How would you re-socialize MMOs?
- Thread starter TragedyAnn_sl
- Start date
Flipmode
EQOA Refugee
- 2,091
- 312
Srathor
Blackwing Lair Raider
- 1,849
- 2,968
+Rate players you group with for xp. You group with some dudes in a dungeon, you give the tank a rating on tankyness, dps, knowledge of fights and leadership. Rate the healer on the same with healyness.
Reward people for playing with new people too. More xp, higher % of loot drops for # of new members in the group.
Have multiple rankings of friends list with how you rated someone near their name and how often you grouped with them.
Have the ability to invite people in your friends lists cross server/faction for adventure / grouping/raiding/pvp.
Have a macro system or ability system that lets folks deadhead / que some abilities, but at less effective than playing the button mash game. Like a .5 second longer GCD if you macro it.
Make tactical combat for short term fights, but strategic choices for how to play the character. Not 85 buttons to mash. Tie together alts on the same account or have the one character can learn everything just not use it all at the same time thing, kinda like GW2 crafting or FF14 class system.
Let people mark rivals and bounties in pvp. Get people communicating even if it is with an ax to the face.
Hard overworld content, that requires groups, that has good loot, and can not be outleveled too much. (See downranking like GW2) Better xp in groups, than solo. Better loot too.
Ways to get people together. Character based ports and summons, Poker games and other minigame/gambling in inns and brothels.
Few artificial limits to playing with friends. If you want to bring 50 friends to a raid do so. Abilities can be added to bosses and trash per player increases.
The ability to ally with guilds. To build faction / reputations with pc and npc guilds/ political factions. See Tera and thier governership positions. Or Aion and their keep taking.
Reward people for playing with new people too. More xp, higher % of loot drops for # of new members in the group.
Have multiple rankings of friends list with how you rated someone near their name and how often you grouped with them.
Have the ability to invite people in your friends lists cross server/faction for adventure / grouping/raiding/pvp.
Have a macro system or ability system that lets folks deadhead / que some abilities, but at less effective than playing the button mash game. Like a .5 second longer GCD if you macro it.
Make tactical combat for short term fights, but strategic choices for how to play the character. Not 85 buttons to mash. Tie together alts on the same account or have the one character can learn everything just not use it all at the same time thing, kinda like GW2 crafting or FF14 class system.
Let people mark rivals and bounties in pvp. Get people communicating even if it is with an ax to the face.
Hard overworld content, that requires groups, that has good loot, and can not be outleveled too much. (See downranking like GW2) Better xp in groups, than solo. Better loot too.
Ways to get people together. Character based ports and summons, Poker games and other minigame/gambling in inns and brothels.
Few artificial limits to playing with friends. If you want to bring 50 friends to a raid do so. Abilities can be added to bosses and trash per player increases.
The ability to ally with guilds. To build faction / reputations with pc and npc guilds/ political factions. See Tera and thier governership positions. Or Aion and their keep taking.
start off by eliminating all instancing
eliminate most methods of fast travel that are not directly linked to other players
eliminate auction houses
eliminate group finders, raid finders etc.
second, build an MMO from the top down. Most content should be at the top where people spend the most time. There should always be content that is just slightly out of reach of almost everyone. This will create a psychological carrot that motivates people to progress.
third, eliminate server transfers, name changes and other methods that help people avoid responsibility for acting like douchebags. Very few people will risk being ostracized from their server after spending 2 years or more slowly progressing a character
eliminate most methods of fast travel that are not directly linked to other players
eliminate auction houses
eliminate group finders, raid finders etc.
second, build an MMO from the top down. Most content should be at the top where people spend the most time. There should always be content that is just slightly out of reach of almost everyone. This will create a psychological carrot that motivates people to progress.
third, eliminate server transfers, name changes and other methods that help people avoid responsibility for acting like douchebags. Very few people will risk being ostracized from their server after spending 2 years or more slowly progressing a character
Cybsled
Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
- 16,565
- 13,069
This. If people would clean the splooge off their rose tinted glasses, they could see that even in EQ1, people looked for ways to cut out players (quad kites, multiboxing, exploits). Half the people I knew just played on their playstation during downtime.
Anything "forced" is going to alienate people. Players need to WANT to do something. Trying to be a MMO-hipster, much like other hipsters, is a path to failure.
So if they are playing their playstation they are not even trying to get a group are they?
I was a wizard so if we want to talk about people going LFG I have served my time. There was plenty to do when I wasn't grouping. I could sit outside KC and rake in the money porting, I could head to Thurgadin and craft, I could hit CS and quad, I could level an alt, I could get on a list...I was always online. Get yourself on a few lists and it was never long before people needed to fill a spot. What I didn't do was sit and play playstation complaining there was nothing to do.
Grim1
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
- 4,866
- 6,822
Just make the game so brutally hard that eveyone dies all the time, and everywhere, if they solo. Make grouping required for surviving, while joining an army is required for success. Presto chango, instant socialization.
Or you can turn the game into a preening fashion show where every girl and gay gamer runs around and jumps for joy for all the new shoes on the market, while complimenting each other on their outfits.
Combine both of those elements and your mmo can call itself a bank.
Or you can turn the game into a preening fashion show where every girl and gay gamer runs around and jumps for joy for all the new shoes on the market, while complimenting each other on their outfits.
Combine both of those elements and your mmo can call itself a bank.
Yea, cause the current generation of game designers are so successful I should strive to be more like them........oh wait.
Cybsled
Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
- 16,565
- 13,069
It's a fallacy to think that all past game designers were successful, as much as it is to consider all current to be unsuccessful (and vice versa). Products do evolve for a reason, though. Discounting nostalgic revivals, by and large most genres have evolved quite a bit (while keeping the "core" more or less intact). This is even moreso the case when the given demographic that uses said product increases. Products typically evolve to suit the tastes of the customer, or the company tries to manipulate customer tastes so that they mesh with their product (ie, sell them something they didn't even know they needed).
However, it becomes a risk when your vision of what you think the customer wants or what you think you can get the customer to like clashes with the reality of the situation. Research in Motion learned this the hard way (the old MMO version of Smartphones). Customer nostalgia is also a fleeting thing, as the novelty quickly wears off once they realized why they got tired with that old model to begin with.
While there is still lessons to be learned, and perhaps features to be resurrected, from old models, trying to dust off last decade's hit and expecting it to last another decade is a delusion.
However, it becomes a risk when your vision of what you think the customer wants or what you think you can get the customer to like clashes with the reality of the situation. Research in Motion learned this the hard way (the old MMO version of Smartphones). Customer nostalgia is also a fleeting thing, as the novelty quickly wears off once they realized why they got tired with that old model to begin with.
While there is still lessons to be learned, and perhaps features to be resurrected, from old models, trying to dust off last decade's hit and expecting it to last another decade is a delusion.
Tuco
I got Tuco'd!
- 45,525
- 73,615
1. Force grouping
2. Remove instancing
3. Add risk into the game (as in, if you fuck up badly enough you could lose your corpse).
4. Don't be afraid of class inter-dependence. Tank + healing + CC + dps works and is better than the chickenshit PVE in GW2.
5. The AH and group finder stuff is fine. If you want to chat with people join a chat room.
2. Remove instancing
3. Add risk into the game (as in, if you fuck up badly enough you could lose your corpse).
4. Don't be afraid of class inter-dependence. Tank + healing + CC + dps works and is better than the chickenshit PVE in GW2.
5. The AH and group finder stuff is fine. If you want to chat with people join a chat room.
Mr Creed
Too old for this shit
- 2,381
- 276
Make mobs soloable but set the difficulty in a way that makes duo/trio play much more efficient (stuff like class synergies or group-only auras). Then make xp an important factor at all stages of the game (AA points), the majority of it comes from kills, and dont have bite-sized quests that require you to chase specific objectives then return to town. All this encourage you to group up with the stranger that is soloing next to you, to improve your own progress, and removes reasons to break up that group for quest turn-ins or the like. If you want the game can still have peon tasks (please dont call that quests) like collecting gnoll ears, just dont require a return to the npc every 10 minutes. In that regard EQ belt/bone quests worked fine. WoW did actually have areas that played better as a duo/trio at release but could still be done solo with some difficulty, like every ogre mound or that troll city in hinterlands. The thing is that players take the path of least resistance so if you want them to group, make that difficulty the baseline everywhere.
wolfshead
Molten Core Raider
- 18
- 6
The problem is that these days with the ubiquity of "multi-player" video games most people aren't naturally drawn to a MMORPG primarily to socialize. Most come for the adventure first. What ends up happening is that socialization and camaraderie that results from adventuring ends up being far more important and lasting in the long run. Social relationships within MMOs are the glue that help to retain subscribers as well.
Another problem is that because of the success of World of Warcraft MMORPGs have travelled on an absurd tangent of achievement centric design to the exclusion of pretty much all else. Back in the old days, there was an inherent appreciation for Richard Bartle'sideathat virtual worlds and MUDs were a balanced composite ofadventurers, explorers, socializersandkillers. WoW destroyed that relationship which is why the MMO industry is in the sad predicament it is today.
Another problem is that because of the success of World of Warcraft MMORPGs have travelled on an absurd tangent of achievement centric design to the exclusion of pretty much all else. Back in the old days, there was an inherent appreciation for Richard Bartle'sideathat virtual worlds and MUDs were a balanced composite ofadventurers, explorers, socializersandkillers. WoW destroyed that relationship which is why the MMO industry is in the sad predicament it is today.
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
- 37,961
- 14,508
I remember a time when I was forced to group and play with others in order to advance (in levels, gear, story, etc). When MMO's turned into single player games is when they started to suck. Really it's that simple. All these devs with their crazy new scheme to re-invent the fucking wheel when all they need to do is go out to the backyard and find that rusty wheel someone left in the grass and use that as their model.
FUCKING IDIOTS.
FUCKING IDIOTS.
Big_w_powah
Trakanon Raider
- 1,887
- 750
WoW had a lot of good ideas; You could get baseline gear from the baseline quests/mobs, but group got gear was better, for one. However, the fallacy in that is every slot is replaced so frequently that the group-blue/purple gear was only 5-10 levels above the green gear you could get.
Bring back this idea, but make gear spread far more thinly, or upgrade far slower with a much bigger gap between solo and group gear, and it goes a long way in encouraging grouping.
Bring back this idea, but make gear spread far more thinly, or upgrade far slower with a much bigger gap between solo and group gear, and it goes a long way in encouraging grouping.
Big_w_powah
Trakanon Raider
- 1,887
- 750
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
- 37,961
- 14,508
Yeah the datamining is shitty, but I don't think it's a problem with games but the fact that people are smart enough to be able to datamine this stuff. I don't think you can get rid of it so easily, if at all.