Investing General Discussion

TJT · Jul 1, 2020

LachiusTZ said:
It's almost like you don't understand Tesla at all

I've never invested in TSLA myself. I guess I probably should have but working at GM for 6 years and understanding very well the kind of finances that go into the auto industry I just steered clear of it.

The most compelling argument about TSLA's valuation is entirely around their production just like comrade here is saying. TSLA has never once met a production quota of any kind. But they have an astronomical stock valuation despite being a boutique car dealer for all intents and purposes.

Being cool is not a cashflow.

Jysin · Jul 1, 2020

TJT said:
...Being cool is not a cashflow.

Laughs in Steve Jobs

Hateyou · Jul 1, 2020

I’ve never understood the Tesla hype either. Even if somehow they ramped up to match the production and revenue of a real car company, the electrical grid of the USA a could not handle everyone charging their cars after work, so it wouldn’t even be feasible for them to sell that many. The automotive industry is so damn competitive that just a decline of a few % is enough for them to axe entire models, or in last years case, their entire sedan lines. How Tesla is worth so gd much without producing much, or even having a glimmer of hope of ever producing much blows my mind. If they were licensing their technology out en masse maybe I could see it but I thought I remember reading they aren’t, and maybe even give some of their shit out for free? Maybe thinking of one of his other companies.

It really does seem to be valuation purely on being cool.

Sanrith Descartes · Jul 1, 2020

Wingz said:
Going to buy some OPES stock and see how it plays over the next while. .It is a "blank check" company but they're helping with food in this case.

Gonna merge with BurgerFi so they can expand. I went to one traveling and was really nice. Described as Chick-Fil-a customer service but for burgers.

OPES Acquisition Corp. Announces Definitive Agreement to Combine with BurgerFi

BurgerFi is one of the nation’s fastest-growing better burger concepts and is expected to trade on Nasdaq under the ticker symbol BFI upon closing of the business combination. “BurgerFi’s position within the rapidly expanding ‘better-burger’ space combined with its technology-driven business...

finance.yahoo.com

I can totally see people eating there and this taking off as things open back up.

My advice: I have made some good money with SPACS. The BurgerFi thing I think isn't going to payoff. A couple of reasons.. 1 it is a crowded space. 2 the chain has never really exploded and achieved real critical mass. 3 it isnt "sexy" in terms of the DDTG/Robinhood crowd in terms of it catching fire.

Some other alternatives to look at...

LCA merging with Golden Nugget Online Casino.

NFIN non-binding letter of intent to merfe with Triterras Fintech. They have and host proprietary commodities trading software and have positive EBITDA (87m) on 4.1 billion in transaction volume in 2019.

SHLL is currently pulling back from a spike up. It is in the EV space with Hyliion who votes on the merger end of the summer.

Also wait for Bill Ackmans Godzilla SPAC "Pershing Square Tontine" will trade under PSTH.U

Just my thoughts.

Sanrith Descartes · Jul 1, 2020

its Bobby Bonilla day. This is a baseball thing but its really a finance thing. It shows the power of compounding interest and patience.

Bobby Bonilla Day: This retired baseball player’s contract is the perfect example of the power of compounding

See how former Mets player Bobby Bonilla turned $5.9 million into nearly $30 million.

www.marketwatch.com

Sanrith Descartes · Jul 1, 2020

TJT said:
I've never invested in TSLA myself. I guess I probably should have but working at GM for 6 years and understanding very well the kind of finances that go into the auto industry I just steered clear of it.

The most compelling argument about TSLA's valuation is entirely around their production just like comrade here is saying. TSLA has never once met a production quota of any kind. But they have an astronomical stock valuation despite being a boutique car dealer for all intents and purposes.

Being cool is not a cashflow.

A year ago I was laughing at TSLA. I was thinking and trading under the old school mentality of financial statements and fundamentals. I laughed at TSLA investors.

I have evolved my trading views to accept a fundamental shift in investing. I now factor in momentum, millennial trends of "green energy, avocado toast, 8$ coffee, save the whales and assorted other shit) into the equation.

This change in philosophy is why I made almost 300% on NKLA, 50% on SBUX, and more 100% so far on SHLL in the last 3 months. If enough investors like something, that is all that matters... until they stop liking it. On the right pullback I would consider buying TSLA now because so many people are willing to buy it. I will also invest in SpaceX the day it goes public. Be contrary can pay at certain times but I have also learned to not fight the tide.

Flobee · Jul 1, 2020

Hateyou said:
It really does seem to be valuation purely on being cool.

I mean Tesla is a battery company. Look into autobidder + Energy Web Foundation to see the kind of stuff TSLA is quietly participating in. I don't own TSLA, and they are probably overpriced, but the value isn't entirely unwarranted.

Plus anything that has a green/renewable flavor gets everyone's dick hard in 2020.

TJT · Jul 1, 2020

Only thing I am waiting on to invest this July is the Snowflake IPO later this month. I'll be putting like $5k on that.

Sanrith Descartes · Jul 1, 2020

PFE reported 100% of those in blind trial who got the vaccine developed antibodies. Put your hopium pants on.

BioNTech's stock halted, Pfizer shares jump on promising COVID-19 vaccine data

BioNTech's undefined stock was halted and shares of Pfizer Inc. undefined gained 4.7% in trading on Wednesday morning after the companies said that all 24...

www.marketwatch.com

Araysar · Jul 1, 2020

Hateyou said:
I’ve never understood the Tesla hype either. Even if somehow they ramped up to match the production and revenue of a real car company, the electrical grid of the USA a could not handle everyone charging their cars after work

Is this something that was actually studied? First time Im hearing of it

Araysar · Jul 1, 2020

The TSLA thing is amusing, and clearly there is a lot of future upside to Tesla that would justify people being very bullish on it such as new battery technology that could be used in hundreds of other industries, autopilot technology, various other automotive car features that other automakers will attempt to copy, expansion into commercial trucks and semi trucks, and generally being the only company that is driving the momentum towards inevitable widescale adoption of EVs as the standard for passenger vehicles

But its still a little unbelievable to see a boutique EV company matching the valuation of Toyota.

TJT · Jul 1, 2020

Araysar said:
Is this something that was actually studied? First time Im hearing of it

The more logical constraint is if Teslas became like 5% of all traffic in Texas the infrastructure to support them simply wouldn't exist and people would inevitably be inconvenienced driving them.

TJT · Jul 1, 2020

Araysar said:
The TSLA thing is amusing, and clearly there is a lot of future upside to Tesla that would justify people being very bullish on it such as new battery technology that could be used in hundreds of other industries, autopilot technology, various other automotive car features that other automakers will attempt to copy, expansion into commercial trucks and semi trucks, and generally being the only company that is driving the momentum towards inevitable widescale adoption of EVs as the standard for passenger vehicles

But its still a little unbelievable to see a boutique EV company matching the valuation of Toyota.

Yeah but that goes back to infrastructure. In order to reach that level of adoption you need to either convince the majority of people that electric is better. To do so it also has to be at least equally as affordable. On top of that if you're recharge stations aren't as numerous and as efficient as gas stations, which took a century of automobile buildup to reach today's level of saturation, then its a shitty vehicle/power solution for the masses to own.

Pescador · Jul 1, 2020

Sanrith Descartes said:
PFE reported 100% of those in blind trial who got the vaccine developed antibodies. Put your hopium pants on.

BioNTech's stock halted, Pfizer shares jump on promising COVID-19 vaccine data

BioNTech's undefined stock was halted and shares of Pfizer Inc. undefined gained 4.7% in trading on Wednesday morning after the companies said that all 24...

www.marketwatch.com

If you are following vaccine stocks, I would own BioNTech (BNTX) since they developed the vaccines and licensed to Pfizer. Obviously Pfizer can benefit from all this but I think BNTX is the one that can really explode.

I'd also expect MRNA to report their complete phase 1 data soon (possibly coupled with announcement of their phase 3 initiation), and NVAX will also likely have a Ph1 announcement this month.

I expect all of them to report good binding and neutralization seroconversion rates, so it could be a wild ride up and down, especially as the media realizes these titers don't tell the whole story.

Hateyou · Jul 1, 2020

Araysar said:
Is this something that was actually studied? First time Im hearing of it

Not that I am aware of. I’m just basing it off of various stories I’ve read about electrical grids in the US operating at capacity during times of high electrical usage like during heat waves and everyone running AC full blast. California has brown outs sometimes due to this? Convert the amount of energy used by gasoline cars to everyone plugging in their electrical cars to charge at the same time and that capacity would need to be expanded a lot.

I could be way off base, and if Tesla and other car companies continue to have the limp dick electric production numbers they have now maybe our grid can expand faster than they can put cars on the road.

LachiusTZ · Jul 1, 2020

I got some of my TSLA at 300, and the rest at 500. No way in hell I'd buy it at 1100. Lol Was watching it before, waiting for it to fall so buy some, which hasnt happened since I had the cash and started watching it.

Personally, I bought when the signs pointed to TSLA having solved the visual driving system. Which was last fall. There was no official statement, but over the course of a couple months it was indicated they had. That was at 300.

Its not really a car company, its a tech company that builds cars. So for infrastructure, all that can be solved with software updates changing how much is pulled to charge the car and when its pulled. You dont really get gas that often, so its not like DFW needs 1500 charging stations. There are already enough to cross the country, its just a headache.

Re: visual driving. Musk spoke about "chasing the 9s". The sign to ME they had hit the inflection point was when TSLA started its insurance company. That told me they had a good enough tech that insuring internally was beneficial. That should tell you all you need to know. Once the finances of it are proven, robo taxi going live is the next step.

And robo taxi is what all the gamblers like myself are banking on.

And TSLA is the ONLY player in self driving. The only one. Look at miles driven, and tech being used. So TSLA was the only bet you could make for self driving, and b/c humans suck at driving, self driving is inevitable.

Wish I had bought more TSLA instead of guns . . . well maybe. Guns might be priceless soon. Lol

Furry · Jul 1, 2020

TJT said:
The more logical constraint is if Teslas became like 5% of all traffic in Texas the infrastructure to support them simply wouldn't exist and people would inevitably be inconvenienced driving them.

Even out in hillbilly land there's some tesla charging stations free of charge at stores, not that I've ever seen one plugged in.

Battery technology is definitely the gateway to EV cars being in wider use. We're currently at 180wh/kg, and EV cars provide acceptable preformance in some scenarios. At 500wh/kg EV batteries will likely be clearly superior in terms of typical daily drivers. You'll be able to lighten the cars up and keep a significantly higher range that is currently offered, which will help keep the batteries in better condition by keeping them at optimal discharges ect. Just about the only situation you wouldn't prefer EV at that point is likely long-haul trucking.

Those sort of batteries exist already, but the problem is figuring out a battery with that energy density that is cheap enough and easy enough to make that it can be put into mass production. Plenty of companies are working on it, so someone will have a battery that good or better eventually. We're probably 5-10 years away still, though, but it's hard to know when a Eureka moment will happen in research projects like this.

LachiusTZ · Jul 1, 2020

Furry said:
Even out in hillbilly land there's some tesla charging stations free of charge at stores, not that I've ever seen one plugged in.

Battery technology is definitely the gateway to EV cars being in wider use. We're currently at 180wh/kg, and EV cars provide acceptable preformance in some scenarios. At 500wh/kg EV batteries will likely be clearly superior in terms of typical daily drivers. You'll be able to lighten the cars up and keep a significantly higher range that is currently offered, which will help keep the batteries in better condition by keeping them at optimal discharges ect. Just about the only situation you wouldn't prefer EV at that point is likely long-haul trucking.

Those sort of batteries exist already, but the problem is figuring out a battery with that energy density that is cheap enough and easy enough to make that it can be put into mass production. Plenty of companies are working on it, so someone will have a battery that good or better eventually. We're probably 5-10 years away still, though, but it's hard to know when a Eureka moment will happen in research projects like this.

I think TSLA is already there. At 800 I was going to option the fuck out of an April battery day. Now? Lol . . . dont think I can even afford the fucking option on battery day this fall.

Musk floated the idea of TSLA planes again a few months ago, and I forgot the wh/kg req'd for it, but that was another "ok so they might have solved that".

And the million mile battery etc.

Dont get me wrong, its a gamble, but its not as insane or bad a gamble as most think.

Flobee · Jul 1, 2020

RE: Tesla

I wanted to provide a little data regarding why I think they will be big players in the future energy market regardless of how the cars pan out. Slight derail:

Autobidder | Tesla Support

Autobidder is a real-time trading and control platform that performs market bidding and dispatch control for value maximization against business goals.

www.tesla.com

Autobidder provides independent power producers, utilities and capital partners the ability to autonomously monetize battery assets. Autobidder is a real-time trading and control platform that provides value-based asset management and portfolio optimization, enabling owners and operators to configure operational strategies that maximize revenue according to their business objectives and risk preferences.

Working in conjunction with a peer-to-peer energy market run through the Energy Web Foundation blockchain.

Energy Web Decentralized Operating System - Energy Web

www.energyweb.org

EW-DOS supports two primary use cases: 1) clean energy and carbon emissions traceability and 2) using distributed energy resources to increase grid flexibility. EW-DOS leverages self-sovereign decentralized identifiers, a series of decentralized registries, messaging services, and integrations with legacy information technology (IT) systems to facilitate transactions between billions of assets, customers, grid operators, service providers, and retailers.

Translation being that they are trying to create a decentralized network for energy sharing between individuals and corporations that produce energy. Using Tesla solar panels and producing excess energy? Using Autobidder you can negotiate the price for your excess energy using a live market and sell it to your neighbor. Essentially lifting the monopoly on energy production and distribution. The current monopoly is pretty rough, if you aren't aware take a look at the prices that CA for example charges for "selling back" your excess energy vs what they sell that same energy to other customers for.

May be vapor. May not work as advertised. Still huge upside potential if it pans out.

Araysar · Jul 1, 2020

Furry said:
Even out in hillbilly land there's some tesla charging stations free of charge at stores, not that I've ever seen one plugged in.

Battery technology is definitely the gateway to EV cars being in wider use. We're currently at 180wh/kg, and EV cars provide acceptable preformance in some scenarios. At 500wh/kg EV batteries will likely be clearly superior in terms of typical daily drivers. You'll be able to lighten the cars up and keep a significantly higher range that is currently offered, which will help keep the batteries in better condition by keeping them at optimal discharges ect. Just about the only situation you wouldn't prefer EV at that point is likely long-haul trucking.

Those sort of batteries exist already, but the problem is figuring out a battery with that energy density that is cheap enough and easy enough to make that it can be put into mass production. Plenty of companies are working on it, so someone will have a battery that good or better eventually. We're probably 5-10 years away still, though, but it's hard to know when a Eureka moment will happen in research projects like this.

I think EV is perfect for long haul trucking. Not only is the much bigger chassis able to accommodate more batteries, and bigger batteries that would increase range -- but the government mandated rest periods offer the opportunities to recharge those batteries for several hours at a time.

Investing General Discussion

Mr. Poopybutthole

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Not Great, Not Terrible

Veteran of a thousand threadban wars

Veteran of a thousand threadban wars

Veteran of a thousand threadban wars

Vyemm Raider

Mr. Poopybutthole

Veteran of a thousand threadban wars

Loser Araysar

Chief Russia Correspondent / Stock Pals CEO

Loser Araysar

Chief Russia Correspondent / Stock Pals CEO

Mr. Poopybutthole

Mr. Poopybutthole

Trakanon Raider

Not Great, Not Terrible

Rogue Deathwalker Box

WoW Office

Rogue Deathwalker Box

Vyemm Raider

Loser Araysar

Chief Russia Correspondent / Stock Pals CEO