Arkk's Weight Lifting / Fitness Thread

You just asked a question without giving any details on your current weight, diet and work out regimen.

Losing weight is easy. It's pretty much just math. Losing 5-8 pounds you just need a deficit of 17,500 to 28,000 calories over the course of a month. You'll end up losing some muscle if you're just doing HIIT though, so you're probably looking at 7-10 or maybe 8-11 pounds lost total.

That's why I feel like the weight loss thread is a little ridiculous (although I've never been fat). Then again, a lot of that thread is stupid shit like giving body fat to the hundredth of a percent. Putting muscle on requires a lot of work. Losing fat is easy. Losing fat while maintaining muscle is a bit more difficult, but still not as hard as putting on muscle.

Itlan_sl said:

I'm about to start doing HIIT 3x a week. Somehow, I gained 4 pounds over the last couple weeks and I don't know where or how, but it's really starting to bug me.

I leave for Florida in a month, how much fat you think I can rid of?! A solid 5-8 pounds maybe?

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You can tighten up fairly well in a month, depending on where you're starting from. Just cut out the crappy food and sugar, lift heavy. Maybe add in some HIIT if you want. Paleo 30 day challenge with intermittent fasting! GO!

Elurin_sl said:

Losing weight is easy. It's pretty much just math. Losing 5-8 pounds you just need a deficit of 17,500 to 28,000 calories over the course of a month. You'll end up losing some muscle if you're just doing HIIT though, so you're probably looking at 7-10 or maybe 8-11 pounds lost total.

That's why I feel like the weight loss thread is a little ridiculous (although I've never been fat). Then again, a lot of that thread is stupid shit like giving body fat to the hundredth of a percent. Putting muscle on requires a lot of work. Losing fat is easy. Losing fat while maintaining muscle is a bit more difficult, but still not as hard as putting on muscle.

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I don't want to defend fatties, but losing weight is an entirely different experience for people who have been overweight their whole lives. It's easy to say "eat less, move more" when you've never had to lose a large amount of weight.

Most fat people are fat because they have a horrible lifestyle. Changing that lifestyle is incredibly hard. Imagine doing something a certain way every day for 20+ years, and suddenly trying to change that. It's not an easy thing to change the habits and choices that you've been conditioned to make for your entire life. That's why counting calories helps fat people so much; when something becomes habit or routine (which is what the unhealthy lifestyles of fat people are) you need to actively focus on it in order to make any real, lasting changes.

I leave for Florida in a month, how much fat you think I can rid of?! A solid 5-8 pounds maybe?

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The biggest factor in how much fat you can shred will be your diet. Don't allow yourself any cheating and keep it strict and clean to whatever diet you adhere to.

I guess I should have made it more clear that, as far as body recomposition goes, it's far easier to lose weight than it is to put on muscle. Basically, tearing down is easier than building. The point wasn't so much about obese people trying to lose weight, but people who are already active. If you're the type of person who does bulk/cut cycles, the cutting will likely be much easier since all you're doing is manipulating calories.

I just got a little sidetracked in hating on that weight loss thread.

I don't know how people can do HIIT 3x/week when they are actually lifting or doing something else regularly. HIIT done properly should wipe you out. A huge majority of people who think they are doing HIIT aren't even close to the intensity done in studies and actually needed to get results.

It should be really, really hard.

TecKnoe_sl said:

Just got my weight gainer in and creatine, picked up some fish oil, any other supps you guys would recommend i pick up? Anyone else feel like the BCAAs are a good pick up? i was thinkin of a pre workout sup, but caffeine pills would probably just do the same.

Im trying to pack on weight, i havent picked up a multi yet because the weight gainer has basically all that in it atm, any other comments about the zinc dosage mentioned earlier how do you take zinc if calcium fucks it up.

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I am of the opinion that the only real supps that do anything are protein shakes and creatine. Pre-workouts can be good too. With regards to building mass/getting lean ect, nothing beats a proper diet.

Seananigans_sl said:

Yeah, but what you're talking about is more of a willpower/resolve issue than it is an objective difficulty issue. You're quoting this as the reason most fat people can't seem to lose weight, and I agree, but if they simply gather the will/resolve to change, it becomes a cakewalk (lol). I have little to no sympathy for most fat people, because of said lack of willpower and resolve.

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You're right, of course. But you can say the same thing regarding willpower about changing any habit, whether it be cracking your knuckles, biting your nails, etc. It's easy to say "if they simply gather the will/resolve to change, it becomes a cakewalk" but actually getting that willpower is damn hard for a lot of people. That's why so many people can't break even simple habits; gathering (and consistantly keeping) resolve is one of those things that is much easier said than done. Not to mention that lack of willpower is one of the factors that leads to being fat in the first place, so it's even harder for those people to suddenly muster the willpower it takes to lose weight. I think this is a big reason why lots of best fat-to-fit transformations that I've seen and read about happen after some kind of embarassing or emotionally traumatic event; that's what it takes to provide the motivation and resove to finally get in shape.

I'm not defending fatties, because as a former fatty I can personally attest to the fact that all you need is the willpower to break the habit/lifestyle/routine/whatever. I'm just pointing out that it's harder than it seems and people who have never been fat cant really understand the "difficulty" (not in terms of numbers, but in terms of mindset/willpower) that it takes to permanently lose weight and get in shape.

Celebrindal_sl said:

You just asked a question without giving any details on your current weight, diet and work out regimen.

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I'm 6'0, ~205, 23, and doing 5x5 atm. Benching 195, squatting 275 (yes, atg), deadlifting 315. My diet is pretty good I'd say, the only thing that's perhaps "wrong" is the amount of sugar I take in from eating fruit like a madman, but idgaf! Usually a smoothie or just some fruit in the morning if I don't feel like or don't have time to make some eggs or an omelette. Lunch is generally the same every day, buffalo chicken in a whole wheat wrap with a side salad and a fruit cup (strawberries, cantaloupe, honeydew, pineapple). I know how they make the buffalo sauce and it's about a tbsp of bleu cheese, which is about 80 calories, so it's nothing that should be destroying my diet lol. Mainly chicken, steak, shrimp, and other variants of fish with a lot of asparagus, broccoli, carrots, sweet potatoes, and salad every night for dinner(oil and vinegar with seasonings: oregano, black pepper). Snack on fruit, almonds, cashews, etc.

I haven't had processed sugar in a very, very long time. I've stopped drinking alcohol. All the basics of tightening a diet I believe I've done, so the basics aren't really going to help me here (stop drinking soda, drink water, eat protein, limit carbs, etc.) I don't really adhere myself to a daily calorie allotment, but I GENERALLY count calories per day and try to figure where I'm at. Some days I'm up around 2800, some days I'm down near 1900, it's all dependent on that day. I guess if I want to shred some fat within a month I'll have to keep myself restricted.

Anything you guys have to say I'm all ears, but I'm pretty sure it's just a matter of limiting myself, and pushing myself pretty hard for this next month. The only thing I HATE is that my numbers will suffer as I'll lose some strength in the gym, so that's always the dilemma for me. Maybe I should take the month off? Or perhaps keep my numbers lower? Like just stay at 225 for squats or something? Not sure.

But yeah, if I can lose 10 pounds and drop to 195 that's definitely a decent place to be I'd say.

Cutting fat is going to result in a loss of strength/muscle. You can't avoid it so don't worry about it. Just suck it up, lift heavy, and try to keep your numbers up as much as possible, but don't get discouraged if you find yourself weakening a bit. Taking the month off seems like a terrible idea and I imagine you'd lose a ton more muscle if you were to do that.

Your lifts aren't super high yet, so you may be able to continue gaining. It's also possible you might be wiped out trying to do that, with not enough energy. But I suggest you continue lifting so you can keep as much muscle as you can. If you stop altogether, you absolutely will lose some. You'll just have to play it by ear on how you progress (if at all).

Like I said, it's all a numbers game for losing fat. Keep doing what you're doing and just take in fewer calories. Divide up those total calorie amounts (17.5k-28k) by however many weeks you want to stretch it out to. Do it by week as opposed to by day, since it's almost impossible to hit an exact number every day. Keep track by the day, but adjust as needed to hit your weekly goal. If you add in lots of cardio, you'll need to adjust your calories downward less. But you'll also likely lose more muscle.

Lemmiwinks_sl said:

I am of the opinion that the only real supps that do anything are protein shakes and creatine. Pre-workouts can be good too. With regards to building mass/getting lean ect, nothing beats a proper diet.

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Yeah im gonna start my creatine soon, putting on mass sucks especially when you have crohn's eating 4-5 times a day + 2-3 shakes makes me feel like shit 90% of the day and i dont want to move, on days i work i cant do this obviously because i need to not feel like shit at work so on those days i do 3-4 shakes to make up for not being able to stuff my face until i cant move.

Fish oil seems like something to take regardless of working out, BCAAs i read up on them from the site celebrindal gave, but im still not sold on them really, also i think a multi is something i will pick up.

The one thing about having crohn's is shedding the fat after bulking is somewhat easy even while eating 4-5 times a day just minus the weight gainer, i was up to 150 last winter, i stopped going to the gym because of the job i was doing, i went down to about 135 after 2 months lost maybe 5-10 pounds on my max.

Fish Oil is preposterously cheap (400 caps for like $8 at Costco) and widely accepted as really, really good for you. There's no reason for anyone, athlete or not, to not take it IMO.

I've been taking creatine for months now. Why are people hesitant? It's been studied a billion times over. It's safe. After reading as much as I could on it a few months ago, it seems like an automatic as well. Multi, creatine, fish oil. I don't know about BCAAs because I'm poor.

As for lifts, I've basically abandoned SS now. I now sorta do the texas method, with a heavy day, light day, and power day (modified again) because I couldn't squat 3x a week anymore. But recently I've been worried about doing 5 reps per set. For example, SS recommends just 1 set of 5 for deadlifts, citing the high stress they place on your body as a good reason to only do 1 set (ie just 1 set can spur adaptation aka strength increase). The problem is, just doing 1 set means the weight is really fucking heavy. That's a lot of stress on your joints. Similarly, doing 5 reps a set is more stressful on joints/connective tissue than 8 reps a set. This is my reasoning and the only explanation I can come up with for those injuries I had. I think that stress was slowly wearing on my joints.

So now I'm thinking about doing a similar routine but with 8 reps a set, as follows:

Heavy
Squat 8x3
Press / bench (rotate each day) 8x3
Deadlift 8x2

Light
Bulgarian split squats 8x3
Press/bench 8x3
Romanian deadlift 10x3 (would do glute-ham raises but my gym doesn't have the machine)
Pullup 2 or 3 sets

Power
Power cleans 5x3
Press/bench 8x3 (done normally-not for power)
Box jumps 20x3

Any thoughts? One thing I'm worried about is 8x3 might take longer to recover from than 5x3. The weight is necessarily lower, but total reps is quite a bit higher.

Lemmiwinks_sl said:

I am of the opinion that the only real supps that do anything are protein shakes and creatine. Pre-workouts can be good too. With regards to building mass/getting lean ect, nothing beats a proper diet.

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Yeah, everything I have read and done agrees with this. Hence my Designer Whey and Creatine, the next couple months.

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

I don't know how people can do HIIT 3x/week when they are actually lifting or doing something else regularly. HIIT done properly should wipe you out. A huge majority of people who think they are doing HIIT aren't even close to the intensity done in studies and actually needed to get results.

It should be really, really hard.

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I agree with this 100%. I mean you can do it 2x a week or even 3 but often I hear people say something like "Yeah I did like 30 minutes of HIIT". Not sure what they did for 30 minutes but I can tell you after less than 3 minutes of sprints or prowler pushes I want to puke.

I will also say though if you do it regularly eventually you can recover from it pretty quickly. The first few times though it's "I cant even walk" DOMS.

I've just started Starting Strength, and the worst part of it is all the eating I have to do. Whereever I am, I am looking for something to stuff my face with, and even then the scales barely move.

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Dashel_sl said:

I agree with this 100%. I mean you can do it 2x a week or even 3 but often I hear people say something like "Yeah I did like 30 minutes of HIIT". Not sure what they did for 30 minutes but I can tell you after less than 3 minutes of sprints or prowler pushes I want to puke.

I will also say though if you do it regularly eventually you can recover from it pretty quickly. The first few times though it's "I cant even walk" DOMS.

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My HIIT is pretty simple. Sprint 100 yards, walk back, rinse and repeat until I hit 20 minutes or 13 sprints.

So it's probably like a 12-15 second sprint, a 45 second walk back. Seems to fall into the whole theory of it, but perhaps I'm wrong.

When you say sprint, do you mean 6 minute mile sprint, or do you mean all out, murderer chasing you sprints? Because it needs to be the latter. And run through the stopping point, don't start slowing down 5 yards before you get there. Honestly 100 yards is pretty far. When I first started doing HIIT I would go to a high school track and run the straight aways, walk the curves (which works out to 100m sprints) but man that seems really far now. I do 60 yard ones and feel like I'm going to die after 7-8. Next day my thighs / hips / pelvis feels like a baseball bat made friends with it.