Anyone have thoughts on Marauder and Gladiator? How viable does Marauder look to be as a tank end game. I understand our experience thus far is limited based on the level cap, but do you see Marauder/Warrior being a viable tank end game?
Final Fantasy XIV (Guide in first post)
- Thread starter Guzrog
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Well from the looks of it Paladin seems like the superior tank, Marauder looked like it was designed as an aoe/damage tank but the difference in damage or aoe threat/mitigation doesn't appear to be particularily noticeable, their aoe does have a fairly large range compared to the PLD though so that's helpful when picking up a bunch of adds. I don't think they'll be unviable tank but they seem like they'll be secondary tanks, more like to not waste drops and handle the easier part of every encounter, generally add tanking. The big downside I see is both tanks use stances in endgame and the paladin one reduces damage while the warrior one increases health, which is generally the shittier mechanic of the 2 in every mmo unless the difference is insanely big(and it doesn't seem to be).
It is likely you'll need 2 tanks for 8man anyway so you'll have a paladin spot and a warrior spot, and queuing for pubs would find you group easily too.
Zindan
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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So after watching all the Yogcast videos for FFXIV:ARR, I have to say the animations in this game are really well done. Have a question about Class/Jobs. How many classes can you level up? I know that Jobs unlock by having one class at lvl30 and another at lvl15, but can you level up a third if you want...to get some more cross-class skills? The fighting animations for Pugilist sold me for that class, and then Monk, so I was wondering if there might be some other class(es) besides Lancer that would be useful for skills.
Larger Health Pool and On demand Healing was the mechanic that deathknights used to become the preferred tanks during WoW Cataclysm. It's all just a numbers game and individual encounters matter. There is no reason to doubt that they'll be viable... at the very least you'll have an easier time clearing trash content, and almost definitely there will be cross class skills that will require both to be leveled up for a true end-game tank of either class.
You can level up every class if you want. Only certain skills from certain classes are usable by each class/job though. Vorph was saying the spells and abilities you can sub in changed in the recent info from the benchmark datamining. Prior to that you could only sub skills from 1 class. If you trust that the data mined info is more recent (it should be) then subbed skills will be changing somewhat in p4.
You will be able to level up both with a little extra time invested. I'm probably going up the Paladin route till cap, then during downtimes pulling Glad to cap.
Vorph
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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At low level maybe, iirc the tests by the legacy players showed very little differences, other than larger aoe so you can hit more targets/pick up targets faster and the self healing which has various uses like surviving if your healer is dead or simply letting your healers get mana back/move around and so on.
Zindan
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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So how do the cross-skills work? I found a list of such skills for the Pugilist / Monk, and there are Archers skills among them...so if I am in the face of some mob and want to use Raging Strikes (Archer skill), will I suddenly pull out a bow from thin air and fire it, or will it just use some default fist attack? Same goes for all the other skills, will that weapon type suddenly appear when I use them? haha
Most are buffs, with some smattering of basic attacks put in. For all intents and purposes you will probably only use the buffs. I'm not even sure why they bothered with most of the attack skills they give you from other jobs. And yeah they take from animations of the job you're on, not the job skill you use (magic skills will vary).
Taking into consideration datamined data for P4 which could or could not be accurate, the general feeling towards PAL vs. WAR is that war's got a much more significant overall buff that probably puts them in abit of a more desired roll both out the gates and into raiding with PAL's having the best overall mitigation skill set and ability to handle spike damage. DPS numbers will be interesting but WAR's definitely seemed to have some clear advantage based off initiatal theory crafting.
A few other advantages they have are early AE tanking leveling up resulting in faster clears as well as abit better cross skills from GLD's then GLD's get from them. Also if I recall there stun is off GCD essential which is a HUGE difference compared to at least how P3 played. As a gladiator tank it was difficult at times to interrept abilities with our stun unless you just spammed that with no other abilities due to the long GCD. This could be critical on group/raid wiping abilities where as WAR might have a cool down but it isn't on GCD (might be something to cross class but i don't think it was).
Again, plenty to be determined on how P4 plays out but I do actually think both will be fairly capable with gladiators being the common MT due to better spike mitigation but as always that is subject to how they design raid content. My gut says start by leveling a marauder but since I'm 2 boxing a THM/BLM to 50 i wanted abit more "tanky" tank. Also while marauder probably has the edge on enmity generation honestly I think when you get your 3 tier combo with either of them it becomes moot on a single target. Most tests of tanks doing proper rotations at the higher levels typically eclipsed dps on relative enmity. If that trend continues, good tanks anyway of either class will not have an issue on single target. AE might be a different story but if they up the damage to PAL's AE that they get at the end level that will make a nice difference as its not just a cone like marauders I believe.
A few other advantages they have are early AE tanking leveling up resulting in faster clears as well as abit better cross skills from GLD's then GLD's get from them. Also if I recall there stun is off GCD essential which is a HUGE difference compared to at least how P3 played. As a gladiator tank it was difficult at times to interrept abilities with our stun unless you just spammed that with no other abilities due to the long GCD. This could be critical on group/raid wiping abilities where as WAR might have a cool down but it isn't on GCD (might be something to cross class but i don't think it was).
Again, plenty to be determined on how P4 plays out but I do actually think both will be fairly capable with gladiators being the common MT due to better spike mitigation but as always that is subject to how they design raid content. My gut says start by leveling a marauder but since I'm 2 boxing a THM/BLM to 50 i wanted abit more "tanky" tank. Also while marauder probably has the edge on enmity generation honestly I think when you get your 3 tier combo with either of them it becomes moot on a single target. Most tests of tanks doing proper rotations at the higher levels typically eclipsed dps on relative enmity. If that trend continues, good tanks anyway of either class will not have an issue on single target. AE might be a different story but if they up the damage to PAL's AE that they get at the end level that will make a nice difference as its not just a cone like marauders I believe.
Woolygimp
Bronze Knight of the Realm
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What's the long term viability of this game? Another SWTOR hit max, enjoy leveling, and quit? I really haven't heard or read anything regarding the end-game and that's why I say that.
I leveled up to 9 or so and wasn't impressed by anything, but people say it gets better so I may give it another go... Just not in the mood to hit cap and quit.
I leveled up to 9 or so and wasn't impressed by anything, but people say it gets better so I may give it another go... Just not in the mood to hit cap and quit.
I wouldn't really judge the game until you at least start doing some of the group content, which begins once you finish the story chains at L15.
And Ifrit. You can't miss out on Ifrit before judging this fully, imo. It's not Next Gen Fight or anything, but damn if it doesn't look good on screen.
As to the long-term viability, I've got my fingers crossed since the Producer seems to have a head on his shoulders.
Well if by end game, you mean raiding, I'm pretty sure the game will have that (though some have hinted that it's the rehashed FF end game). And wow, SWTOR, is the only game I can't even remember if it's the only game I haven't hit the cap or not. Frankly not remembering if I did or not just bothers me.
Edit: I actually liked 1-15 in the original, quit shortly after that, but the quest lines were pretty good and the atmosphere/visuals immersed me enough to want to play more.. if it wasn't a chore to play after that. So I couldn't be more excited after hearing it gets better after that.
does the archer/ranger class have to make/buy ammo like ff11 or is it unlimited ammo ala wow?
Byr
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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noone has seen end game yet. We know there will be 2 raids available from the start that were ported over from the first ffxiv and another to come in one of the first patches. The devs promise everything will be good....of course a dev promising that is kind of a warning sign in and of itself.
Did 1.0 even have (24 man) raids? There was 8-man (full party) content, but the Crystal Tower and Bahamut's Labyrinth are new to 2.0 are they not?
@Laedrun - Unlimited ammo, iirc. Never touched Archer, but there isn't support for arrows in crafting or on the vendors.