Car ?'s

Lanx said:

i mean beyond things just "getting older", there isn't really any difference between a 2018 model3 or a 2022 model3, if the miles and trim are the same

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They refreshed the M3 new form and interior is another reason the "gen1" m3 is going down in price - the mY should get a refresh 24/25 - the S had a quasi refresh with the wide body and stuff... the X hasn't had anything but general QC improvements and the screen orientation (and computer) change.

BrutulTM said:

Miles aren't the only thing that counts with cars getting older. I have a '99 Oldsmobile Intrigue sitting at my old house that only has 88k miles on it. It's a piece of junk. It's definitely not the same as if it was 2003 and it had 88k miles. Kind of an extreme example but that car taught me that just because you're not driving a car doesn't mean it's not deteriorating.

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Yes, but /sitting/ is also a killer, your suspension and moving parts and dry hoses etc.

Siliconemelons said:

eh mostly size, that’s why I do not want a 3 or a Y - as the Y is mostly the same-ish size of the Mach e- no other real reason, I got the Mach e new, I got it a like 8 year extended warranty etc so it should “last” me a while.

Going Tesla you have their charger network, everything else is hit or miss, so I don’t take the Mach e anywhere outside its range, I charge at home. But we have a hybrid Pacifica for hauling the fam around, so a X would not replace that- so not much reason I suppose. And APR is still stupid for whatever I would have to finance.

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The Tesla charging network is opening up to other car brands in the coming years so I wouldn't base a purchase decision off that alone. EU pretty much forced them to open it up to other car brands if they wanted to keep receiving subsidies and the US is following suit. It's already live at many supercharger sites here, I've charged my BMW at a Tesla station several times already. Have to use their app to pay instead of a charge card but it doesn't cost anything extra.

Need to get the adapter too also? I wouldn’t think they all have them sitting there like a usb dongle

Assuming it works the same as in Europe, the Tesla app will let you look for a charger for a non--Tesla and it should show you only compatible ones, the chargers here just have 2 different cables attached. It's a bit of a mess with a whole bunch of different plugs and adapters currently in use around the world. Maybe someone in the US can comment on their non-Tesla charging experience.

Well what is shown there as CSS 1, that top part circle is what normal level 2 charging cars have- if they have “dc fast charge” they then have that little additional two prong thing.

there are adapters to and from cas1 non dc and w dc to Tesla. Also my leaf had the chadmo for its “dc fast charge” before the css standard added the bottom two things

So I spent an hour reading wikipedia articles about electric plugs in countries I don't live in.

The round bit on the CCS1 and CCS2 plug is for AC charging and data communication between charger and car. The two extra pins below are for DC charging. Connections that don't support DC charging like most plug-in hybrids or home chargers use the round bit only.

The Tesla US plug uses the same prongs for 1 phase AC, split phase AC or DC depending on what charger is being used. Europe uses a 3-phase grid so that was never going to work there so Tesla had yet another connector in use there (now deprecated).

EU decided to force everyone on one standard back in 2013 but the US didn't enforce its standard so Tesla, Nissan etc all kept doing their own thing in the US. Tesla opened its plug standard to other manufacturers last year and the US finally decided to force everyone on that same standard last month, now renamed NACS.

All done right? Well, no. NACS uses the same connector as older Teslas but uses the CCS data protocol. Pre-2021 Teslas need a control unit replacement to use it. The car will show as CCS adapter compatible if it has the correct hardware installed, once it has that you should be able to charge your Tesla at any Supercharger or CCS1 station (with an adapter). Non-Tesla CCS1 cars can charge at compatible Tesla Superchargers using the supplied Magic Dock adapter.

Lambourne said:

So I spent an hour reading wikipedia articles about electric plugs in countries I don't live in.

The round bit on the CCS1 and CCS2 plug is for AC charging and data communication between charger and car. The two extra pins below are for DC charging. Connections that don't support DC charging like most plug-in hybrids or home chargers use the round bit only.

The Tesla US plug uses the same prongs for 1 phase AC, split phase AC or DC depending on what charger is being used. Europe uses a 3-phase grid so that was never going to work there so Tesla had yet another connector in use there (now deprecated).

EU decided to force everyone on one standard back in 2013 but the US didn't enforce its standard so Tesla, Nissan etc all kept doing their own thing in the US. Tesla opened its plug standard to other manufacturers last year and the US finally decided to force everyone on that same standard last month, now renamed NACS.

All done right? Well, no. NACS uses the same connector as older Teslas but uses the CCS data protocol. Pre-2021 Teslas need a control unit replacement to use it. The car will show as CCS adapter compatible if it has the correct hardware installed, once it has that you should be able to charge your Tesla at any Supercharger or CCS1 station (with an adapter). Non-Tesla CCS1 cars can charge at compatible Tesla Superchargers using the supplied Magic Dock adapter.

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I didn't realize that anything was forced yet. I assumed it sort of just became the defacto standard when all the OEMs moved over to it. I could have sworn Stellantis still hasn't stated they're using it yet (would be very stupid of them not to at this point).

Sort of interesting how it all played out. I really thought CCS was going to become the standard just because that's what all the OEMs here were migrating to since that's what VW was building out with their Dieselgate reparations (even the Japanese OEMs gave up on ChaDeMo here). Plus the current administration hates Musk's guts, so, it wouldn't have surprised me if they mandated CCS. Lastly, I figured Musk's focus in simplifying things would have pushed Tesla in that direction since it was already mandated in Europe (albeit with a different plug).

In the end, I think it just came down to the fact that Tesla has the only charging network that doesn't completely fucking blow. If VW hadn't done such a shit job with Electrify America (and EVgo, Chargepoint, etc didn't also suck), I think it might have gone differently. Sucks for all the people that installed J1772 level 2 chargers in their home, but I guess they can just buy an adapter. Also, sort of sucks for older Tesla owners. Tesla already made an adapter for ChaDeMo and CCS chargers, but now people would need another adaper with the NACS plug on both sides (or a retrofit of the new charger).

Kobayashi said:

I didn't realize that anything was forced yet. I assumed it sort of just became the defacto standard when all the OEMs moved over to it. I could have sworn Stellantis still hasn't stated they're using it yet (would be very stupid of them not to at this point).

Sort of interesting how it all played out. I really thought CCS was going to become the standard just because that's what all the OEMs here were migrating to since that's what VW was building out with their Dieselgate reparations (even the Japanese OEMs gave up on ChaDeMo here). Plus the current administration hates Musk's guts, so, it wouldn't have surprised me if they mandated CCS. Lastly, I figured Musk's focus in simplifying things would have pushed Tesla in that direction since it was already mandated in Europe (albeit with a different plug).

In the end, I think it just came down to the fact that Tesla has the only charging network that doesn't completely fucking blow. If VW hadn't done such a shit job with Electrify America (and EVgo, Chargepoint, etc didn't also suck), I think it might have gone differently. Sucks for all the people that installed J1772 level 2 chargers in their home, but I guess they can just buy an adapter. Also, sort of sucks for older Tesla owners. Tesla already made an adapter for ChaDeMo and CCS chargers, but now people would need another adaper with the NACS plug on both sides (or a retrofit of the new charger).

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A decade ago, SAE wanted CCS1 so it looked like that was going to be it for a long time. Reading things carefully, it looks like NACS isn't actually a legally mandated standard yet, just that networks wanting to qualify for subsidies can now offer NACS as well as the (required) CCS1. Most of this reads like just legal stuff needing to be put in place (like getting SAE certification for the plug, which means it's no longer within Tesla's sphere of control).

Tech moving way faster than the government again, and it's one of the things that needs to be sorted as the industry matures. It's actually kind of hard to believe that it's only been a decade since the first EVs started trickling into the market and Tesla only sold 60,000 cars worldwide in the first 3 years. They sell that many every two weeks now. It's exponential growth worldwide currently.

Musk also is playing a game by saying "If you (Auto Maker) adopt the Tesla connector, your brand then can use supercharger network." - so its kinda taking over the "standard" by defacto - and the Euro adopted the tesla plug as well I think - so the next generations of most EVs will have the tesla plug.

EVs in states that get freezing temps. Ell ooh ell.

ToeMissile said:

I watch this guys channel on occasion, seems to have a pretty balanced perspective on stuff. Owns a mechanic shop but also does a lot of weird weird/fun stuff like putting a V8 into a Model S, etc.

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I really wish I could just read a transcript. I made it about 5 minutes in, too much rambling. So far, my summary was he bought a Ram TRX and likes it. This is a gripe with most youtubers these days, they filibuster 2 minutes of actual content into 5-10 times that amount, repeating and revisiting the same points over and over again.