DOTA 2

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gmstbfla_sl

shitlord
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Veil is a decent option too. It's probably the most underrated item in the game overall.

For less than the cost of an Aghs, you can get a veil and a casual point booster.

Comparing the two you get:

Aghs - 200 HP, 150 Mana, 10 All Stats, +33% Damage on Scythe, Buyback Canceling
Veil+PB - 200 HP, 150 Mana, 6 All Stats, +25% Damage on Scythe, Pulse, and all spells your teammates cast for 25 seconds in a huge AOE, 6 HP Regen, 6 Armor, 6 Damage, 330 gold, AND you can use the booster to build into a bloodstone.

It's not even really a comparison when you lay it out like that unless you're getting a huge amount of use out of the buyback canceling.
 
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gmstbfla_sl

shitlord
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I'd prefer veil unless your team is overly heavy on physical damage.

But if you have fun with dagon, knock yourself out. Not everything is about efficiency.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

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gmstbfla_sl said:
Veil is a decent option too. It's probably the most underrated item in the game overall.

For less than the cost of an Aghs, you can get a veil and a casual point booster.

Comparing the two you get:

Aghs - 200 HP, 150 Mana, 10 All Stats, +33% Damage on Scythe, Buyback Canceling
Veil+PB - 200 HP, 150 Mana, 6 All Stats, +25% Damage on Scythe, Pulse, and all spells your teammates cast for 25 seconds in a huge AOE, 6 HP Regen, 6 Armor, 6 Damage, 330 gold, AND you can use the booster to build into a bloodstone.

It's not even really a comparison when you lay it out like that unless you're getting a huge amount of use out of the buyback canceling.
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There's a good reason why that is. The item does nothing unless you use it before any other abilities, which isn't as easy as it seems. Necro is like the only hero where it makes sense, shakers sometimes buy it after blink, but I still don't like it.

Dagon is much better, making you sure you can kill somebody instantly, thereby making the fight 4v5, is much more powerful.
 
Jackie Treehorn

Jackie Treehorn

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Zaphid_sl said:
I have 85% winrate with Visage over like 24 games. Anything works in pubs, the question is why it works. If you kill a target outright thanks to Aghanim and manage to spam heals the whole fight, you have a massive advantage, because initiation wins pubgames. You buy and place wards, therefore helping your team to not get murdered. If you run into good shadow demon or a clock manages to latch onto you, you are gonna have a bad time rushing Agh. Also it seems like carries in your games don't farm nearly well enough, thereby making kills relatively much more valuable.

I wonder how Dagon would do in your scenario, less HP, but that extra damage really makes the ulti hurt and you can fire it off even earlier knowing that extra nuke is on the way.
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I gotcha. Yeah, I'm always curious of the "whys" things work, when they don't make sense.

Thanks for the suggestions from everyone else, too...I'll try out some new things tonight instead of going aghs. I've bought veil a couple of times in recent history. I'd have to start being cognizant of actually casting the thing regularly, which wouldn't be too hard.

Dagon interests me more (of course.)
 
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Commander Vimeseh_sl

shitlord
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So for someone who plays top lane in league what would be the role/heroes that would best fit the playstyle. For reference I play a lot of Riven/Fiora/Jax/Aatrox/Jayce. So I like solo laning, while being a carry style champ but not always the main carry.
 
Zaphid

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Jungle or hard lane, usually 1v2 or 1v3, you need to get as much gold and xp as possible without dying.

Aaaand im done with Dota, I really need to stop playing solo. Bitching all game long, these people need to play twitch chat, not dota
 
G

gmstbfla_sl

shitlord
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Zaphid_sl said:
There's a good reason why that is. The item does nothing unless you use it before any other abilities, which isn't as easy as it seems. Necro is like the only hero where it makes sense, shakers sometimes buy it after blink, but I still don't like it.

Dagon is much better, making you sure you can kill somebody instantly, thereby making the fight 4v5, is much more powerful.
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It has a huge cast range on top of a huge radius and casts instantly. It lasts 25 seconds with a CD 30. It's pretty much the easiest item to use in the entire game, and far easier than a level 1 dagon.
 
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Commander Vimeseh_sl

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Zaphid_sl said:
Jungle or hard lane, usually 1v2 or 1v3, you need to get as much gold and xp as possible without dying.

Aaaand im done with Dota, I really need to stop playing solo. Bitching all game long, these people need to play twitch chat, not dota
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Okay, thanks for the map position and the general idea of what I'd be dealing with. Any hero recommendations for a newer player based on what I like from League (for those who know the champs I listed).
 
Zaphid

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gmstbfla_sl said:
It has a huge cast range on top of a huge radius and casts instantly. It lasts 25 seconds with a CD 30. It's pretty much the easiest item to use in the entire game, and far easier than a level 1 dagon.
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And I keep forgetting to use it
smile.png


You are looking at heroes like centaur warrunner, mirana, windranger, weaver (carry, you will have to farm all game long), bounty hunter (just sit in the lane invis and soak up xp), clockwerk, tidehunter

Most of these heroes have either powerful ultimates, or make great use of blink dagger, so you are looking to hit 6 or scrape by the 2150 for blink and start killing shit.

Some games, you just go full retard:Match 820819175 - Overview - DOTABUFF - Dota 2 Stats
 
Pyros

Pyros

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Commander Vimeseh_sl said:
Okay, thanks for the map position and the general idea of what I'd be dealing with. Any hero recommendations for a newer player based on what I like from League (for those who know the champs I listed).
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Semi carries are generally played mid in dota, even though there's some played offlane too(which is sometimes 1vs1 and sometimes 1vs3 and good fucking luck farming when that happens). Common picks in that style would be:

- Centaur Warrunner, tanky melee hero, has a very strong aoe stun and very strong burst damage, has a great teamfight ultimate(global range max speed for every hero), scales well in lategame with the proper items
- Faceless Void, tanky/squishy melee hero, tankiness is RNG based so depends but in general kinda squishy, has a built in blink, has a great teamfight ultimate, is one of the strongest scaling lategame hero in the game, however ultimate is very prone to fuck your team over if you misplace it since it affects both allies and enemies
- Dark Seer, tanky melee caster, hard to compare to anything in LoL but fits the tanky and the offlane thing, can jungle, scales decently, has great teamfight potential and great early game dominance but is very reliant on long cooldowns(and I mean really long, Vacuum is like 25secs cd and that's not even his ult but in LoL it'd be considered the strongest ult in the game ^^)
- Naga Siren, slightly tanky illusion based melee hero, has one of the most frustrating ulti to play against, scales extremely well, farms extremely well, is illusion based though(so you need to kinda micro them but not that much)
- Slark, mobile elusive assassin, while not particularily tanky he's very hard to kill and can regen life very quickly, moves around very fast, does very well 1vs1 against most other heroes
- Bristleback, tanky tanky melee hero that's tanky, he's like a non shitty Rammus, scales extremely well and can easily carry, very hard to kill
- Doombringer, fairly tanky melee hero, not so tanky but can farm faster than most heroes and can get varied skills by eating jungle creeps, has an ult that's more or less a permanent disable in fights(it's actually only a silence but also disables items and passives and lasts like 15seconds while doing damage so...)

Too lazy to finish but you can look up Sven, Kunkka, Slardar, Lifestealer, Dragonknight, Wraith King, Lycan, Alchemist, Axe and a bunch more. Basically in general for melee tanky heroes you want to look at str heroes. Not all of them have carry potential or make a good solo though. Also to point out that unlike league, you won't get a solo lane everytime unless you mid(but then you might have a russian/peruvian yelling at you in his language and leeching your xp/stealing your last hits). Jungles are relatively common but not always played and when no jungle people rarely trilane in low level pubs.
 
Dandain

Dandain

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Commander Vimeseh_sl said:
So for someone who plays top lane in league what would be the role/heroes that would best fit the playstyle. For reference I play a lot of Riven/Fiora/Jax/Aatrox/Jayce. So I like solo laning, while being a carry style champ but not always the main carry.
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So, besides all the other good advice - take advantage of the completely unlocked cast and don't be afraid of trying anything, remember you're already playing the same game as the rest of us past mode choices, supports can offer an extremely aggressive and roaming alternative to league's version of support (tied to ADC largely). The roles share very little in common in regards to how they can be played outside of the low economy aspect of their game. Which isn't to say supports in dota can't strongly utilize gold and some can be exceptional even in the late game with a few core items. The highest dps skill in the game belongs to a support with an agh's sceptre upgrade. Fiora's ult is if I recall is like a weak juggernaut ult, juggs is a non-shitty version designed to crush someone 1v1 with no other minions or heroes to bounce to. You'll find a lot of skills on champs in league - especially in older cast members - that were inspired in general by a more overpowered versions of skills in dota.
 
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Commander Vimeseh_sl

shitlord
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Dandain_sl said:
So, besides all the other good advice - take advantage of the completely unlocked cast and don't be afraid of trying anything, remember you're already playing the same game as the rest of us past mode choices, supports can offer an extremely aggressive and roaming alternative to league's version of support (tied to ADC largely). The roles share very little in common in regards to how they can be played outside of the low economy aspect of their game. Which isn't to say supports in dota can't strongly utilize gold and some can be exceptional even in the late game with a few core items. The highest dps skill in the game belongs to a support with an agh's sceptre upgrade. Fiora's ult is if I recall is like a weak juggernaut ult, juggs is a non-shitty version designed to crush someone 1v1 with no other minions or heroes to bounce to. You'll find a lot of skills on champs in league - especially in older cast members - that were inspired in general by a more overpowered versions of skills in dota.
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Thanks for the advice. Yah looking over skill sets it looks like Jugg and Fiora have pretty much the exact same ult with his doing a ton more damage. She can't ult minions though so her ult in a 1v1 is a lot more forgiving. Will be a big adjustment to dealing with/playing supports that actually have a carry aspect to them. In league like you said the support is often babysitting the adc solely in early to midgame, and you can't really carry outside of map vision/control or landing nice cc (which if your team isn't around or reacts properly goes to waste). For instance no matter how fed you are as thresh you aren't going to lay down much damage on an enemy carry after around the 15 minute mark.
 
cyrusreij

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Probably the biggest difference in my opinion between the two is disables and magic immunity. Disables are comparatively weak as shit in LoL, and there is no magic immunity, the two combine together to form balance I suppose. Disables are far more severe in DotA. Your average one lasts for around 3 seconds, with abilities like Bane's Ult lasting for 7 seconds with Aghanims. On the flip side, buying a BKB will negate everything but the super serious ults, like the aforementioned Bane, or an Enigma Black Hole or a Beastmaster Roar, etc.

Coming from LoL, you probably won't realize how truly fucked you are; until you get disable chained into oblivion by a well coordinated two or three heroes. Playing Single Draft last night, my team wound up going up against Void, Enigma, CM, Shadow Fiend and Doom. I have never been wombo combo'd so hard in my life. Things like that you just won't run into in LoL.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

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CyrusReij_sl said:
Probably the biggest difference in my opinion between the two is disables and magic immunity. Disables are comparatively weak as shit in LoL, and there is no magic immunity, the two combine together to form balance I suppose. Disables are far more severe in DotA. Your average one lasts for around 3 seconds, with abilities like Bane's Ult lasting for 7 seconds with Aghanims. On the flip side, buying a BKB will negate everything but the super serious ults, like the aforementioned Bane, or an Enigma Black Hole or a Beastmaster Roar, etc.

Coming from LoL, you probably won't realize how truly fucked you are; until you get disable chained into oblivion by a well coordinated two or three heroes. Playing Single Draft last night, my team wound up going up against Void, Enigma, CM, Shadow Fiend and Doom. I have never been wombo combo'd so hard in my life. Things like that you just won't run into in LoL.
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If he ever plays against bots, he will learn that very fast. 5 heroes perfectly chaining all their CC is very painful, but useful lesson.
 
Pyros

Pyros

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I'd say one of the major difference compared to LoL isn't really the disable duration, which is obviously higher, it's the range of stuff. In LoL, effective range of disables and damage is a lot lower than in dota. If someone isn't on your screen, it's unlikely they'll hit you with something. There's a few abilities with bigger range than usual as well as a few global/very long range but overall, you only have to worry about someone when they get in what would be a 500-600range in dota. Meanwhile in dota, anyone in 1500range of you can in fact hit you with random shit, like obviously arrow, hook(both clock and pudge) and such but also sheepstick, cyclone and stuff, plus "flash" being on a way way way lower cd(blink dagger is 12secs, flash is 4minutes) almost any hero with it can extend their range a stupid amount. Can't forget Haste and Invis runes as well as Smokes to bypass safety wards. Fog is also shorter especially at night time, so ganking easier plus the asymetric lanes and basically you'll keep getting killed by shit you didn't expect to kill you which isn't the case in LoL as often. Then yeah once you do get hit, you get disabled for a lot longer so you're way fucked. But I'd say if disables had the same range and usability as in LoL, the duration wouldn't be quite as bad.

Plenty of other differences too that make a big impact, like spells not scaling and thus generally having a much higher base damage. You don't quite appreciate this until you get one shot by a lvl 6 Lion with 0 items when you're lvl 9, which in LoL pretty much wouldn't happen since the AP guy would need some items to actually put out decent damage especially against someone higher level/farmed.



Also unrelated but they've released the alpha tools to make mods and shit. News post:Dota 2 Workshop Tools | Dota 2

Based on reddit stuff, it seems those tools are in fact based on the source2 engine and dota2 would be changed to source2 at some point in the near future. Post also states techies is coming "by the end of august".
 
kegkilla

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Does this mean Dota2 could be receiving a major graphical update in the future? Would be awesome if true, one of my concerns about this game has been that the graphics could be a bit better.
 
Zaphid

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Probably not when it comes to textures, but some new shaders may happen. You can always buy new cosmetics for heroes anyway, if you look at what was created at first and what's added now, the improvement is significant.
 
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