12 year olds stab friend to prove Slender Man is real

khalid

khalid

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chaos_sl said:
That is a ridiculous stance. Should we also try 12 year olds as adults for theft, breaking and entering, drugs, sexual crimes, everything really. Right? They are clearly old enough to know that stealing is wrong, so if a 12 year old steals something they should go to prison and become one of BoldW's statistics he posted a page or so back. They're fucking 12...
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chaos_sl said:
The argument was that a 12 year old is capable of understanding that something is morally wrong. If that is the only determining factor, it certainly applies to other crimes as well.
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Yep, you are right, my position was ridiculous. I let my horror at the idea of a 12 year old conspiring with another and attempting to doing a murder override judgement.

I don't know what the correct punishment should be for these two, but it makes no sense to hold them to the same the standards as adults.
 
Noodleface

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When someone in my stepfather's family was 12, he lured a little girl (5) that was at church with her family into the basement and he brutally raped her. Since he was underage, he got sent to juve and was just released a couple years ago at 18.

Do we believe this to be a fair punishment?
 
chaos

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It is absolutely horrifying. Worse as a parent and I try to imagine what the hell could go wrong that your kids could become like this.
 
iannis

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I do think, and I know it's not popular, that at these ages the focus should be primarily on rehabilitation and less on punishment. And again -- mid teens is where that protection begins to dwindle. By 18 that protection is no longer applicable.

But 12?

Look at it this way. When they released him at 18 he has had 6 years of his life confiscated. That's 1/3 of his entire life.

Is ANY punishment more complex than Hammurabi's code "fair"?

And again, itishorrifying when children mimic the worst of adult natures. But it is mimicry.
 
Chanur

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Tuco_sl said:
Some of you seem really sure of opinions despite having no background in law, no knowledge of prior cases, sparse understanding of the case and probably having not spent much time thinking about the philosophy of what it means to treat someone as an adult.

Has someone 12 or younger ever been tried for an adult for attempted murder?
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Absolutely yes. I know for sure as young as 11.
 
S

supertouch_sl

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Dude, some people cannot be rehabilitated. No one who has tortured animals and killed people as a child and has gone on to become a caring, well-adjusted adult. I don't agree with the way the American justice system operates but it's silly to suggest that you can just give these types of people therapy or some kind of empathy pill. In fact, therapy makes these types of people more cunning and deceptive.
 
iannis

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And how have you come to the conclusion that these girls are the 0.05% of the population that are just mad dogs? Because I do agree, there ARE some people that cannot be rehabilitated. Mad Dogs do exist, and there are a special set of rules to deal with them.

Do you at least see the presumption?

There are assumptions which can be made about the adult which are not applicable to children. The reverse is also true.
 
Chukzombi

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actually i change my mind, these kids weren't being murderous little shits that need to be put away for a long time. no, they are prime examples of female empowerment, their mistake was plotting to murder a 12 year old girl. if it was a 12 year old white boy, then everything would be copacetic .
 
ohkcrlho

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dak

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how have you come to the conclusion that these girls are the 0.05% of the population that are just mad dogs?
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Besides the premeditated, unjustified, remorseless and up-close and personal attempt at murdering a child?

Don't you get sick of people making excuses for people that are clearly garbage?

Oh, my parents beat me, Oh, I've got a 70 IQ, Oh, it was the heat of the moment and a crime of passion, Oh, I was on drugs, Oh, I was too young to know better...I don't give a fuck why they are defective, all I know is that they are either irreparable or will cost a lot just to get to somewhat normal and still questionable.

You don't look at the grizzly bear that has acquired the taste for human blood and go "oh, silly bear bear stop eating humans alive"...no, you recognize it as a threat remove it from the system immediately.


No one who has tortured animals and killed people as a child and has gone on to become a caring, well-adjusted adult.
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I'm sure plenty of child soldiers have killed people and gone on to lead caring, well-adjusted lives.
 
Haast

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The biggest surprise for me in this thread is that a board which, at least according to the politics thread, leans heavily left favors lifetime imprisonment or capital punishment for 12 year olds. And that's what I love about the board, it always keeps me guessing.

In fact, one of the strongest advocates against throwing the gauntlet down on these kids typically leans right in the politics thread. It's a mad world.

On the topic: I committed some petty vandalism as a 15 year old, thinking it was hilarious and not thinking a minute about what a little shit I was being. The act was random, not revenge, so some hapless person I've never met had to clean up the aftermath. 30+ year old me would slap the shit out of 15 year old me. I'm not saying for a second this somehow justifies 12 year olds attempting a calculated murder; just a little perspective on the change of mentality between being a stupid tween and an adult.

I also never realistically considered killing anyone since I'm not mentally disturbed. And I think you have to be to actually commit a calculated, violent act against a victim who poses no threat to you. The question is could they be helped if they are reached early like this, and since I'm not a child psychologist, I have no idea what the answer is to that question.
 
kegkilla

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supertouch_sl said:
Dude, some people cannot be rehabilitated. No one who has tortured animals and killed people as a child and has gone on to become a caring, well-adjusted adult. I don't agree with the way the American justice system operates but it's silly to suggest that you can just give these types of people therapy or some kind of empathy pill. In fact, therapy makes these types of people more cunning and deceptive.
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you suck tranny dicks faggot, what do you know about being a well adjusted adult?
 
Gravel

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Iannis_sl said:
And how have you come to the conclusion that these girls are the 0.05% of the population that are just mad dogs? Because I do agree, there ARE some people that cannot be rehabilitated. Mad Dogs do exist, and there are a special set of rules to deal with them.

Do you at least see the presumption?

There are assumptions which can be made about the adult which are not applicable to children. The reverse is also true.
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I would say the fact that they tried tomurdersomeone by stabbing them 19 times would be a good first sign. I'd say even less than .05% of the population fits that bill.

A fucked up murder attempt like this absolutely, 100% tells you that they're fucked in the head. I don't see why this is so hard to understand?

Let's say the Slender Man story had some shit in there about cannibalism, and these girls decided to start knawing on the girl. At what point do you say, "Wow, those girls are incredibly fucked unstable and we probably don't need them roaming the streets...ever?"
 
Noodleface

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kegkilla from Philadelphia_sl said:
you suck tranny dicks faggot, what do you know about being a well adjusted adult?
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Never change.

My brother one day decided he hated my neighbor so he dumped a bucket of of bullfrogs in the driveway and chopped them up with a shovel. So far he is working a corporate job and has not murdered anyone (to my knowledge).
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Haast_sl said:
The biggest surprise for me in this thread is that a board which, at least according to the politics thread, leans heavily left favors lifetime imprisonment or capital punishment for 12 year olds. And that's what I love about the board, it always keeps me guessing.

In fact, one of the strongest advocates against throwing the gauntlet down on these kids typically leans right in the politics thread. It's a mad world.

On the topic: I committed some petty vandalism as a 15 year old, thinking it was hilarious and not thinking a minute about what a little shit I was being. The act was random, not revenge, so some hapless person I've never met had to clean up the aftermath. 30+ year old me would slap the shit out of 15 year old me. I'm not saying for a second this somehow justifies 12 year olds attempting a calculated murder; just a little perspective on the change of mentality between being a stupid tween and an adult.

I also never realistically considered killing anyone since I'm not mentally disturbed. And I think you have to be to actually commit a calculated, violent act against a victim who poses no threat to you. The question is could they be helped if they are reached early like this, and since I'm not a child psychologist, I have no idea what the answer is to that question.
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its not a left right issue, on most issues that only require common sense its not surprising that so many of us can come together and join in our horror of these little monsters act and want them to be put away. it also helps most of us are men who are of an age that we would have a daughters and we wouldnt want some little pieces of shit hurting them.
 
Tuco

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Noodleface_sl said:
Never change.

My brother one day decided he hated my neighbor so he dumped a bucket of of bullfrogs in the driveway and chopped them up with a shovel. So far he is working a corporate job and has not murdered anyone (to my knowledge).
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wtf

At least with that I can respect that it was done for intimidation, but he probably enjoyed it anyway.
 
Chanur

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These girls are not going to get life imprisonment or the death penalty. It was attempted and not successful. More than likely they will end up actually serving around 10 years.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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yeah noodle thats some heinous shit, the only thing i ever did that comes close to that, was finding a dead cat on the ground when i was 14 and putting it on a stick and then chased some snooty hot girls down the street with it.
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