because of the absolutely horrendous state of the company at that time. It wasn't long before the entire Sigil leadership team had basically checked out altogether. The VR team may very well...

Still strolling down memory lane with camps I used to do in EQ: Aviaks in South Karana. Drolvargs in DL outside of Karnors. Cocks in The OT. The fort in Lake of Ill Omen. Giants in Frontier Mountains ("OMG! Frost Loop dropped!"). And that's all before the really good places like UGuk...

It's cool hearing about all of the old camps people use to use in EQ for leveling, especially ones that were "off the beaten path" from the masses. Finding those places was done mostly through exploration and trial and error by the players, which has me excited since that is one of VR's tenets...

My first main was a Warrior. Didn't really know anyone in game back then and didn't have much luck with smaller guilds that would last more than a few weeks so I pretty much had to hoof it everywhere. Unless I had a pre-set group, I tended to gravitate towards outdoor zones or dungeons that were...

No idea what you're talking about. I was a latecomer to the game as I didn't start until the day before Velious launched at the end of 2000 but I went all over the place. By the time I was in my 20s, 30s and 40s, I bounced from UGuk to CoM to Kaesora to Dalnir to CC. Wherever I could find a...

I also hate the gear resets that WoW, Rift and many other MMOs have opted to use in their games with new expansions. The EQ approach always made much more sense to me and from what I've read/heard from the VR team, it would suggest they feel the same way, which is great to hear. However, the EQ...

Watching them wipe several times in that tower brings back some great memories of EQ. Just couldn't appreciate them as much since they were using GM powers to recover but it makes sense for the purposes of the stream. I also appreciate that they field a lot of questions while playing and are...

To this point, they've stated that there are no plans to include a map or mapping abilities of any kind. It will basically be just like EQ was in that they are putting that on the community to produce, which is a good thing. Having said that, this is where I think they could update the game...

I believe it was Joppa who responded to the question in last week's stream regarding Monks and being able to use weapons vs bare hands. He said that while they are continuing to evaluate this, his personal preference was that Monks would be best suited to use their bare hands vs equipping...

But it's not necessarily bad design. It's just something else to do within the game. As people have already stated, part of the draw with EQ WAS the twinking game. No other game really offered that as a "feature" and it was fun to do. It doesn't matter if it was intended or not. That part is...

I think the Rantheon is much more apropos.

Regarding factions, I think EQ was as good as any system I've seen. First, make it matter. Utnayan outlined it well up above but a good example was Chardok. It was a huge zone and a fantastic place to grind XP as well as some great mid tier raid mobs at the bottom. But it was even better if you...

Full VR, nude mod pack, bukkake raids...I'm pretty sure Brad said these are all planned features for Pantheon.

Forget it. I gave up on the conversation after realizing it was pointless. Some people are just way too narrow-minded in their thinking.

Dude, stop thinking that the entire industry revolves around your own little myopic view of it. All you have to do is Google it and you'll find plenty of data supporting these statements. And for what it's worth, WoW still has a huge subs base (although far from the largest) even if you or any...

A genre no one cares about? Heh, hardly. The MMORPG space is a multi-billion dollar industry and continuing to grow steadily. That's across the globe, not just in Asian markets. Numerous titles released within the last year and numerous more coming. Now you may be right about an indie developer...

That's fair. But I'm curious why? Do you believe it's more about them releasing a shitty game (I.e., critical bugs, shitty launch, unfinished content like VG) or more that there isn't a large enough audience that will continue to play/support it long term regardless of how good it is?

I was waiting for someone to say this. Didn't think it would be you. You're better than that. Pantheon is the closest thing to a reskinned EQ the world will ever see. Certainly moreso than EQ2 ever was and I maintain even moreso than Vanguard. On the heels of his success with EQ, Brad's...

Yes because we all know that lore is the biggest reason people play MMOs. Anyway, you're saying EQ was a complete rip off of Sojourn? Okay. I didn't play Sojourn but if you did, I'll take your word for it that it was. I guess that leads me to believe that Pantheon will simply be a complete rip...

I was skeptical at first too but have become much more optimistic given the progress they've shown in the last 9 months. I'm also encouraged because the tools they have available today are wildly better than what they used for VG, enabling them to sidestep some of the more critical landmines...