Bitcoins/Litecoins/Virtual Currencies

swayze22

swayze22

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Flobee said:
ADA is a ghost chain made by a man that by all appearances is a scammer. I'm not saying you won't make a profit on the thing, but its not going to replace ETH. Polkadot is probably the only other layer 1 chain that I think has hedging potential vs Ethereum. Even that I wouldn't bet a ton on. To be clear, this is based on actual current usage of the blockchains in question.

Honestly the more I learn about Bitcoin's Lightning network, I'm starting to think that the rest of these layer 1 chains are going to be obsolete. Why would you run anything on a chain less secured than the Bitcoin blockchain given the option? Lightning is still pretty early on though, we'll see. Once Lightning gets up and running you'll start seeing layer 3 applications on Bitcoin and I think that's where things start getting wild.

This podcast really opened my eyes on the potential behind LN.


Honestly though I'm just spittin' in the wind. We don't know WTF is actually going on in this space, its the wild west.
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He co-founded ETH. Seems like with ADA they peer review every step and take a methodical process. Why is he a scammer? Because of youtube vids that scammers make like all the other coins? haha

I'll need to do some more digging on the lighting stuff.

and yes big 10-4 on none of us actually knowing anything but just curious what the "sentiment" is and why its that way from others. :emoji_fist:

I don't like to stray too far away from BTC/LINK but the gains on the shitcoins in general are crazy. impending doom inc.
 
LachiusTZ

LachiusTZ

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BTC has a liquidity issue imo.

The whole PoW idea is horrible once a coin is mature.

Or there is some breakthrough in computational power (quantum computers seem perfect for mining?...) that will flood the market with BTC and dilute it.
 
Flobee

Flobee

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swayze22 said:
He co-founded ETH. Seems like with ADA they peer review every step and take a methodical process. Why is he a scammer? Because of youtube vids that scammers make like all the other coins? haha
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He was kicked out of Consensys for a number of reasons as I understand it. One of the big ones being he wanted to run Ethereum as a corporation with him as CEO. When he was told to kick rocks he went and created Cardano. I don't dig too much into the crypto drama, but it seems to be a pretty consistent opinion from people who've been in the space since the beginning that Hoskinson is a turd.

Vitalik has been pretty clear that when he founded the initial Ethereum team (he was like 15) he let in anyone that wanted to join and seemed to know some stuff. He regrets that decision due to people like Charles taking advantage of him. I won't pretend to know much more than that, but my BS-ometer goes off when the dude talks. DYOR.

EDIT: Oh yea, and the peer-review system is literal hot garbage that incentivizes senior academics to plagiarize from younger ones to bolster their own reputation and gate-keep which ideas are allowed to flourish. Peer-review is not a positive IMO
 
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Flobee

Flobee

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LachiusTZ said:
BTC has a liquidity issue imo.

The whole PoW idea is horrible once a coin is mature.

Or there is some breakthrough in computational power (quantum computers seem perfect for mining?...) that will flood the market with BTC and dilute it.
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PoW transmutes real world energy into digital value. PoS is just a game of those with $$$ control the network. PoW isn't perfect but on the surface level at least I would say its the better consensus technology for a decentralized blockchain. It also has the benefit of incentivising efficient energy production/use. Read below for more on that:


I imagine by the time BTC is mature in the sense you're referring to that there is be another mechanism incentivizing miners to run. I can imagine a world where nation states will run miners to control a part of the network that contains a large portion of global wealth for example (in the bullish case).

Quantum computing breaks ALL cryptography, not just blockchains. You could steal state secrets, patents, everything. We're going to have much larger issues that BTC getting hacked in that case. Also a change in the PoW algorithm can resolve this issue as I understand it. The reason they don't do it now is because it is significantly less efficient and not yet needed.
 
LachiusTZ

LachiusTZ

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PoS is more resilient.

It's less likely that a single actor would own half, than a single actor could spike computing power short term.

I've been thinking about rebalancing back to 50/50, right now about 90% ETH, and I plan on it...

Just dunno when I'm going to
 
Flobee

Flobee

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LachiusTZ said:
PoS is more resilient.

It's less likely that a single actor would own half, than a single actor could spike computing power short term.

I've been thinking about rebalancing back to 50/50, right now about 90% ETH, and I plan on it...

Just dunno when I'm going to
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I've read arguments for both systems and found the PoW case to be more convincing. That doesn't really mean a lot though. We'll see how it goes. I do think its smart to own a bit of both ETH and BTC though yea, just in case.
 
LachiusTZ

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The guy that wrote that Medium article is a fucking hack. The only argument I see in it for PoW is that PoS is not "egalitarian", as we look at 60k BTC, and massive institutions buying billions in BTC. Lulz
 
Rajaah

Rajaah

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Arden said:
I've got about 6k in Eth and I've been trying to free up more money from my stock positions to buy more Eth before it takes off to the next level. I need at least one good market week before I can do that though and the market has been absolute shit lately. Really frustrating.

I'm hoping that Eth stays where it is for a bit longer and the market improves, but I know exactly what's going to happen. The market IS going to improve, but Eth is going to go up and I'll be left wishing I would have just cashed out my stock positions for a loss and bought Eth while it was still low.
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I'm in the exact same position. I really wanted to get ETH while it's low ($1600 or less) but I was waiting to close out some stocks first to have some real money to play with. As the weeks go by I was never able to do that without losses because the stock market is so godawful right now. As it is my Eth investment is very small (about a tenth of what I want) and the frustration is real.
 
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Arden

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Rajaah said:
I'm in the exact same position. I really wanted to get ETH while it's low ($1600 or less) but I was waiting to close out some stocks first to have some real money to play with. As the weeks go by I was never able to do that without losses because the stock market is so godawful right now. As it is my Eth investment is very small (about a tenth of what I want) and the frustration is real.
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Things are improving in the market... but Eth is on the rise (of course). May liquidate my stocks and just hang out until a crypto dip. Of course I run the risk that there is an explosion before a dip...
 
Arden

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swayze22 said:
ADA does all of that. and it has the 5th largest market cap currently. i'm not arguing but I'm just looking for a reason why ETH will be in the future if all these other coins are adapting and upgrading on ETH and even ETH realized they are insufficient. Is it simply because that's what most people mine and has been around?
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-Market cap
-Inertia
-Centralization factors/governance

Plus, as mentioned, the people running both ADA and Tron have scammer vibes.
 
Arden

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Flobee said:
I've read arguments for both systems and found the PoW case to be more convincing. That doesn't really mean a lot though. We'll see how it goes. I do think its smart to own a bit of both ETH and BTC though yea, just in case.
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Curious- your rationale for owning both BTC and ETH is that BTC is sticking with PoW? Or did I misread you? I was planning on going all in on ETH so I'm curious.
 
Rajaah

Rajaah

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Arden said:
Things are improving in the market... but Eth is on the rise (of course). May liquidate my stocks and just hang out until a crypto dip. Of course I run the risk that there is an explosion before a dip...
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Well, I myself liquidated my BTC at $59k a couple days ago (mostly bought in at $32k, quite a nice haul). Also sold Mana at $1.08. Didn't cash out, just left the funds in Coinbase with the objective of buying back in later. The $55 or so in fees sucked. And then I waited for the inevitable dip, and...nothing, of course it chooses now to tread water. If BTC goes sub-55k (or better yet close to 50) I'll buy it back, same goes for sub-.95 for Mana.

Just trying to jack up the numbers via trading since I'm already DCAing as much as I can into these things.

Also sold all of my Maker at a decent little profit. Going to reinvest that in something else. Also keeping Dash and ADA for now.

Totally left Ether alone, it doesn't fluctuate enough to reliably "day trade" with. And I want to put a lot more onto that one as mentioned above.
 
Flobee

Flobee

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Arden said:
Curious- your rationale for owning both BTC and ETH is that BTC is sticking with PoW? Or did I misread you? I was planning on going all in on ETH so I'm curious.
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I own BTC because I think it has a real shot at becoming the settlement layer for international trade. I genuinely can see a future where many purchases are priced in SATs and not USD. I think that is conceivable enough to want to own some BTC anyway. I believe that PoW is the superior consensus protocol as well, but thats only part of why I think BTC is important.

I think ETH is much riskier overall. It was what got me interested in the crypto space originally however so I owned some before I understood the space properly. I don't think its a bad investment or anything, I just see BTC as more of a sure thing and ETH has significantly more complexity and thus risk. I'm not convinced that it has more upside to compensate, although it may.

If you haven't done a deep dive on Bitcoin and you're in this space I would strongly recommend you take the time to truly understand the BTC value proposition. 99% of altcoins exist purely to take your Bitcoin. The more I learn about the space the more true that appears to be. This space takes a lot of work to grok because there is so much incentive to lie or even just exaggerate the capabilities of a project just to pump the price.

I would argue understanding Bitcoin's value proposition is a 40+ hour focused pursuit at least. It requires replacing a number of our core assumptions about what money is and that isn't easy. What problem exactly is Bitcoin solving? You go into it chasing the gains, you come out understanding why our system is so fucked up and how our monetary system is the root cause of many of societies issues. The inability to store value is a serious problem caused by the fiat monetary system.

I'll throw some resources here that I've found helpful. None of this is going to be a quick fix. Its all pretty in depth and time consuming. Thats the price.

The Saylor series from Robert Breedlove is probably the most comprehensive (and long winded) overview of BTC value. Starts in the stone age. 12+ hours total

I really like this analogy for the BTC / Fiat system and what is happening. Fairly concise if you're willing to entertain a 40 minute analogy

Raoul is kind of turning into a shitcoin moonboy but he is eloquent and understands Macro economic pressures and Pompliano strikes me as an intellectually honest guy. His podcast generally is pretty useful

I'll end with What Bitcoin Did podcast. I don't love the host, but this episode has Jeff Booth, Preston Pysh, and Plan B which are all three solid resources to explore for learning more

If you have the patience to learn about what the fuck is actually going on and invest according, IMO, you're likely to come out of all of this sitting pretty. I'm just some tard on a gaming forum though. Maybe I'm getting fooled in the same way I suspect many other folks in the space are. We'll see. Good luck.
 
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Keystone

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Arden said:
I agree with the BTC is gold idea, but I'm not sure Eth is silver. I haven't really seen a good comparison for Eth yet imo. Someone in one of the threads that got posted here said investing in Eth now is like if you could have invested in the "Internet" in 1995. Definitely seems like Eth is going to emerge as the defacto DeFi "infrastructure" for lack of a better word.

You ever sink that 5k into Eth?

Also, anyone have VET? Seems like one of those very unsexy but smart investments.
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VET is by far my largest holding and has been for a while now. They actually operate like a business and not a meme coin moon franchise like most of the crypto space, it's one that i plan on holding for the next 5-10 years more than likely, with small cashouts along the way, (did like 5% at .05, .09, will do same at like .15, .20)
 
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Haus

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I don't see any reason not to own both BTC and ETH. Diversification isn't just for stocks ya know? I believe in the general sentiment that BTC is heading to become the new "gold" for wealth storage, and ETH is more likely to become the more liquid "daily spending cash" currency at some point.

Then the US will announce, at some point, the "Digital Dollar" which someone will build a cross chain bridge for and then it will be like any other stablecoin... only less stable. heh

So you'll have your savings/retirement in BTC. What would now a days be your checking account will be stored in ETH and converted as needed to USDD/etc via using a debit card/NFC payment system/google-apple pay/whatever attached to your ETH wallet.

I see this playing out over the next 15 or so years. Meaning it will really be kicked in just in time for me to retire.
 
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Rajaah

Rajaah

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Arden said:
BTC above 60k and ETH above 2k. Both approaching ATHs.
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It's funny because when I sold at 58k I told people "now it's gonna go through the roof, you're welcome" as a joke. Maybe I should buy back in?

Glad I held my ether, not so glad that I only have 10% of the ether I wanted to get while it was low, but what can ya do.

Thinking about dropping Dash and ADA for more Eth but I like the idea of diversifying too so I don't know.
 
LachiusTZ

LachiusTZ

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Buddy sent me this.
signal-2021-04-01-090523.jpg
 
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