This dramatically changed at max level when you started to stack haste items for TP gain and then swap to your damage set when you do your weapon skill. If FFXIV does something similar, perhaps most of everyone's concerns with the GCD will be reduced.
Final Fantasy XIV (Guide in first post)
- Thread starter Guzrog
- Start date
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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That sounds horrible. Wearing one set to do a few moves, then putting a entire new set to do your damage skill, then switch back.. Ugh no.
The whole game feels like its played at 200ms which is probably why the gcd is so long, so you dont really notice. For example getting out of ae, they still hit you if you dont get out immediately because of the lag
fletch101
Lord Nagafen Raider
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God I hope they do not have gear swapping like 11 macros or not. Such a pain in the ass.
tower
Golden Knight of the Realm
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I have read they removed gear swapping but I would still refer back to my original post:
you cant ignore that mechanic. You have to assume their intent is to lower the GCD in a meaningful way through gear. To be able to improve something that has such a huge impact on your playstyle via gear is pretty cool in my opinion and helps offset the bland stats. It may be tuned wrong now (no one but legacies really know) but I give them the benefit of the doubt as they have shown they deserve it. I'll agree that if the GCF is still 2.25s+ at lvl 50 that is some weak shit.
Changing topics - based on our limited experience, what class do you think will be in highest demand at launch? I love dps but will probably play conj as I would assume per usual healers will be in huge demand, despite how terrible they seem to play.
fletch101
Lord Nagafen Raider
- 58
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This is correct, I tried the same, and rec'd an error message, something along the lines of "You cannot swap your gear right now."
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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It didn't really dramatically change the core mechanic there. You gained TP a bit faster, that was it. It was shitty in every sense of the word "shitty". Even as a BLM I would do a drain/mana leach (aspid? something?), sit for a second while they set up the skillchain, cast my MB and switch to my mega damage gear (and HQ staff). Then switch for regen. It sucked, but we did what we had to. It did seem more in line with how the original FF games played though, so I didn't mind. FWIW I played WHM, BLM, and WAR (TARU FUCK YEAH) to 75 in a top server LS.
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The problem, as someone pointed out before is even if they drop the GCD or you get tons of gear that drops the GCD, you'll still run out of TP eventually and then it's thumbletwindling time again, actually for longer. They do need something to regen TP, maybe pots? I think there's only potions and ether but nothing for TP. There's a LNC skill for it but that obviously limits the accessability.
What kinda sucks about this is THM/BLM who basically don't have the issue because they have infinite mana via their main mechanic. It's fairly obvious how that's gonna be a problem eventually unless like one skill from a dow class does a lot more than a spell from a blm, as you'll end up having every DPS being a BLM for long fights as everyone else will run out of TP and do shit dmg. Also bard songs are shit apparently but that's a separate issue and requiring bards isn't good design either.
Maybe TP regen should increase over time if you don't use any, so like first tick is whatever it's at now, I wanna say 100, but if you don't use it 2nd tick is 120, then 150, then 200. So if you take a break from using shit you get a full bar of TP to play with again, or you can keep spamming like currently if you need to do the damage right now but lose damage over time.
So yeah I don't know about their system for now, it seems a bit shaky. I'm not too annoyed by the GCD though, but I guess I only played my MRD to 12 so I haven't played with the GCD that much(rest was casters and since spells tend to take as long to cast it doesn't really make a difference).
What kinda sucks about this is THM/BLM who basically don't have the issue because they have infinite mana via their main mechanic. It's fairly obvious how that's gonna be a problem eventually unless like one skill from a dow class does a lot more than a spell from a blm, as you'll end up having every DPS being a BLM for long fights as everyone else will run out of TP and do shit dmg. Also bard songs are shit apparently but that's a separate issue and requiring bards isn't good design either.
Maybe TP regen should increase over time if you don't use any, so like first tick is whatever it's at now, I wanna say 100, but if you don't use it 2nd tick is 120, then 150, then 200. So if you take a break from using shit you get a full bar of TP to play with again, or you can keep spamming like currently if you need to do the damage right now but lose damage over time.
So yeah I don't know about their system for now, it seems a bit shaky. I'm not too annoyed by the GCD though, but I guess I only played my MRD to 12 so I haven't played with the GCD that much(rest was casters and since spells tend to take as long to cast it doesn't really make a difference).
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Where did this come from? I plan to be a bard, so interested in this data.
Given that you are giving up 20% damage and mana/tp intensive fights, I was hoping they would be pretty worthwhile.
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There's a bunch of threads on the forums about people complaining about the bard songs. Basically, they consume too much MP over time, so you can't play a song permanently, you actually have to stop playing for a decent bit for mp to regen, exact numbers I'm not sure but one guy was saying he couldn't run the MP regen song out of combat(which has much higher mp regen already) forever so the deficit in combat would be fairly big. Second aspect is the regen provided isn't stellar, but it's still going to be necessary if it's the only source, especially for TP. 3rd aspect but this one I feel is normal, is that songs act like auras, meaning they're only active for people in range of the song, if you walk out you're not buffed anymore, it's not like a short duration aoe buff and more like a typical mmo aura. Mostly the issue with this is positionning but meh that shouldn't be so bad, not sure about the range though. Also complaints there's only 3 songs and that the resist song does nothing because mobs don't have the resist mechanic working at the moment or some shit.
Mostly all I've seen are complaints, but it's obviously all legacy players and from my understanding 1.0 bards were basically THE must have class for any group, so it could just be that now they're not as OP anymore and people bitching out because of it.
Also there's the fact that balancing on jobs is most likely very far off. They were just added last weekend so there's a good chance a lot of that is going to change before the release based on feedback. So I'd take the bitching about jobs with a grain of salt for now, but that's the overall impression I got from reading the various threads while I was bored.
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Ah ok, thought there was some solid numbers or something I was missing.
I would think the drain /regen numbers could be pretty easy to test and figure out, was the provided or just comments? I read the forums occasionally but haven't seen that thread, will have to look for it now.
Interesting to here about the resist song though. I would think again that's something pretty easy to test.
Edit: Found it, yeah just comments, no actual data. What's funny is people saying the TP song would be useless when everyone has invigorate, then in another thread a bunch of people saying how they were out of TP @ 35 and 50 and wanted more ways to get TP or faster regen..
I would think the drain /regen numbers could be pretty easy to test and figure out, was the provided or just comments? I read the forums occasionally but haven't seen that thread, will have to look for it now.
Interesting to here about the resist song though. I would think again that's something pretty easy to test.
Edit: Found it, yeah just comments, no actual data. What's funny is people saying the TP song would be useless when everyone has invigorate, then in another thread a bunch of people saying how they were out of TP @ 35 and 50 and wanted more ways to get TP or faster regen..
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This was one of the threads, I see they added some shit after I checked it out though, so apparently you don't get the effect of your mp song as a BRD, which I assume is to prevent maintaining it almost forever. There was another thread but I couldn't find it, this one I already had to dig through several pages of bullshit to find again.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Tes...rffed-Hardcore
http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Tes...rffed-Hardcore
Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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THat thread is interesting, it actually says the buffs are very good, but people seem to be upset they can't just play them forever. Also the range is supposedly low. I dunno, will have to see, most of it seemed to be 2 people upset that it wasn't the same bard from previous versions.
I do find it weird the TP regen effects the bard but the mana regen doesn't. Obviously it could just be to make sure a bard can't sit and play the mana regen song forever. In the end though I don't think you were meant to play forever. It seemed more to me, you use them when the party needed and in intervals. The only issue I could see being having to choose between TP or mana. Since playing one is going to drain you and you will have to wait for mana.
I'm not sure where the concerns for THM are coming from. Don't they have to have the ice buff to have the amazing regen(cant use fire spells while its up otherwise it cancels it)? So if you had a mana song, the thm could stay in fire buff for longer doing more dps.
Will be interesting to see how it turns out. With the songs actually being really good(30% TP regen and "The refresh on ballad is 6% max MP restore per 3 seconds to everyone" with the 6% MP being the receiver not the bard , for mana regen). Range and mana drain are pretty easy to balance out and tweak.
Still sounds pretty damn good to me in a party of 8.
I do find it weird the TP regen effects the bard but the mana regen doesn't. Obviously it could just be to make sure a bard can't sit and play the mana regen song forever. In the end though I don't think you were meant to play forever. It seemed more to me, you use them when the party needed and in intervals. The only issue I could see being having to choose between TP or mana. Since playing one is going to drain you and you will have to wait for mana.
I'm not sure where the concerns for THM are coming from. Don't they have to have the ice buff to have the amazing regen(cant use fire spells while its up otherwise it cancels it)? So if you had a mana song, the thm could stay in fire buff for longer doing more dps.
Will be interesting to see how it turns out. With the songs actually being really good(30% TP regen and "The refresh on ballad is 6% max MP restore per 3 seconds to everyone" with the 6% MP being the receiver not the bard , for mana regen). Range and mana drain are pretty easy to balance out and tweak.
Still sounds pretty damn good to me in a party of 8.